.357 mag delivers a powerful demonstration

[sandy4570]

Great thread ,I am having a second though about my S&W 19 that I bought couple months ago

 

[OhioPaints]

Great thread ,I am having a second though about my S&W 19 that I bought couple months ago

Why is that?

Ken

 

[1911Tuner]

Where can I get some of those 158 gr. 1450/1550 fps loads?

Unless you can find an old lot of it at a gun show or through an ammo dealer, you'll have to handload it...very carefully...and you may not be able to duplicate it exactly. Winchester and Remington used non-cannister grade powders for it.

I could duplicate it with older lots of Hercules 2400, but not with modern lots of the powder. I can get close...but I can't dulicate it. Pressures spike too early. H-110 and 296 may be your only option, and they don't do well with cast bullets, as a rule.

 

[Reddbecca]

Unless you can find an old lot of it at a gun show or through an ammo dealer, you'll have to handload it...very carefully...and you may not be able to duplicate it exactly. Winchester and Remington used non-cannister grade powders for it.

I could duplicate it with older lots of Hercules 2400, but not with modern lots of the powder. I can get close...but I can't dulicate it. Pressures spike too early. H-110 and 296 may be your only option, and they don't do well with cast bullets, as a rule.

I understand the chamber pressure is pretty high up there. Would a modern revolver like the Ruger New Model Blackhawk be able to digest such loads without risk of critical failure?

 

[DWFan]

Actually, Tuner, the original 158gr load gave closer to 1500 fps in my 6.5" Blackhawk. I want to say right around 1485, (1487 sticks in my head for some reason), but I don't trust my memory. That was in the early 70's. and yeah, it was with the older version of 2400.
Redd, the only thing I can say is to work your way up to it. The Blackhawk I had back then didn't have a problem, but I didn't shoot that load all that often either. The EAA Bounty Hunter, according to Paco Kelly, can handle both the 158gr load and the longer 173gr load as well.

http://www.gunblast.com/Paco_WineRoses.htm

 

[tasco 74]

this reminds me of the exchange at the wal-wart gun rack last year when a younger guy was going on about .460 that and 454 that... the old guy at the gun counter and i have known each other for awhile he used to work at another gun-sports store... i listened for a bit then just grinned alittle and said all you need is a .357 ...that will take down anything in no. america... the old guy behind the counter just kinda grinned alittle him self and said .. he's right!

 

[Squidward]

Itsa keeper

I took my 686 to the range Sunday; shot some .38 and then whipped out the .357. Its just a handful of stainless steel hapiness.

 

[LightningMan]

Hello, I have been following this thread off & on and find it an interesting read and I was wondering about how effective one of my favorite hot loads would be against the BG. This load is listed on the Alliant powder web site, it is at the bottom of the page for 110 grain JHP using Blue Dot & mag. primers. See-----> http://www.alliantpowder.com/reload...gtypeid=1&weight=110&shellid=1015&bulletid=24
It is supposed to give a muzzle velocity of 2040 fps out of a 5.6 barrel. I have fired these out of my Ruger Vaquaro's with no problem. There is a lot of muzzle flash and plenty of recoil. Anyone, tested this load on gelatin or any other unscientific tests? Thanks LM.
PS. this same load in listed in Modern Reloading by Richard Lee.

 

[roscoe]

DoubleTap gets 158 grains up to 1540 fps in a 6" barrel. That sounds just about there.

 

[1911Tuner]

DoubleTap gets 158 grains up to 1540 fps in a 6" barrel. That sounds just about there.

Yep, it does. I'd be interested in the powder they're using to get it there...and what the average working pressures are. More interesting would be in seeing how consistent the velocities are from shot to shot.

That's the problem with using a slow ball powder to put the velocities into the stratosphere without dangerous pressures. They're not consistent.

I once got some frightening speeds with Speer's 160-grain half-jacketed soft points...basically a jacketed SWC...and Olin 296 powder. The extreme spread in a 10-shot test group was nearly a hundred fps, though.

 

[TimboKhan]

357 Magnum never was and still is no joke. Most versatile cartridge in terms of cost, performance, platforms etc. imo. The .38 special angle makes this even better.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. I could make do with nothing but a .357, truth be told.

 

[sandy4570]

Why is that?

Ken

Don't worry Ken it happen everytime I buy new .357 revolver ,I made a purchase , filled out all the paper work , got finger print , trigger lock and what not and I walked out the store thinking "darn it , I should get those fancy polymer 10 shot high cap pistol with all this paper work !"

 

[kmrcstintn]

hhhmmmm....a .40 bottom feeder or a .357 mag wheelie...let's see;

right now my .357 wheelie is loaded with the popular & proven 158gr lswchp .38 spl +p for HD; when I head to the hunting camp, it'll have 2 rounds of snake shot & 4 rounds of 158gr jhp .357 mag for working around the buildings; when I start climbing the hill or going into the gulley in the woods to check for deer sign & the mineral blocks, I'll switch to 1 round of snake shot & 5 rounds of Federal CastCore 180gr hardened leadheads for bear protection; those are just the protection loads & not the target loads that I shoot at the range

I'll stick with my medium caliber magnum revolver & let someone else have the .40 bottom feeder that basically is stuck with fmj, reloaded leadhead target loads, hollowpoints, and snakeshot if required

 

[Jenrick]

Well today me and several friends went shooting. One target was a large rock (about a baseball size) of some kind of crystal. We set it up and backed off to 25yds or so and commenced fire. First round to impact it was a .40 S&W. Pretty pattern on the surface from the lead spray, and a scuff mark, but no damage. Next a 9mm, the same though smaller mark. Lastly my .357 sig, same as the .40.

Hmm this will not due. The suggestion of bringing out AR's is aired. I tell them to hold on a second...

.357 mag out of my S&W 19-6 6" should do the trick I figured. One round of JHP, not even FMJ, and the rock exploded. Shards of crystal everywhere (don't try at home and where safety glasses). We then proceed to shoot more rocks with the same results. .357 mag, WAY faster then a sledgehammer.


-Jenrick

 

[cslinger]

Probably not such a good idea to be shooting at rocks.....just a thought.

 

[Jenrick]

I agreed in general about shooting rocks. However we were 25+ yds away, all had eye protection, and the rock was inset into a cleft in the sandhill we were shooting into. Really no where for a ricochet to go.

However as noted previously, do not attempt.

-Jenrick

 

[easyrider604]

Probably not such a good idea to be shooting at rocks.....just a thought.

What's the difference between rocks and steel Bianchi plates? or steel pepper poppers? We shoot those even closer than 25 yds. BTW, I've been by a couple of richochets

 

[KD5NRH]

Every big game animal on earth has been taken with a .357 Magnum.

Anybody who hunts cape buffalo with a .357 doesn't really need the gun; he can just intimidate them into butchering and cooking themselves.

That, or he's crazy.

 

[Z71]

I once arrived at the rifle range just as the hoopala was dying down over a betting shot fired from a Ruger Service-Six.

One fellow had bet another that he couldn't shoot a 200yd bullseye with the .357 Ruger. Apparently the guy with the Ruger had been practicing just such long shots and did it in one shot!

I called BS on the deal, and was promptly set straight by the witneses!

I later ended up with that very Ruger revolver, and it is a damn good shooting pistol. However I've got no long range talent with a handgun.

Yes, The .357 magnum is one of the best handgun rounds out there. I own a S&W 686, a Ruger Service-six, and a Desert Eagle in the caliber. Like them all.

I killed a 300# feral hog with the 4" S&W, and it may as well have been a .30-06 as far as the hog was concerned!

People brag on the .45acp, but it's several notches down the ladder from the .357 magnum in my opinion.

 

[bikerdoc]

for suburban carry i use my nine when the stakes go up - the big city- I carry a 357

 

[Zoogster]

I have read that Franz Ferdinand was wearing body armor when he was assassinated.

That was very rare expensive silk body armor.

That was hardly in use to my knowledge.

Such body armor had existed for quite some time, but was extremely expensive, only the most wealthy of individuals could have afforded it.

Most body armor was used by criminals and was makeshift armor of various materials sewn together in many layers.

Just how much of the .357's effectiveness against human targets relies on bullet expansion?

I would say a significant amount if comparing it to wider diameter defensive calibers.
Obviously shot placement is the key concern.
However there is more penetration than necessary against human targets, meaning you have more recoil and penetration for a .357 dimater round than you need. That means you are putting a lot more energy into making a .357 diameter wound that penetrates to the required depth than necessary.

With reliable expansion it offsets the unnecessary energy and puts it to good use expanding very well.
You end up putting that energy into creating a larger diameter wound, that is more on par with the energy of the round in a man size target. Unlike with many rounds the expansion of the light .357 rounds is very reliable. They impact at such high velocity that the impact itself often begins the expansion.

The expansion can be greatly controlled with the use of various rounds, and you can gain significant penetration or significant expansion, leaving you with an extremely versatile firearm.
The penetration available is so high that you can use the .357 Magnum to take most game if you really wanted to with rounds that are very heavy and do not expand. Of course shot placement becomes even more important than with a larger caliber.
Or you can reduce that penetration as much as possible with rapidly expanding light ammo at high velocities and have a very effective man stopper.

 

[2ndamd]

I know what y'all mean.
The .357 is a great round. It can do so many things so very well.

 

[pps]

Where can I get some of those 158 gr. 1450/1550 fps loads?

Double tap and Buffalo Bore.

The DT's get close to 1500fps with the 158gr Gold Dot from my 5" 627.

Should leave a bit of a mark.

 

[RobertFBurnett]

Quote:
I have read that Franz Ferdinand was wearing body armor when he was assassinated.
That was very rare expensive silk body armor.

That was hardly in use to my knowledge.

Such body armor had existed for quite some time, but was extremely expensive, only the most wealthy of individuals could have afforded it.

There were also accounts of the Russian Romanov family wearing their fortune in diamonds sewn into their undergarments. It acted as an unintentional body armor. But the Bolsheviks just shot and hacked them to pieces as best they could not knowing about the armor...prolonging an already horrible execution.

RFB

 

[XDKingslayer]

I have read that Franz Ferdinand was wearing body armor when he was assassinated.

Ferdinand was shot in the neck, making his body armor useless.