357 Sig/40 S&W comparison

[loadedround]

I'm considering buying a new Sig semi auto and would like to know if anyone has some up to date information on the terminal energy/stopping power comparing the 357 Sig to the 40 S&W? The 357 Sig really has my interest these days.

 

[PeterUSCG]

I usually only read these, but I'm curious if this will do to you what it did to me. When the Coast Guard switched to .40's I made the point we should go with .357sig instead. An old Gunners Mate Chief looked at me and said, "That's just 9mm +P." Right or wrong, for some reason that statement has stuck with me for years.

If you subscribe to American Rifleman, there is an interesting article about stopping power in the most recent edition. I don't think they tested .357sig though.

 

[M2 Carbine]

I have several 40 S&W pistols. Powerful round.

I recently came by a Glock 33 (.357 SIG).
I've been shooting and trying out different factory and handloads in the G33.
Even with that short barrel pistol the .357 SiG round is very impressive.

From doing nothing but backyard shooting of both rounds I think I'll look for some more guns for the .357 SIG round.

 

[One_Jackal]

What is there to compare? The only thing a 40 cal beats the 357 sig at is cheap ammo. You can find loads for the 357 sig that have a muzzle velocity of close to 2000 fps. The only downside to the 357 sig is most pistols that are chambered for it are to light. A semi auto is no faster than a single action revolver when the gun whips over your head every shot.

 

[ATLDave]

Do you want light-and-fast or heavier-and-slower (but neither as heavy nor as slow as a .45ACP)? Those who believe handgun bullets can only ever poke holes will opt for the latter (i.e., the .40). Those who believe handgun bullets can sometimes produce shock effects that are related to speed or energy may well choose the former (here, the .357).

 

[silversport]

357 SiG is as much 9mm +P as .40 S&W is 10mm light...neither is true...both are as fine as any other handgun bullet design out there...if there was truly something that was best...we'd all be using it...

Bill

 

[Skribs]

"Stopping power" is a myth, and at the velocity these two are running, there isn't going to be much effect from the "energy", moreso than just the penetration and expanded caliber.

.357 sig is going to be accurate at longer distances, and should you need barrier penetration (with the appropriate ammo) it will do a better job than .40.
.40 S&W will make bigger holes.

For my applications, I do not need the .357 sig round. It has the same capacity as the .40 and makes smaller holes. If I wanted to go to a smaller caliber (i.e. 9) I would do so to facilitate cheaper ammunition, greater capacity, and milder recoil, traits which the .357 does not have.

 

[Fishbed77]

The only downside to the 357 sig is most pistols that are chambered for it are too light.

I agree whole-heartedly with this. There is nothing pleasant about shooting a Glock 31 or 33.

In a practical sense, I am am not conviced that the .357 SIG offers enough benefits over a good modern 9mm +P cartridge to offset its many drawbacks.

 

[Spammy_H]

On a sidenote - does anyone reload .357 Sig - I was wondering if there were any unique issues to reloading a pistol cartridge that has a bottleneck-looking case.

 

[easyg]

The 357Sig does carry a little more energy than the .40, but I don't think that there is enough difference between the two rounds to really make a difference self defense wise.

I have great respect for the both the .40 and the 357Sig.
But after carrying and shooting my Glock 27, often swapping out the .40 barrel for the .357Sig barrel, I decided that both calibers were just a bit too much for such a small pistol.

I traded it for a Glock 26 and have no regrets.
Yes, the 9mm is not as powerful as the .40 or the 357Sig, but the 9mm is still plenty powerful enough IMO.
and my follow up shots are quicker and more accurate with the 9mm, even firing 9mm+P.

 

[jim243]

when the gun whips over your head every shot

What? Time for myth busters. No more recoil than the 40 S&W. More muzzle blast and noise but the same recoil. You want more muzzle flip use a 357 Mag that will work.

For the un-informed a 357 Sig is a 40 S&W case necked down to 9mm it is a bottle necked pistol cartrage. Same sized case just pushing a lighter bullet (124 grain 9mm) at a hell of a lot faster speed 1,350 to 1,400 fps.

does anyone reload .357 Sig - I was wondering if there were any unique issues to reloading

Yes, there is. Case neck is very short for a bottle neck and only a very few 9mm bullets will give you the proper neck tension to avoid bullet set back and over pressure. Hornady XTP's are ones that work well.

Jim

 

[AK103K]

There is nothing pleasant about shooting a Glock 31 or 33.

You must not like the 17 or 26 either.

I had a 31 with a spare 9mm barrel. I couldnt tell the difference between 357SIG and 9mm +P+, or even my "warm" 9mm reloads for that matter.

There is a lot of hype about the 357SIG, but it really isnt anything but a +P+ 9mm in a different case.

In a practical sense, I am am not conviced that the .357 SIG offers enough benefits over a good modern 9mm +P cartridge to offset its many drawbacks.

I tend to agree and its the main reason I went back to the 9mm. Not that I think the 357SIG really has any drawbacks, other than price.

On a sidenote - does anyone reload .357 Sig - I was wondering if there were any unique issues to reloading a pistol cartridge that has a bottleneck-looking case.

Ive loaded a good bit of it. No real issues and its as easy as anything else to load for.

If you use a .40S&W carbide sizer, you dont need to lube the cases. It adds an extra step, but its less messy.

Bullets can be a challenge. As was mentioned, standard 9mm bullets may or may not work. 125 grain 357SIG specific bullets work best, but can be hard to find and tend to be a little pricey.

If you use a case filling load, like AA #9, you pretty much eliminate the set back and any neck tension issues.

One thing you do need to watch out for is, .getting .40 cases getting mixed in. They will go through the sizing process without any problem, and will come out of the die looking like a 357SIG, but will be "short" in OAL. The cases are also built differently too. Contrary to what you hear, in reality and practice, the 357SIG is not just a necked down .40S&W. I have accidentally shot some that were loaded, and with no issues, but its probably not the best thing to do, especially on a regular basis.

 

[One_Jackal]

What? Time for myth busters. No more recoil than the 40 S&W. More muzzle blast and noise but the same recoil. You want more muzzle flip use a 357 Mag that will work.

For the un-informed a 357 Sig is a 40 S&W case necked down to 9mm it is a bottle necked pistol cartrage. Same sized case just pushing a lighter bullet (124 grain 9mm) at a hell of a lot faster speed 1,350 to 1,400 fps.



Yes, there is. Case neck is very short for a bottle neck and only a very few 9mm bullets will give you the proper neck tension to avoid bullet set back and over pressure. Hornady XTP's are ones that work well.

Jim

I was all to happy to dump a Glock 33 to buy a Ruger Blackhawk convertible. Not only is the Ruger a joy to shoot it is way more accurate than the Glock. I have no idea of how many rounds I have shot through the Blackhawk but I have shot it a lot more in a few months than I ever shot with the Glock in two years. The new owner of the Glock lives two houses down. He tried it out and never shot it again. In fact, he comes here to shoot the Blackhawk.

 

[silversport]

I was turned off by my G27 that had a GLOCK 33 barrel for 357 SiG...this after being a fan of 357 SiG in my P226 and P229 in the caliber...but I moved on...

I have a G23 that I never cared for because of the caliber...picked up a Storm Lake 9mm conversion and the pistol was reborn to me...

...then I picked up a G32 barrel for the G23, some magazines and I found I really like the 357 SiG again...

...don't sell the caliber short because of you G33 experience...

Bill

 

[wristtwister]

I won't attempt to go into a .40 cal/.357 Sig training class, other than to say the .357 Sig is a .40 cal. necked down to a 9MM bullet. I call them "extra crispy", and absolutely love to shoot them. One of the FBI agents who stops in the shop said they stopped shooting the .357 Sig because it was blowing off body parts...that's a good enough recommendation to me...

WT

 

[silversport]

...blowing off body parts...my Dad was told in WWII that if you missed with the .45 ACP you'd spin someone around...nice anecdotes but hardly more than that...

Bill

 

[Ala Tom]

Looking at www.genitron.com and trying many small-size pistols looking for a CC gun, it became obvious that you have to be careful going to a powerful cartridge in a small gun. For me the Glock 26 was acceptible but I have not bother trying the Glock 27 even though I prefer to use .40 caliber. I did get a slightly large gun (Ruger SR40c) for a CC gun and am very happy with it.

I just ordered a .357 barrel for my M&P 40 FS to see what .357 is all about. I suspect that caliber will work fine in the FS M&P platform. Thus I can keep my FS 40 but use the 357 when it seems a good idea. I do not expect to shoot much 357 - just enough to get comfortable with the gun. I'll shoot more 40 from the same gun (same trigger and sight picture) as well as from the smaller Ruger.
I don't have any interest in putting a .357 barrel in the Ruger. It is fine at .40.

I shot the Ruger SR9C and might get one of those some day to be able to shoot 9 mm.

 

[Skribs]

I won't attempt to go into a .40 cal/.357 Sig training class, other than to say the .357 Sig is a .40 cal. necked down to a 9MM bullet. I call them "extra crispy", and absolutely love to shoot them. One of the FBI agents who stops in the shop said they stopped shooting the .357 Sig because it was blowing off body parts...that's a good enough recommendation to me...

Considering .357 Sig is less powerful than .357 Magnum, I'm going to call bullsmeg on this one. People want to make handgun cartridges out to be these laser-beams-of-death when they really aren't (though the 9 and the .40 usually avoid this, .357 sig, 10mm, 5.7, and .45 ACP all succumb to this cultural phenomenon).

Ala Tom, Genitron is nice and all, but it doesn't account for everything. For example, it lists XDm .40 as 7.58 lb. recoil, and LCP as 6.6 lb. recoil. However, my XD just pushes my hand back a bit and is easily recovered. The LCP beats my hand and isn't fun to shoot at the range. The action, as well as the amount of grip you have, affect the felt recoil a lot more than the weight of the gun, IMO.

 

[AK103K]

Considering .357 Sig is less powerful than .357 Magnum,

I think youll find that the 357SIG does in fact mimic the 125 grain 357mag loading that was so popular.

 

[Skribs]

Yes, but I'm also pretty sure that hot magnum rounds are more powerful than hot sig rounds, and that those hot magnum rounds are not throwing body parts...much in the same way that even more powerful rounds like .223 or .308 are not throwing body parts (you don't see that level of damage until you get into the big-bore rifle range).

It's just like the "expert" who worked with them on Shooter who said that a shot from .408 Cheytac at over a mile would hit the body with so much force it would throw body parts a couple hundred feet. I believe it will throw body parts, but not nearly that far.

 

[AK103K]

Flying body parts aside...

The 357MAG boys always chime in that the 357SIG isnt as powerful as the more powerful 357MAG loadings, and in that respect, they are probably right, but they are missing the point. The 357SIG was designed to mimic the most popular 357MAG loading for police and self defense, and it does that.

 

[loadedround]

Thanks for all the good information guys. One point I would like to make is I talked about a Sig pistol and have the comments were about Glocks. Had two of them previously, dumped them and bought real pistols.

 

[Skribs]

People were using their Glocks to talk about the difference between .357 sig and .40 S&W, which was your original question. The .357 sig round isn't magically better in a Sig firearm.

Glocks are real firearms, even if you don't like them.

 

[AK103K]

One point I would like to make is I talked about a Sig pistol and have the comments were about Glocks. Had two of them previously, dumped them and bought real pistols.

Now, now, no need to start that pissing match.

Just for the record, I had 17 SIG's, 5 of which were 357SIG's, and I sold all but two off and bought Glocks. Both makes are as real as they get, you just get more of them, and their accessories for the money with the Glocks.

 

[Robert101]

You can run those power factor numbers all day and the fact remains, as one poster noted, the 357 SIG is a necked down 40 S&W. I don't see the advantage of the 357 SIG. If you want smaller and faster then use it. In the world of physics there is no free lunch. The powder used in the 40 typically exceeds the comparable powder max load in the .357 SIG. So, where is all that extra force coming from? Not...... I'd rather use those 165 and 180 grainers in my 40. Lastly, if I need to shoot really long distances I hope I have access to the 308 LR.