.38 158gr LSWC loads (favorites)

[diananike]

So I've been loading .38 special pretty hot for my Marlin 1894 but I just traded (another pistol not the Marlin) for a .38 special S&W M10-5 revolver. I guess I can't be doing that anymore

I guess my question is I've noticed some pretty disparate info and load data for standard pressure .38 LSWC.
I've got 3 kinds of bullets.

Cactus plains Keith style single grease groove
Hornady bulk pack dry lube knurled
Lee cast Tumble lube

And 4 kinds of powders
Win 231
Red Dot
Blue Dot
And of course.......Unique

seeing as these bullets all have very different bearing surfaces and lube types should I be more careful of pressures with one type of these bullets?
Or is one load pretty much the same behind any of them?

I'm not looking to do anything spectacular just a solid 800-875 fps Factory type load (6" barrel)
I loaded up some 4gr of Win 231 behind the Hornady ones last night but the Hodgdon manual accused this one of being to hot (3.7 max). I did do a bunch of research so I'm sure it's safe it just might be a little on the +P end (or NOT +P according to the excellent article in Handloader this year) What do you think?

 

[ColtPythonElite]

My Speer #14 manual shows 3.8-4.3 to be the range for 231 for a 158 lead bullet in standard .38 Special.

 

[Steve C]

4.5grs of W231 behind Speer 158gr lead bullets is my most common loaded. This borders on +P velocity wise at around 830 fps from a 4" revolver. I'll go up to 4.7grs for +P at 890 to 500 fps.

Recently got hold of 4lbs of Green Dot and really like 3.4gr behind a MBC 158gr LSWC target bullet of 12 BNH hardness.

30 years ago I loaded 3.0grs of Red Dot behind Speer 158gr LSWC and remember it to be a good practice load.

Tried Blue Dot but at .38 spl loadss it wasn't acceptable and would carbon up the outside of the cases.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I also tried Blue Dot with 158 lead...I got lots of unburned powder.

I've loaded alot of 158 gr LSWC using 4.7 gr. of Unique. The FPS is just over 800 out of my six inch gun.

 

[rcmodel]

Since you have it, try 3.5 Red Dot with any of the three bullets mentioned.

It might maybe be considered +P in these kinder gentler times, but just barely.

At any rate I shoot them in old Colts and S&W J-Frames, and have for about a gazillion years.

rc

 

[Hobie]

I load 5 gr. Unique under the 158 gr. bullets.

 

[mdi]

Swaged lead bullets are my least favorite; too soft and usually get leading (if not perfect fit). I use W231 in nearly all my 38 loads lately, usually around 4.0 gr. for a 150 - 158 gr. bullet.

 

[diananike]

Wow thanks for all the good advice guys!!!!

I really came to the right place!!!

I think I will load up 20each of all the different bullet types with both 4.0gr of 231, 4.7gr of Unique (alliants listed max.) and 3.5gr Red dot

Then fire 2 5shot groups from the sandbag and 2 standing with each load as both an accuracy test and some practice with the new gun.
Maybe I will work up to 5gr of unique later, which might be closer to their +P. But I love Unique and have 7.5 lbs of it.

But please share some more of your favorite loads guys

 

[mdi]

Common reloading practice is to drop loads 5% - 10% or begin at the starting load. They are called "starting loads" for a reason...

 

[Steve C]

Alliant on line data circa 2000 for .38 spl standard pressure.

 

[diananike]

My revolver is rated for +P loads.
I'm just using regular pressure loads for practice and Historical reasons.
If I push the upper edge of standard pressure to duplicate the classic 158gr LSWC at 860fps, that's fine by me.
Also all of Alliants data is under the SAAMI specs for standard pressure .38 special of 17000psi by over 1000 psi in some cases 1900psi

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Probably my favorite .38 Special load is a 158gr LSWC over 4.0gr W231. (HP-38)

 

[evan price]

158 LSWC and 3.5 grains of Titegroup. Loaded and shot thousands of them in Colts and Smiths and Tauri.

 

[Husker_Fan]

Probably my favorite .38 Special load is a 158gr LSWC over 4.0gr W231. (HP-38)

Mine too. In fact, I think I got that from you when I started reloading .38 spl.

 

[ssyoumans]

For standard velocity 38 Specials, I load 3.4-3.5gr Bullseye with a 158gr MBC LSWC for 818 fps out of 6" revolver. I also use this out of my 2" Colt Cobra and Chiefs Special (680fps from the 2" snubbies). I've been very pleased with this load. I believe it is a max charge for non +P, so as always, work up to it.

When dipping into +P range: I've been loading 4.9gr of Unique for 921fps out of a 6" GP100. This too has been a nice load for my girl friend to shoot. She doesn't care for magnum loads out of the GP100.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Probably my favorite .38 Special load is a 158gr LSWC over 4.0gr W231. (HP-38)

Mine too. In fact, I think I got that from you when I started reloading .38 spl.

Then I'm very glad I was of some assistance.

 

[Husker_Fan]

I think Brad at Missouri Bullets is glad you were too.

 

[BossHogg]

I really like the Hornady 158 gr Swaged LSWC on top of 4.2 gr of Universal. I think you will like the Hornady bullets I've had no problem with leading.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

5 grns of Unique and a 158 was my load for decades. I made a dipper up around 76 and used it till about 95. It worked fine and still tossed "around" 5 grns when I retired it. Dippers can be very accurate and consistent if you are.

Now everything is dispensed.

I will say that I went through a period where I loaded down to current max loads of 4.2 grns and found the accuracy and dirtiness of the gun went down and up respectively. I went back to 5 grns and am happy again.

Great load and I just ignore the current lawyered downloaded reloading manuals in this case.

Ps I mostly shoot 38/44 heavy duty's and 38/44 Outdoorsman's so these are "wimp" loads in my guns.

 

[_N4Z_]

When I shoot .38spl level loads with a 158gr LSWC it has to be 3.5gr Alliant Bullseye. Works like a charm in GP100, SP101, and Cimarron Model-P. Even works well in my 1894c.

 

[diananike]

I'm liking this 5gr of Unique more and more the more I hear of it.
Gotta love the "thinking mans +P"

 

[35 Whelen]

diananike, you're in luck. The Feb. 2010 issue of Handloader Magazine published a fantastic article on 38 Special loads that include both standard and +P loads. They even used the Keith SWC as well as the Thompson SWC. Powders include Bullseye, W-231, Unique, HS-6, Titegroup and others.
You can get a back-issue by contacting Wolfe Publishing CO. or possibly by visiting www.handloadermagazine.com

I personally prefer loads out of reputable magazines such as this to that out of manuals (I'll get flamed for this!) because I believe the results are more "real world" than those that are developed in a lab under controlled conditions.
Good luck,
35W

 

[diananike]

Hey 35 Whelen

Thanks for the advice
I always buy handloader and have had that issue since it came out, in fact I was reading it earlier today!!!
Its always a good idea to source info in a bunch of places and crossreference it, thats why Im double checking with guys on the ground about what their experiences are with these loads.
Good call on the article though, Brian Pearce writes some solid stuff. The article about .45ACP 200gr loads in the same issue sent me out to buy a 200gr mould the same weekend!!!


Edit: Sorry it was Mike Thomas that wrote that article

 

[Red Cent]

Anyone try a 105gr 38?

 

[diananike]

I would try a 105gr but my M10 has fixed sights and works best with 158gr at normal velocities. I'm guessing a 105gr would shoot pretty low out of it.