.380 What do you carry for defense?

[keeta]

I am in the process if buying my first .380 which is a Bersa Thunder. What do you folks recommend for a carry load? I read a lot on the various forums on both hollowpoint and ball. Wha't the general consenus on this round?

Thanks,

 

[ruger357]

Federal hydrashoks in my NAA .380. Welcome.

 

[birddog]

Ditto the Federal Hydrashoks in my Bersa Thunder.

 

[Johnny Guest]

First of all - -

Another hearty "Welcome aboard," keeta. We hope to see a lot of you.

Good question - - For the itsy-bitsy .380s, such as the Kel Tec P3AT, I'm sold on the idea of the hottest FMJ ammo you cn locate. There's little prayer for penetration AND expansion at lower velocities. A .355" solid that goes deep will be more beneficial (from the shooter's persective ) than a well-expanded, lighter bullet that stops in the first couple of inches.

For the "longer barrel" pistols in the caliber, there's a bit more hope. I kinda like the Gold Dot and Federal JHP - - They function well in MY pistols, but I have no illusions that any magic bullet is going to make a .380 into a .357, SiG OR parabellum.

While I've heard good things about the Bersa .380s, I must admit to almost zero personal experience with that brand.

No matter what the load, ANY effectiveness with ANY handgun depends on PLACEMENT.

Best of luck - -
Johnny

 

[FJC]

Ditto what Johnny Guest said. I carry Fiocchi FMJ in my Kel-Tec P-3AT, as it's the hottest FMJ I could find.

 

[Shane333]

Remington Golden Sabres are some of the heaviest hp's you can find for the .380 and are supposed to get between 8-10 inches of penetration using a 102 gr. bullet.

On the other end of the spectrum are Magsafe ammo. For the .380 they produce a 52 gr. frangable bullet moving at about 1,700 ft/s and hitting with about 300-340 ft./lbs. of energy.

 

[cratz2]

I've done very little testing of the 380 Golden Sabers but they would be one of my first choices, assuming the gun was reliable with them. I agree on FMJs for uber short barrel 380s. Gold Dots are almost always a good choice but again, I've done zero testing of them in 380.

Honestly, I don't think I'd feel extremely well-armed with only a 380... I know, I know... it's better to have a small gun with you that a large one at home because it was too heavy to carry, but I'd like a full 9mm or higher myself.

 

[denfoote]

Brown Bear 92gr HPs.
But, only in Pistolet Makarova!!

 

[readyfire]

Federal hydrashoks or federal personal protection 95 grain,they both run very well.

 

[horge]

Hi keeta,

I keep Remington Golden Saber 102gr JHP's in my Bersa Thunder 380.
I'm just a softie for heavy bullets.

There is a performance comparison chart for various .380 ACP cartridges here:
.380 ACP Cartridge Performance Chart
collated from various manufacturers' claims and independent test results.


You have a good little pistol there.
I have to agree with the others: shot placement is the key.
The BERSA Thunder 380 is easy (and fun) to practice with, so
go out and get real good with the gun.



horge


.

 

[Zeke Menuar]

95gr Federal Hydra-shoks in my CZ-83

ZM

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello and welcome to The High Road.

I have owned a couple of Bersa .380 pistols over the years; one was all-steel and I currently own a Bersa Thunder. I chronographed the following loads fired from this Bersa and the average velocities listed are based on 10 shots fired right at 10' from the muzzle:

Winchester USA 95-gr. FMJ: 912 ft/sec

Magtech 95-gr. FMJ: 893

Glaser 70-gr Safety Slug+P(Silver): 1242

Corbon 90-gr. JHP +P: 1050

Empresa Nacional
Santa Barbara 95-gr. JSP: 1029

Magtech 85-gr JHP Guardian Gold +P: 1001

Federal 90-gr. JHP: 960

Remington 88-gr. JHP: 972

Hornady 90-gr. XTP: 917

Winchester 95-gr. JHP RA380T: 896

Remington 102-gr Golden Saber: 855

I did not have impressive expansion results with the Magtech Guardian Gold, but others report that it has worked fine. Mine was an early lot number so it is possible that the bullet's been tweaked a bit and performance is better. I don't know.

Of the loads listed, none grouped much better or worse than the other and all possessed more than enough accuracy for the defensive role the gun might primarily be intended for.

Perhaps worthy of consideration is that the lower portion of the Bersa's feed system on the lightweight pistol is of aluminum alloy. Some have reported dinging up this area with really blunt JHP's or those having sharp edges around the hollow point or meplat area.

In my pistol, I'd use either the Federal Classic 90-gr. JHP, the Winchester RA380T, the Golden Saber, or Hornady XTP's. I found no discernible difference in expansion between the Golden Saber and the Winchester Ranger load and the latter can be hard to find. If penetration concerns are high on your list, you might take a gander at the XTP. It usually expands to about 1.5 x original diameter and penetrates an inch or two deeper. Though the bullet is a truncated cone, it apparrently impacts the ramp such that the flat point doesn't hit it headon.

The Spanish 95-gr. JSP is not listed as +P, but it IS hot. Frankly, I don't intend to shoot any more of it in my aluminum frame Bersa.

These .380 JHP's were fired into water from a Bersa .380 pistol. Top left: Winchester RA380T, Top right: Remington Golden Saber, Bottom left: Corbon JHP +P (One of the few I've seen fail to expand), and Bottom right: Hornady XTP

As is the case with any handgun round commonly used for self-protection, placement will win out over bullet design. Whatever load you choose, make sure it is reliable in your individual pistol. With the Bersa that should not be a problem.

Best and good luck.

 

[tbeb]

I'd go with the Federal Hi-Shok 90 gr. JHP or Federal Hydra-Shok 90 gr. JHP. Whatever ammo you choose make sure it is 100% reliable in your pistol. When I choose a self defense load for a semi-auto, I will carry it only if my pistol has digested 200 rounds without a malfunction.

I feel the .380 ACP is marginal for self defense. Same for a short barrelled .38 special. 9mm and .357 magnum are much better. (I carry a .38 special snubby because it is a great pocket gun.)

 

[gbundersea]

Some of the KTrangers did wetpack testing with the P-3AT and Bersa and about 8 different ammo types. Take a look and judge for yourself:

http://www.ktrange.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=1523
http://www.ktrange.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=232

 

[horge]

Stephen,

Hope you get to see this post
Thanks for clueing us in to ESNB ammo (Empresa Nacional Sta. Barbara) some months back!
It took a while for me to find out that it was the new name for an old ammo brand that sporadically shows up here in the Philippines, 'Fabrica Nacional de Toledo'.

I wonder if the samples you tested were FMJ.
Those I've seen are more like a JSP. Just one of those things nagging me.


While we're at it... folks, some excellent reading here

HiPowers and Handguns - Comparing the Makarov 9x18 pistol & the Bersa Thunder 380 by Stephen A. Camp

HiPowers and Handguns - Comparing the SIG P230 & the Bersa Thunder 380 by Stephen A. Camp




horge

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, sir. These were JSP and had the truncated cone shape. I've not tested them for expansion and might shoot some through a CZ-83. I just think the stuff's a tad "hot" for my tastes.

Best.

PS: Here's a picture of the stuff I was using:

 

[Ivy Mike]

I load Winchester Supreme SXT in my .380 Makarov.
Feeds more reliably than other rounds I have tested.

I have considered using some heavier FMJ's though to ensure enough penetration. Perhaps Cor-Bon...

 

[MICHAEL T]

My Bersa does mostly night stand duty and is loaded with Rem GS 102 which is also my Colt Mustang load and my 2nd carry load in my PPK/S . Some people like the Silver tips also. Really its up to you the Bersa will work with about any round.

 

[priv8ter]

Federal's!

Federal Hydra-Shok's here, in a Firestorm .380. They just happened to be the first premium load we tried, and since the worked and were accurate, I have felt no need to experiment.

greg

 

[horge]

Originally posted by Stephen Camp
PS: Here's a picture of the stuff I was using:

Thank you very much. That is indeed the very same.
The box does indicate that it is semiblindado = semi-jacketed ~ softpoint.
Based on what I've seen on this side of the pond, even the new ENSB-branded cartridges
bear the relatively ancient FNT (Fab. Nacional de Toledo) headstamp.

I agree they pack a punch. Given the experiences of acquaintances who've tested
the ENSB/FNT 9mm Parabellum (9mm Especial) in wetpack, I'm however afraid
they may not expand very much.

 

[keeta]

Thanks to all of you for the hearty "Welcome aboard". I think I'll try the Golden Sabres or the Hornady XTP as long as there is no problem with the Hornady's chewing up the feed ramp. I have a safe full of pistols and revolvers that I have purchased for CCW carry in that I've been licensed to carry for quite a while. Still looking for the "perfect" one for comfort and practicality. If they were comfortable and ( highly on the comfortable) I would prefer my Springfield custom .45 or my Glock 22, .40. I also have a Glock 27 that I carry frequently. Also have snub 357's and .38's with a S&W 342 being a favorite pocket revolver. Even tried the Charter Bulldogs 44's. I want to try the Bersa for it's lightweight and also for the capacity over the snub 38's. Even if the .380's are a bit light for stopping power they can't help to be easier for frequent carry.

Thanks again!!

 

[Shane333]

Keeta,

Not sure where you live, but in Utah I can buy Remington Golden Sabers for about $6 a box at Gart Bros. Sporting Goods. That's almost half of what the Hyda-Shoks cost around here.

 

[halvey]

I use Magtech in my P3AT. I can get better accuracy and placement with it, so that's what I use. It may not be as hot, but I am working on that.

 

[bfm950]

Buffalo bore +p 100 gr. Hardcast flatnose in my NAA Guardian.

 

[.380awsome]

winchester FMJ's in my walther ppk/s