44.77 Help

[cgtreml]

I need some help with loads for my Rolling Block. I have been using 75 grains of FF with a .060 fiber wad and a 340 grain bullet. Fouling is terrible. I cannot chamber the next round without wiping. That's fine unless your hunting. I have been told to use a heaver bullet to get more pressure and help clear the fouling. What about a grease cookie? Suggestions?

 

[bubba15301]

try a magnum primer

 

[J-Bar]

If you are not already crimping the hell out of your cartridges, please do so. Heavy crimps produce more complete burning.

How are your bullets lubed? What brand of ff are you using...it makes a difference in the lube.

 

[Curator]

Switch to about 55 grains of FFFg and fill to bullet base with cream of wheat cereal. Pleasant, accurate load, with minimal fouling in my .43 Spanish roller (pretty much the same as .44-77.)

 

[zimmerstutzen]

switch to 3f powder and back off slightly on the charge using COW for filler.

Have you had your chamber head space checked. The problem you describe was common after just two or three shots with some of the old bottle necked black powder cartridges. Noted after 4 shots in the Martini Henry They switched from the short lever to the long lever to get the extra leverage to pry the cases out of the dirty chambers. The same problem was noted with the 50-70 Trapdoors at the Wagon Box fight.

I have had that problem with a very tight chamber in a Hepburn in 45-70

 

[StrawHat]

Sounds like the case is not expanding enough to seal the chamber upon firing. There are many causes and nearly as many solutions. If you are full length sizing, try neck sizing. Try annealling the casings. Using a larger bullet will also increase the pressure.

With a single shot, you do not need much of a crimp so overcrimping will only give you accuracy problems. Check on one of the black powder cartridge sites for more information.

 

[Risky buisness]

Is it really a .44-77, or a .43 spanish, are you shooting .43spanish out of it if it indeed is a .44-77, as the cases are similar, but the bullet diameter is different. My remmi roller was a .43 Spanish, but the groove diameter was .446 ( I believe ) and the .43 Spanish was .437 again I believe it was, it's been some time since I fooled with it and don't remember, but I do recall that the issue I had was simmilar when firing the Spanish in the oversize Remmi bbl, I corrected this by rechambering the rifle to .44-77 an every thing worked out much better, except for the short .43 Spanish cases used in lieu of the vastly more expensive custom .44-77 cases

 

[TomADC]

Curious what are you using for a bullet lube?

 

[buttrap]

switch to IMR 3031 and slug the bore then use a paper patch slug The lyman .43 spanish slugs work really well in the 44-77 bore diameter guns if you paper them up to just a bit over .444. If you are really having a issue with gunk in the thing use a starter charge of around 3-4 grains of unique powder just over the primer then wad the load to where its only 50 or so grains of FFF if you insist on gunk stink and cleaning brass.

 

[cgtreml]

OK sorry it took so long to respond but I have had a brutal work schedule. First I will try to answer some of your questions. Yes it is chambered for 44.77. I bought this gun some time ago. Some amateur gunsmith mucked up the chamber and barrel so I had it sleeved and rechambered to its original caliber (44.77). Had the work done by Lock Stock & Barrel in Washington state. Can’t say enough about this guys work and customer service. (Outstanding) The brass I’m using is made from 348 win. I am using CCI200 large rifle primers. I use alox for lube. This will be the first thing I will change. You guys have given me a lot of things to try. Keep the info coming. I will try to keep this dialog going just be patient. I work some really weird hours and shifts.

 

[Curator]

Alox lube doesn't do what you need when shooting black powder. Lube needs to be able to combine with fouling and keep it soft. That's why most BPCR shooters use super-soft lubes like SPG or olive oil/bee's wax. A lube cookie under the bullet will help but forget the alox unless shooting smokeless powder loads. This is especailly true when shooting bottle-neck cases with black powder. Back in the 1880s it was determined that bottle necked cartridges needed special loading to get accuracy over an extended shot string due to throat fouling. Most accurate cartridges of the day were the .32-40, 38-55, .40-70 Sharps straight, .40-65, and .45-70. All were tapered cases not bottle neck.

 

[TomADC]

I have used Emmert's Home Mix for both Black Powder and Smokeless loads with excellent
results:
50% pure natural beeswax, 40% Crisco, and 10% Canola Oil (all measurements by volume).
Melt using a double boiler (overheating damages the lube).

A refinement is to reduce the Canola Oil by half and replace that half with Anhydrous
Lanolin. So, the improved Emmert's is:
50% beeswax, 40% Crisco, 5% Canola Oil, and 5% Lanolin.