someguy2800
Member
Let's not get carried away. The 45-70 was the original poodle shooter with the military going from 58 caliber down to 45. Traditional black powder loads basically reproduce 45 caliber muzzle loader performance in a faster to load rifle. And that is the minimum legal caliber for deer in most states. Not legal for larger game in most states, certainly inadequate on horses.
It was designed to kill 140 lb Native Americans during the Indian wars. It was not very successful and was quickly dropped. As a hunting cartridge it was considered under powered for anything larger than deer during the 1870's and 1880's and with good reason. It was never widely used as a buffalo gun for several reasons. Mainly because most of the buffalo were dead 10 years before it was introduced. And laws were passed in 1874, one year after the 45-70 was introduced, banning buffalo hunting to preserve the handful left.
By the 1890's it was all but dead. From the 1890's until 1973 the 45-70 was a dormant cartridge that only saw use among a small group of target shooters who competed in black powder cartridge shooting matches. Hunters dropped it like a rock, rounds like 30-30, 6.5X55, 7X57 and the 30-06 were readily available by the early 1900's. Some as early as 1891.
In 1973 Marlin re-introduced their 1895 rifle chambered in 45-70 to celebrate the 100th anniversary of the 45-70 with lots of hyperbole and colorful advertising hinting that the cartridge had a lot more history than it really did. I had one of the originals back in the mid 1970's and a couple more over the years so I have some experience with 45-70 and Marlin lever guns.
Of course this is about the same time that modern loads that were safe to fire in the Marlin were introduced. Those loads bring the 45-70 into another league. But at the cost of what I consider excessive recoil. Black powder level loads are very tolerable, no more than 30-06. But many of the hotter modern loads exceed 375 H&H mag recoil and are right on the heels of 458 WM recoil. And in reality they don't kill anything a 30-06 won't kill just as well with 1/3 the recoil.
The short version is that traditional 45-70 loads are quite weak and the round wasn't well thought of during its military service during the 1870's and 1880's. With modern loads it will kill any animal that walks within a limited range. But during the 80 years the 45-70 was dormant and sleeping rounds like 6.5X55, 7X57, and 30-06 proved they would also kill any animal that walks. And do it at much longer ranges with a fraction of the recoil.
Can a 45-70 hit and kill a deer at 200 or even 300 yards. Yes, but that is hardly impressive, we have people killing elk at 1/2 mile with 243's.
This is the first time I've heard that a 405 grain lead slug is only suitable for shooting poodles. How many of them have to be line up end to end?
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