45-70 handloads

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by jval, Apr 10, 2021.

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Can I use H335 with 325 FTX in a 45-70 Trapdoor

Poll closed Apr 11, 2021.
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  2. Yes, No

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  1. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

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    I was actually surprised to see Varget on the list at all... It would not be the first powder I would think of for low-pressure loads.
     
  2. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

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    I'd stick with the starting load unless it's not burning right, fails to reach useful velocity for that bullet, or just won't group.
     
  3. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

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    IMR 4227, IMR 3031 and Alliant 2400 are my first-thru-third choices but if the H335 load is published and tested in THAT Trapdoor, and it's what the OP has, then sticking to starting loads and well under max ought to be fine for a limited diet. I would not suggest feeding ANY Trapdoor a steady diet of max+ smokeless.
     
  4. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

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    Yup! same goes for anything in a modern Trapdoor that wears a jacket or gas check.
    2400 and 4227 are made for loads like this.
    26gr. 2400, 26gr. IMR 4227, or 35gr. IMR 3031. If needs be, I like the old 13gr. Unique load, too. It's not just the amount of pressure, it's how quick the pressure builds that loosens a Trapdoor.
     
  5. bear166

    bear166 Member

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    I have used the FTX cases in my original Trapdoor without issue, I wouldn't be worried about that.

    For powder, considering what you have on hand I would use the Universal, personally. I only shoot black powder in mine.

    For the bullet, you should really consider using soft lead (mine are 20:1, you can get them from Desperado Cowboy Bullets and they are readily available, but take a week or two to show up) or at least slug your bore to see if the jacketed bullets will engage the rifling nicely. I'm sure the reproductions have more consistent bores, but the originals tended to run large, and soft lead is the way around that. Plus, if you ever get into black powder cartridge reloading, which you absolutely should because it's a blast with a Trapdoor, you'll already have the bullets for it!
     
  6. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

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    You are dancing all around the one and only IMR4198... I'm telling you, IMR4198 and cast rifle go together like macaroni and cheese... ;)
     
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  7. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

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    But is it like peanut butter and Thai chilies? ;)

    I’ll give it a whirl IF it’s even available again. The OP already pointed out he can’t find powder.

    And if I can find 405gr hard cast WFN bullets in .458 again. Hunters Supply are okay but a little hard for my Pedersoli.
     
  8. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

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    There's always Montana Bullet Works... ;)

    Actually, I ran flat out of IMR4198, but scored 2#'s of H4198 from Powder Valley. AA5744 is another good one... but I think IMR4198 is more versatile.
     
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  9. Soonerpesek

    Soonerpesek Member

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    45/70 Cast Lead Bullet (snscasting.com)

    I have had good luck with these......and AA5744...
     
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  10. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

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    Well it was a good thought.
    “Sorry but this item is currently unavailable. Please check back at a later stage.”
     
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  11. jval

    jval Member

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    I am certainly not looking to load anything that's unsafe. All the loads I am considering are smokeless and per the "starting" loads in the manuals and well within CUP limits that I can find anywhere including Perdersoli's Proof limits as referenced in post #22 above. Again my objective is to load and shoot the trapdoor for fun at no more than 100 yards. I may at some point, try some BP with 405 lead. Thanks to all for educating me.
     
  12. Reeferman

    Reeferman Member

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    Majority of loads for my original 1873 trapdoor are 405 HB with 60 to 65 grains of FF. The only smokeless powder I use is 27 grains H4198 with same bullet. It is the lowest CUP Hodgdon lists and is very close in performance with the blackpowder loads.
    With my old eyes with those tiny sights I can hit a 8 inch gong all day long at 100 yards with it with either powder.
     
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  13. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

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    OP, you mention 100yd shooting for fun. As I mentioned, I’ve got a Pedersoli 1885 that I shoot for fun, so far out to a measly 1244yds... and it is fun! First with my Marlin 1895, and now with the 1885, I experimented with a lot of bullet and powder combinations... everything from Unique all the way to IMR4064, 300grn to the nominal 405grn cast. Even with the heavier 32” barrel of the 1885, I reached a threshold of about 1500fps where it stopped being ‘fun’ and turned into ‘work,’ and some beyond that were pure ‘Not Fun.’ With that lighter Trappy, my suggestion would be to keep to the lower velocities using faster powders... or even pistol powders like Unique, TrailBoss, 2400, IMR4227, or even RedDot.

    working off your OP... that is H335... it can be done, but don’t get discouraged if you don’t get the results you might be looking for at first.

    I still have question about what pressures are acceptable in your rifle... I would probably go to the source for The Answer. The reality of the situation is you will likely load well below that pressure, eventually, for ‘fun’ loads.
     
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  14. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    Makes it a carbine. Early days, there was a carbine load, .45-55-405, to keep the recoil down. Velocity barely over 1000 fps. I think they later decided it wasn't worth the trouble and issued .45-70-405 and .45-70-500 to all units.
     
  15. Keyfer 55

    Keyfer 55 Member

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    I use AA2460 and 500 gr lee.
     
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  16. Soonerpesek

    Soonerpesek Member

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    Back in stock now, if you are still interested.
     
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  17. rkittine

    rkittine Member

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    In 1970 I was at an antique store and there was a 1873 Officers Model Trap Door Springfield hanging on the wall. When I asked how much he wanted, the guy said, I have no clue, make me an offer. I offered $20.00 and he took it, then asked would you be interested in more? So he took me to the back room and showed me a Springfield Arsenal Full Case of infantry model 1873 Trap Doors, still in the original grease and waxed paper. Bought the whole case. Sold the unmolested wooden crate for 10 times what I paid for the whole shambang. The modern LIGHT loaded smokeless powder factory ammo works fine in both the Officer's Model which I kept and one of the infrantry models.

    Bob
     
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