5.7x28 - gimmick or useful SD round?

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Yeah, but we don't live in the first-shooter realm of carrying 25 different arms, including rocket launchers.


Obviously having that much weaponry would require a squad. ;)

As for shooting, I will live or I will die. If I die, then I'm ready for that. If the other guy dies, I'm ready for that, too. If 6 rounds of 357 is no good, or 10 rounds of 45 is no good, then I guess I'll just chew his throat out.

Sounds like a general undefined SD situation you may be planning for. Others may know the folks that they are likely to find themselves defending against and may have specific information that make certain scenarios more likely than others. Someone in that situation would be wise to plan accordingly. That doesn't mean your plan should follow suit. I think you're doing just fine, but that doesn't mean it's appropriate to discount other's planning.
 
The only time you need to shoot a man 14 times is if 13 didn't stop him. If he's hopped up on stuff (the new one is bath salts) its entirely possible you might need all those. Especially if you miss or get non-critical hits, and the hits to COM aren't hitting something that will stop him immediately. Technically, one shot from #1 buck will be hitting a man 16 times. If you're in a situation where you have to explain why you shot him that 14th time, your defense could be "he hadn't stopped attacking yet." Simple as that. There are stories of people hopped up on drugs who were taken down by LE/M and took several hits to the chest before finally being brought down.

And all those stupid teachers taught me that the manufacturers build things BECAUSE the public buys them. Even Ruger finally figured that out and started making 1911's and AR15's. You really believe that if all the manufacturer's started making Highpoint style pistols (blowbacks) then that would create a bigger demand for them????

Like I said, it's in a state of flux. Some people will buy the 5-7 anyway because they really want it, others flat-out refuse to because they want to stick with their current caliber of choice. However, there are a lot of people who would buy it if:
  • Ammo was cheaper and more available
  • There were guns in the $500-700 price range instead of over a grand
  • There were guns that fit what they're looking for (i.e. all of my semi-auto handguns are DAO with no safety or Striker-Fired with a trigger safety and no manual safety, the FN FiveseveN is single action with a manual safety).
  • There were guns made by someone who the buyer has brand loyalty for (i.e. some people won't get anything but a Glock)

The problem is, because of those limitations in availability, a lot of the fencers are reluctant to buy one. If those limitations were gone, then more people would buy the 5.7 platform. The problem arises in that manufacturers don't see the platform as popular, so they don't make a frame for it. This leads to the monopoly of the 5.7 by FN, and continues the availability issue.

That's why it's up to the manufacturers. If Glock decided to make the G40, in 5.7x28mm with a 5" barrel and 20-round capacity, maybe MSRP $650-700 (in stores for $500-600), I'm sure the popularity of the 5.7x28mm would jump overnight. Glock making that leap of faith to produce the G40 would provide customers with:
-Assurance that the 5.7x28mm is a platform considered useful by more than just FN and a few random no-name-brand companies
-An option other than the FiveseveN, which is more affordable and has different characteristics that may be closer to what they want

So yes, the low supply AND demand are tied to each other, and its going to take a manufacturer to break it.
 
I doubt Glock would manufacture a pistol in an FN caliber, they did not, after all, make an FN-45GAP.

But the argument is sound.
 
I've said it before, and I think FiveTwoSeven has something similar in his sig, I'm waiting for FN to make a DAO or striker-fired variant, or Springfield/Ruger/Glock/S&W to make one. I know I left Taurus off the list, but after seeing pictures of a FiveseveN KB, I don't want Taurus to make one.

I would like an XDm in 5.7, I think it would be a nifty pistol. I did have something like that in my sig for some time.

I do like this round but I do want to stay out of these arguments now. I've done research and ended up liking the round. I've seen many arguments if not all of them against the round and I still like it. I don't need to convince anyone about it. The biggest factor is hitting something vital and then after shot placement, then caliber comes in order of importance.
 
Haha, 527, there you are! I was waiting for your comment about the XDm.

I doubt Glock would manufacture a pistol in an FN caliber, they did not, after all, make an FN-45GAP.

Yes, and it sells poorly compared to their 45 (automatic) Colt. They also sell the .357 Sig. The nice thing about 5.7x28mm is that it doesn't have "FN" in the common name for it, although they could always call it 5.7 auto (like how .45 ACP is ".45 auto" and .357 sig is ".357 auto"). Oh, wait, I forgot the .40 S&W (ahem, ".40 auto").
 
The advantage of 5,7 is that with correct ammo one can always shoot in center of chest to make a kill while with most other handgun calibers to be 100% certain a head shot is needed. I would list this weapon under OFFENSIVE handgun category.
 
The advantage of 5,7 is that with correct ammo one can always shoot in center of chest to make a kill while with most other handgun calibers to be 100% certain a head shot is needed. I would list this weapon under OFFENSIVE handgun category.

Uh...what?

1) The goal of a defensive shooting is to stop (which killing does), and you're supposed to aim COM because its a lot easier to hit. Therefore, this would still work well as a defensive weapon.

2) A 9mm to the center of the chest will hit the same organ that a 5.7 to the center of the chest will.
 
The advantage of 5,7 is that with correct ammo one can always shoot in center of chest to make a kill while with most other handgun calibers to be 100% certain a head shot is needed. I would list this weapon under OFFENSIVE handgun category.

If you're appealing to the 5.7mm's ability to penetrate, it actually penetrates less in soft tissue than common service cartridges. It's purpose was to defeat PASGT body armor.
 
Internal hammer might as well be striker-fired. I want a hammer I can manipulate. Others don't, and that is fine by me.
 
I would probably try to take advantage of the high capacity and low recoil, and see how many little holes I could make center-of-mass in the shortest possible time.

Isn't that pretty much the winning strategy no matter what caliber you are using?
 
You really believe that if all the manufacturer's started making Highpoint style pistols (blowbacks) then that would create a bigger demand for them????

I'm pretty sure people don't buy a gun because the gun uses browning short recoil, that's just silly.
 
Eh, I do. I want a locked breach because I like recoil springs that are not needlessly stiff and a slide that is not overly-heavy.
 
No. With a conventional cartridge I will open with a failure drill.

I hope you don't mind too terribly if I keep teaching my classes to aim COM and pull the trigger until the threat is neutralized... no matter what badass hand cannon they happen to be packing.



The silly things people say to rally against the 5.7 are amusing.
 
No. With a conventional cartridge I will open with a failure drill.

Here's a hint. In a real world self-defense situation where you're not shooting at a paper target, the reason that your target didn't stop is because you missed him with your first 2 shots to center mass. Changing your aiming point to something smaller and faster moving (headshot) is just going to get you killed. If you're smart, you'll follow ClickClickD'oh's advice.
 
Eh, I do. I want a locked breach because I like recoil springs that are not needlessly stiff and a slide that is not overly-heavy.

Apparently you've never handled a FiveseveN, it's a very light gun with a normal strength spring as other conventional guns.
 
As a point of fact, my brother-in-law owns a first pattern Five-seveN. Even with the dorky skater boi spelling of the name, my dislike of the pistol remains exactly the same. Weight of the slide matters little.

Check out Hi Point, Jennings, Lorcin, and Astra pistols. I have held them, too. Once even owned a Bryco. There is a solid reason why over the last 100 years, the vast majority of blow-back pistols in large caliber rounds were discarded by virtually every military force in the world, including FN - all save for Spain in fact. Yeah, times change, and perhaps your round of choice fills your needs, but blow-backs are not ideal with my personal round of choice (which happens to be two in autos, 9mm and 45, neither of which is conducive to your design). You like the 5.7 and its poly blow back pistol that fires it. Great, I've nothing wrong with your decision. It is yours after all.

Enjoy your pistol. I'm fine with you liking it. I have an idea, be fine with the fact I don't.
 
Even with the dorky skater boi spelling of the name, my dislike of the pistol remains exactly the same.

There is a solid reason why over the last 100 years, the vast majority of blow-back pistols in large caliber rounds were discarded by virtually every military force in the world, including FN - all save for Spain in fact.

You like the 5.7 and its poly blow back pistol that fires it.


I'm fine with you liking it. I have an idea, be fine with the fact I don't.


You TOTALLY come across as being completely okay with others liking it... :neener:
 
So, my plan of aiming for center-mass and then the head is unrealistic, but a 5.7 through center-mass to the CNS is a good plan?

No, it's more of trying to double tap a guy then shoot him in the head once, and hope the job is done instead of just keeping your point of aim COM and squeezing the trigger until he falls over or the slide locks back.

It doesn't matter if it's a .45, 9mm, .40, .357, .38, .57, 10mm... whatever. The best plan, unless you are a super trained, spec ops qualified, pistol ninja, certified awesome shooter... is COM and rock and roll.

Now, if you do happen to be a super trained, spec ops qualified, pistol ninja, certified awesome shooter, then please... continue using the Mozambique drill. Everyone else should probably aim COM and shoot until the threat is neutralized.

Oddly enough, you've defeated your own arguments though. A 5.7 between the eyes will stop a threat just as fast as a .45 will
 
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