500s&w vs 44 mag

[Ed Ames]

Yeah I think we chatted about it in a thread a few months ago about the 45-70 BFR.

The snub model had to be horrendous to shoot. I guess I never understood the purpose either since with that short of a barrel you will lose so much velocity

Yeah, it was a bit much.

But...

According to the reports I've read (never personally chronographed it) the 2-3/4" ES barrel would send 300gr bullets at about 1500fps. Considering that the sight radius is about the same as a 1911 it - on paper - makes for a reasonable easier-to-carry substitute for a longer barrel .454 Casull.

, it isn't going to make any sense with a gun meant to produce speed and flat trajectories. I agree, in a short barrel, the Alaskan makes more sense to me, especially with heavy ammo.

The Alaskan loses about 100-150fps over the 460ES, with a 300gr bullet reportedly running about 1370fps.

To me that puts it in the range of a longer barrel .44 magnum or hot .45c, again in a relatively small package.

The big difference between the ES and Alaskan is that the Alaskan is 20oz lighter, half an inch smaller in every dimension, and provides a sixth shot. Not a huge difference at the range but major when carrying.

I'm not trying to thread jack here, but I had intended to pm you. Even though the 460V isn't high on your priority list, I definitely recommend shooting one if you have the chance. It's the sweet spot for me regarding X frames. It's so nicely balanced that shooting it one handed isn't too difficult, and it still will shoot like a laser beam out to 100 yards, though you definitely leave some powder unburned. Anyway.......

I've tried an 8" and didn't really like how it felt. Too nose heavy. I still hold out hope on the 5".

 

[TDC]

Maybe it's time to get away from the common evaluations of these two calibers and focus on the reality.

1. These should both be considered special purpose calibers and realize neither is intended to be for everyone.
Trying to promote these guns as an acceptable "range" or occasional "recreational plinking" gun simply doesn't
fit their intent.

2. The recoil, noise report, firearm weight and control-ability, in my experience, puts them in a special application
category that directs their main usefulness to long range target competition and serious handgun hunting area.

3. Neither of these calibers, with close to maximum loadings, is comfortable or fun to shoot on a frequent basis.
I have hunted successfully for many years with a 6 1/2" 500, an 8 3/8" 44 Mag, and an 8 3/8" .41 Mag. I have
seen little difference with the effective harvesting effect on Black bear, elk and deer. Of course the large
northern bears are another issue.....

4. The 500 especially is a gun a person needs to really think about before they buy. I equate it to a top
fuel dragster. Optimum for running down the drag strip for its intended purpose -- but having a dragster as a
"daily driver" to go back and forth to work in just doesn't work.... Just my 2c.

 

[22-rimfire]

Get the 500 S&W. You want it and you will always wonder about scratching this itch.

I would have probably purchased the S&W 500 if it had been available when I bought my SRH in 480 Ruger. No, I had never shot one to that point. Would I buy a 500 now? Nope. I have two revolvers in 480 Ruger with a BFR that will handle 475 Linebaughs. Do I regret it? Nope. Do I shoot one of them every time I go to the range? Nope. These are big enough for me.

So, scratch this itch.

 

[AKMtnRunner]

I dont own one, but have shot both at some point, so take this for what its worth, but I too have been contemplating one of the bigguns.

I am leaning on the .460. Just as capable as the 500. Just as noisy and flashy. Great for hunting. Supposedly accurate to 200+ yards. The big thing for me though is the availibility of reloading components. Tons of 45 caliber bullet options out there for a lot less than the more limited 50 cal selections. Also, if you want to, you can shoot .454 or 45 Colt out of. It just seems more versatile, but yet still just as capable. I think the 500 is one of those things, its just the idea of owning a .50 caliber anything that makes any man grin(50 BMG, 50 AE, 500 Nitro, 500 S&W, they all just seem so.... awesome!), however since the price and guns are pretty apples to apples with the exception of the cartridge they shoot, I think the 460 XVR is where its at!

The 500 sends 300 grains as fast as the 460 sends 240 grains, and it's just getting started. The 460's bullet options are good, but taper off around 325-350 range, up to 400 if you go to the extreme end and sacrifice a lot of velocity. The 500, on the other hand, is ideal in the 350-500 grain range and can even go up to 700 grains. When all is said and done, the typical 500 bullet are 1.5-2x heavier than for the 460. That's close to the difference between the 357 and 44, or at the very least, between a 40 S&W and a 45 Super.

It sounds like the 500 brings what what the OP is looking for. Especially since he'll handload.

 

[ZWCoffindaffer]

The 500 sends 300 grains as fast as the 460 sends 240 grains, and it's just getting started. The 460's bullet options are good, but taper off around 325-350 range, up to 400 if you go to the extreme end and sacrifice a lot of velocity. The 500, on the other hand, is ideal in the 350-500 grain range and can even go up to 700 grains. When all is said and done, the typical 500 bullet are 1.5-2x heavier than for the 460. That's close to the difference between the 357 and 44, or at the very least, between a 40 S&W and a 45 Super.

It sounds like the 500 brings what what the OP is looking for. Especially since he'll handload.

By just as capable, I wasnt referring to pure energy or velocity numbers, but is a 500 S&W going to make a deer or elk any more dead than a 460 S&W? Yes you are right, the 500 is a clear winner in energy. Like you say, it shoots a bigger bullet at an equal speed. Thats a no brainer, but the 460 is just as capable punching paper or killing medium sized game, with the added benefit of reloading components and ability to shoot smaller rounds for more people to enjoy if you have family or friends who want to shoot.With the exception of the big ones like kodiaks, grizzlys, moose, etc. both rounds have energy capable of knocking most game animals off their feet. I've never had a deer question the caliber I used when it was hanging on a gambrel.

 

[MaxP]

"Energy," as such, is a poor measure of lethality. The .460 makes a smaller hole, period. Remember, it's still a .45. The .500s -- the various iterations -- really show their worth when the game gets big -- up over 1,000-lbs. If the goal is plinking, I would opt for just about anything but an X-frame as they are exceedingly bulky. However, as someone else mentioned, it may be an itch you have to scratch, and there is no need for any of us to justify our gun purchases.

 

[CraigC]

By just as capable, I wasnt referring to pure energy or velocity numbers, but is a 500 S&W going to make a deer or elk any more dead than a 460 S&W?

Neither was I. In fact, I dismiss energy figures entirely. The .500 is a big step up in effectiveness. No, it won't kill deer any deader but it is much more effective on larger animals.

 

[TimSr]

If your purpose is a range toy with lots of recoil, and you're considering going bigger than the .44, 500, 460, or 454 will do. If economics is any consideration, even for a reloader, the 460 or 454 will make a lot more sense just for the cost and availability of bullets, and their options, and there is a lot more data and options for downloading you you decide it's necessary.

I was shooting at friend's house, when a guy came with a 500 SW. I don't recall exactly what barrel length, but it was simiar to my Freedom Arms 454 Casull. We exchanged guns and each emptied the other's gun on the target. We swapped back, and shot again. We both agreed that mine had slightly more felt recoil, but not much.

 

[buck460XVR]

I don't know why we are discussing the effectiveness on 1000# game animals or how dead it will make a deer or elk when the OP tells us in post #4....

Purpose would be a toy to bring out at the range for paper/discount fruit hunting. I dont live in bear country and I do my hunting at the meat department of the grocery store.

He's looking for something larger than a .44 to make a lot of flash and give a bunch of recoil while being an accurate platform at the range. The .500 will do that very well. But....even when reloading, unless the OP casts his own bullets from free lead, the .454 or .460 will do it cheaper and kill watermelons just as dead.

 

[MaxP]

Buck, it was in response to other's comments on the effectiveness of one over the other. I thought that was clear.

 

[Ranger Roberts]

The novelty of the 500 has never worn off for me. I have three of them! In my defense, I use 2 of them for bear hunting. I also have three 44's (Anaconda, Red Hawk, Black Hawk). I don't shoot the 44's often anymore. I can load the 500's down and they are very pleasant to shoot. Heck, I've even loaded them down so my wife can shoot it.

 

[Reefinmike]

Thank you everyone for your comments and I have had a lot to consider. I have pushed aside 44mag and started thinking about the possibility of a 460 mag as .452 projectiles are considerably cheaper however, my ultimate goal is to develop a successful cast powder coated lead load as I do with every other gun I own. I hardly ever shoot jacketed bullets, maybe 200-300 a year. the other 10k are free cast bullets.

Ive decided to go big and get a 500 smith. This is admittedly a novelty item and I dont mind that. I dont shoot my g41 very much anymore and the idea of trading it in for something ridiculous is very appealing. I very well may end up not liking it and selling it a year down the road- i'm ok with that.

I'm pretty certain that I want one of the 8.375" models and have seen in another thread that it is recommended to get the one with interchangeable comps for lead bullets. Is this necessary for powder coated bullets? I shoot a lot of coated lead through my 300blk AR without any indications of lead getting in the gas system. Powder coat seems pretty darn resilient

Edit: Im planning on starting off with the lee 440gr mold. Ill powder coat these, do any of you with this mold that powder coat suggest using gas checks as well?

 

[SDGlock23]

The .500 is big and yeah I can agree it's not really neeeed but how can you really argue with it either? It's not like it has to be loaded it all the way to hunt with, even loaded mild it'll kill more or less anything in the lower 48 with ease. I don't know how big of a fan of single actions you are, but the BFR is a nice revolver offered in .500 S&W. But the way I see it, if you buy one knowing from the get go it's basically a novelty and are fine with that, go for it.

 

[derek45]

Make mine a 44



310gr LEE flat-point Gas-Checks ( note 45ACP brass for size comparison )

Loaded up with a max load of H-110/ Win-296, it kicks hard, and hits with a resounding THWACK

 

[22-rimfire]

When facing a major life's decision like this, the answer is always to get both. I personally think if you are not used to a 44 mag or the equivalent, then you should start there and work you way up in power. Shooting a hot 45 in an X frame is not the same thing as with a normal chambered revolver for a caliber. But then, there is the very human itch factor. Scratch it if you can afford it. Many of us have in one form or another.