6.5 Creedmoor Loads without H4350

[dh1633pm]

While I realize that the go to load for the Creedmoor is H4350. But with H4350 becoming more and more like unobtainium, there has to be another powder with good results. I read on another thread to try H414, W760 or AA2700. I also noted that most listed loads were a hair or so over what the manual calls max. Will be shooting out a bolt gun. I have 200 berger 140's to start loading with.

For rifles I have AA2700, IMR4895, IMR49064, IMR4350, IMR4064, and Varget. I have no issue buying some other powders, availability can vary by location of course.

Also just looking for loading advice with this caliber. For example my Model 7 AAC Blackout likes them on the hot side. Saved me a lot of trial and error by working up loads towards that end of the spectrum. Been loading for over 20 years so I can follow along, but always looking to learn for those that are better.

I did check some of the older threads on this. There is already a lot of good info out there, I am looking a little more specific. And thanks.

 

[farmerboy78]

Imr 4350 will work just fine... I use accurate 4350 for mine...

 

[taliv]

Reloader 15 and 17 will work.
Imr 4451 is what I would try first

 

[dh1633pm]

farmerboy78, I have your load written down in my reloading journal. I have already loaded up five for testing. I appreciate your communication on the Creedmoor. Heck, I bought the rifle you suggested.

 

[dh1633pm]

taliv, I don't have any of the reloader branded powders. I tend to shy away from them. Do you load for the Creedmoor? I will be on the look out for those three and might pick up a pound.

 

[taliv]

no, but i've been through over a dozen barrels of 260 and 260AI, where the former is nearly identical to the CM. i've nearly exclusively shot 140g berger VLDs and past few years 140 hybrids. first few years i used R17 and past few years H4350. got better velocity with R17 in some barrels but temp stability is so much better with H4350. If you can't get 4350, R17 is definitely an option. The IMR powder is supposed to be a replacement for H4350, but i haven't used it personally yet.

 

[Gtscotty]

farmerboy78, I have your load written down in my reloading journal. I have already loaded up five for testing. I appreciate your communication on the Creedmoor. Heck, I bought the rifle you suggested.

I have a little IMR4350 languishing in my powder stash, now I'm curious what this load is.

I use H4350, and have been able to find enough to keep shooting, but it is getting to be scarce. A member on here has had good luck with RL17, but personally I'm curious about IMR4451, it's an enduron powder that's supposed to be a lot like H4350, but with the copper fouling reducing additives. It's pricier around here than some other options, but it's usually available.

 

[Offfhand]

Basically the 6.5 Creed is a knockoff of a wildcat known as the .260 Bobcat, which was once quite popular with High Power shooters. Most of whom favored IMR 4895. I still have a rifle in that caliber and my best test targets, and in actual competition, were with IMR 4895 loads.

 

[dh1633pm]

Thanks for your inputs. I am going to try farmerboy78's suggested load. Its a little over the max on the IMR site. Don't worry will work a little towards it for safety. I may beg borrow or steal a little RL17. I know somebody at work who uses it a lot.

The next question is does the Savage LRP with its 1/8 twist like them loaded towards the hotter side or the slower side?

 

[MCMXI]

I'm getting good results with Reloder 17 and 140gr Hornady bullets. I've used up the A-MAX bullets I had and just received 700 of the new 140gr ELD bullets. I also have 600 of the Berger 130gr VLDs but use them for my gf's 6.5x47 Lapua.

My 6.5 Creedmoor load:

140gr A-MAX (ELD Match)
43.4gr Reloder 17
Hornady brass
Federal GM210M primer
COL: 2.825"
MV: 2,900 fps (suppressed)

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=797899

I've never found Reloder powders to be particularly temperature sensitive.

 

[dh1633pm]

Thanks MCMXI, I thought I had seen a post on load development, but I completely missed it. I even posted on that thread. Thanks for posting the link. So that's where that load came from in my log book. Looks like I need to try Reloader 17 and IMR4350.

 

[The_Next_Generation]

MCMXI, wow! 2,900ft/s with the 140 out of the cm is impressive. How long is your barrel? What suppressor did you use?

I just picked up a Ruger Precision in 6.5cm (24in barrel). I was thinking 2,700ft/s or so would be on the upper-end of what I could achieve.

 

[Gtscotty]

MCMXI, wow! 2,900ft/s with the 140 out of the cm is impressive. How long is your barrel? What suppressor did you use?

I just picked up a Ruger Precision in 6.5cm (24in barrel). I was thinking 2,700ft/s or so would be on the upper-end of what I could achieve.

I have an RPR in 6.5 as well, and see 2700 fps with factory 140gr ELD's, 2685 fps with 42.5 gr H4350 under 140gr Nosler CC's, and 2610 fps with 41.5 gr H4350. It shoots great, but I don't know if i have a slow barrel, or if RL17 is just that much faster than 4350.

 

[Captcurt]

Basically the 6.5 Creed is a knockoff of a wildcat known as the .260 Bobcat, which was once quite popular with High Power shooters. Most of whom favored IMR 4895. I still have a rifle in that caliber and my best test targets, and in actual competition, were with IMR 4895 loads.

Wasn't the Bobcat a Carmichael concoction based on the 308 case?

 

[dh1633pm]

http://www.outdoorlife.com/articles/guns/rifles/2007/09/65-leopard

 

[MCMXI]

MCMXI, wow! 2,900ft/s with the 140 out of the cm is impressive. How long is your barrel? What suppressor did you use?

I have a Bartlein 24" barrel on my AI. The suppressor is a SANDMAN-S. Factory Hornady [strike]178gr [/strike] 140gr A-MAX ammunition is leaving the muzzle at around 2,750 fps (no suppressor). If you look at the table below, my handload of 43.4gr of Reloder 17 is still quite conservative on pressure at around 59,000 psi. I could add a few more grains of powder since I'm not close to a compressed charge but I'm happy to stay where I am given the accuracy, velocity and possibly increased barrel life. I'm getting a bit of a velocity boost with the suppressor which is typical.

 

[Gtscotty]

MCMXI,

I assume you meant the Hornady 140gr Amax factory ammo. You don't happen to have a similar quickload printout for H4350 or IMR4451 do you?

 

[MCMXI]

I assume you meant the Hornady 140gr Amax factory ammo. You don't happen to have a similar quickload printout for H4350 or IMR4451 do you?

Oops ... sorry for the brain fade. Yes, I meant 140gr A-MAX. I haven't tried the new 140gr ELD Match factory ammunition yet but that's what I get with the A-MAX stuff. I'll run H4350 and IMR4451 and report back. I'll keep everything the same for my load if that's ok i.e. bullet, case, COL.

 

[MCMXI]

Gtscotty, my QL program doesn't list IMR 4451 but it does have H4350, Accurate 4350 and IMR 4350 . Using the same variables as my load for Reloder 17 this is what QL spits out for Hodgdon H4350.

 

[Offfhand]

Quoted from earlier post in this thread:
"Wasn't the Bobcat a Carmichael concoction based on the 308 case?"

The Bobcat is based on .250 Savage case. I make my Bobcat brass necking up .250 Savage cases. Carmichael developed the .260 Rem. on .308 case.

 

[rogn]

TALIV nailed it. IMR 4451 is nearly identical to the varied 4350s, is temp stable, copper resistant and runs minimal ES. Tried it in bench rifle and it stayed well under 1/2 MOA at 600yd for 20 shots. ITS available.!

 

[Captcurt]

Quoted from earlier post in this thread:
"Wasn't the Bobcat a Carmichael concoction based on the 308 case?"

The Bobcat is based on .250 Savage case. I make my Bobcat brass necking up .250 Savage cases. Carmichael developed the .260 Rem. on .308 case.

Thanks.

 

[farmerboy78]

My load is as follows, reformed and neck turned Norma .308 win brass to 6.5cm, WLR primers, 42gr accurate 4350, and 123gr Hornady amax.

 

[dh1633pm]

I loaded up some loads with AA2700 to fireform some 22-250 brass. Used 37.8 grains. Fireformed just fine and I was able to site in at 100 yards fairly quickly. Scope is mounted too far forward and other problems prevented some good shooting, but I have most of what I need. Tried some Hornady Creedmoor brass loaded with 42 grains of AA2700. Seemed to shoot pretty well. I will test it out next Monday after I load some more. A little pre-mature to take to F-Class, but I am anyways. They are patient and I should be able to sight in quickly.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

You already have IMR4350 so I was going to say load that but I see it's already been suggested. As we know they are not the same powder but they are so close my rifles can't tell the difference when loading the 30-06.

In a real squeeze AA4350 will also do well. Who knows, your rifle may even like IMR4350 or AA4350 even more than H4350.