777 and lee powder dippers

[quincy1]

Howdy,
I've been shooting and loving (the smell also) of BP for 30 years. My first can was DuPont.

Here is my question. I use Lee powder dippers to measure powder and I got a wild hair and bought a LB of 777 for s***s and grins and lord o' mercy 777 is not listed in the Lee dipper info.

I have 3 sets of these doo dads. The first set was red and the last 2 sets are yellow. Do any of y'all know if a given dipper volume of 777 is the same as Pyrodex P? They look the same. I use about 30 grams BP in the Old Army and have read to use 15% less volume of 777. I am not as concerned about the 15% but would like to know which dipper scopes what aprox. volume of 777.

I could buy a scale but it seems like a waste of $$ since I have no intention of getting back into ctg. loading again.

Thanks in advance
Quincy1

 

[gmatov]

If you been shooting BP, and weighing and measuring the BP charge, the sub charge is a VOLUME equivalent, except for 777. There, you DO reduce the VOLUME charge by 15 %, per the mfg..

F'rinstance, a 35 grain charge of BP, the same VOLUME of Pyrodex will give you a little higher velocity and pressure than BP.

If you use APP powder, the same VOLUME load wil give you WAY less velocity. Pressure, I do not know. Will have to check, but it seems reasonble the pressure will be less.

Personally, I kinda like BP, don't like the subs, and I can still buy BP locally.

Cheers,

George

 

[Low Key]

Here's a link to Hodgdons website and the firsthand info about 777 from the guys who make it. http://www.hodgdon.com/tripleseven/loadnote.php

Here's a quote from that page:

All charges of Triple Seven should be measure by VOLUME not weight. A simple, adjustable black powder measure is the correct tool for this job. All loads listed in this brochure are measured by VOLUME.

Triple Seven is a high energy product designed to provide the muzzleloading hunter with higher velocities when used in the same VOLUME as black powder. To duplicate a black powder load velocity using Triple Seven, you must decrease the powder charge by 15%.

The 15% reduction is with regards to duplicating the velocity of a given bp load. So, if you want to duplicate the velocity of 30gr of goex with 777 then you would load 15% less 777 by volume. I don't know much about the Lee dippers though, I use an adjustable measure so someone else will jump in here with that info. Hope that helps you some.

 

[gmatov]

Quincy,
Did you get that last post above?

If you are using the Lee dippers, check the chart for which will throw your desired BP charge, little over 2 CC, I think. You said 35 grs BP, so with 777 you want 30 or a little less. Check the Lee chart for the dipper that throws 30 grs BP. That is the equivalent volume of 777 to duplicate BP energy at 35 grs.

If you have been reading here for a while, you might have seen reference to not compressing 777 too much. Seems to be erratic. You DO have to seat the ball on the powder, no air space, but no crankin' down real hard on the rammer.

Good luck and have fun.

Cheers,

George

 

[quincy1]

Low Key, George, and Others

Well thanks all, I got it! Little slow on the up take here.

Will test this stuff on Sunday. I tried Pyrodex when I started this CB stuff in
77 and did not care for the lack of that great BP smell and the sound was lack luster. Than, the factory where they made it blew up and I never tried it again. BUT "ya got to try the new technology.

Cleaning the guns has not been a problem since I quit using petroleum products on them. I use Bore Butter and Wonder Lube Bore Cleaning Solvent.

George, black powder is, surprisingly, available here in the the SF Bay Area
though it varies from county to county. BP runs about $15.00 lb and you can buy 5 lb at a time. EVERY TIME YOU WALK IN THE PLACE! 777 was $26.00.
At least I will be able to tell my great grand kid I tried it. I will offer my opinion on 777 next week, trying to keep an open mind.

Quincy

 

[Low Key]

I think you'll like the 777. I've used it and liked it but the cost was a bit high for as much as I've been shooting. George is right about the compression, seat the ball but don't bear down on the rammer and crush the powder. Minimum compression will give you the best results...have fun!

 

[JNewell]

Isn't what Hodgdon is saying that you can use 35 gr by volume of 777 if you used 35 gr by volume of BP, but if you want to match velocities, you need ~30% less of 777?

 

[Low Key]

If you want to match the velocity of 35gr of blackpowder with 777 you would decrease the charge by 15% to 29.75gr of 777 by the exact math.

 

[JNewell]

Sorry, meant 15%...typed 30%.

That's inflation? :banghead:

 

[Low Key]

Wish my paycheck worked like that!