870P or Ithaca 37 defense?
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Coming from a large family of shotgunners, and collectors of shotguns. I would definitely choose the 870! The only better modern type gun is the model 12 Winchester. The Ithaca is the only gun that fails in the field and needs constant repair...if someone doesn't think so, then they obviously don't use them enough. If failures to extract, and the problems of releasing two shells at once isn't a problem for you, then by all means get the 37. If you want a gun that doesn't fail then get a used model 12, 97, or wingmaster.
Youngster
Member
Actually, there was a good bit of choice at the time, while the Ithaca was the closest thing to a standard issue shotgun at the time, there were many other designs already in inventory, being newly issued or readily available through the black market, including the 870.
The '37 seems to have been the consensus favorite. I know if i were in those shoes I'd appreciate the '37s lighter weight, crud and rain resistance, quicker mag loading, slightly faster rate of fire and lack of "Remington jam" {remember this was pre Flexitab}.
Check out this review:
http://randywakeman.com/Home_Defense_12_Gauge_Pump_ShootOut.htm
Not an 870P, but another of the 870 versions.
http://randywakeman.com/Home_Defense_12_Gauge_Pump_ShootOut.htm
Not an 870P, but another of the 870 versions.
It's long been my understanding that the 37 was the one most available in Vietnam for Army use.
In the Air Force, we were "exposed" (can't hardly call it trained) to the Winchester Model 12 in SP tech school in '72.
But, this is running well beyond the original issue here of "Keep the 870P or move down to the Ithaca Defense?"
And, few people buying a home defense shotgun will tote it through jungle or dense forest.
I had no intentions of starting or participating in a brand war or an esoteric discussion of which design holds up best through extreme conditions that don't apply to the vast majority of us.
Relative to that original issue, my statements stand.
Denis
In the Air Force, we were "exposed" (can't hardly call it trained) to the Winchester Model 12 in SP tech school in '72.
But, this is running well beyond the original issue here of "Keep the 870P or move down to the Ithaca Defense?"
And, few people buying a home defense shotgun will tote it through jungle or dense forest.
I had no intentions of starting or participating in a brand war or an esoteric discussion of which design holds up best through extreme conditions that don't apply to the vast majority of us.
Relative to that original issue, my statements stand.
Denis
AndyJ
Member
Hope this does not qualify as a necro post.....
I don't remember the last time I bought a new gun but I have bought plenty o' them used shotguns. I know the OP was talking about NEW guns and my perspective is a little different. Since the 870 is infinitely customizable, every day Bubba sometimes screws 'em up bad with shade tree butchery. Any used gun I come across that has been modified *any* gets the 9th degree inspection from me. The 870 is just chock full of sheet metal things and little wire things and stamped metal posts that this thing has to fit on to make that thing work. Open one up and it looks -- just cheap. And that makes sense I guess, the 870 was a cheaper-to-manufacture replacement for the Remington Model 31 which struggled in sales vs the Winchester Model 12.
But with all that said, I don't believe you can wear an 870 out-- I haven't come even close so all those stampings and pieces of piano wire got something going for them. Many mentioned the loose shell latches which I find in used guns very often. A more aggravating problem is action bars out of true. They are sometimes a hassle to get just right. The only thing a reasonably proficient end user cannot fix is the mag tube. If one of them is bent the gun has to go back to the factory, they are soldered in.
My fave is the Ithaca 37. Compared to the 870, it is built like a tank with big old hunks of solid steel -- and it is still lighter than an 870. Take one apart and you will admire the simplicity and ingenious JMB engineering. It points and shoots far better than any 870 for me but of course YMMV.
What is behind the seat of my truck right now? A 60ish Wingmaster with an 18" barrel and no mag extension.
I don't remember the last time I bought a new gun but I have bought plenty o' them used shotguns. I know the OP was talking about NEW guns and my perspective is a little different. Since the 870 is infinitely customizable, every day Bubba sometimes screws 'em up bad with shade tree butchery. Any used gun I come across that has been modified *any* gets the 9th degree inspection from me. The 870 is just chock full of sheet metal things and little wire things and stamped metal posts that this thing has to fit on to make that thing work. Open one up and it looks -- just cheap. And that makes sense I guess, the 870 was a cheaper-to-manufacture replacement for the Remington Model 31 which struggled in sales vs the Winchester Model 12.
But with all that said, I don't believe you can wear an 870 out-- I haven't come even close so all those stampings and pieces of piano wire got something going for them. Many mentioned the loose shell latches which I find in used guns very often. A more aggravating problem is action bars out of true. They are sometimes a hassle to get just right. The only thing a reasonably proficient end user cannot fix is the mag tube. If one of them is bent the gun has to go back to the factory, they are soldered in.
My fave is the Ithaca 37. Compared to the 870, it is built like a tank with big old hunks of solid steel -- and it is still lighter than an 870. Take one apart and you will admire the simplicity and ingenious JMB engineering. It points and shoots far better than any 870 for me but of course YMMV.
What is behind the seat of my truck right now? A 60ish Wingmaster with an 18" barrel and no mag extension.
SwampWolf
Member
Though I prefer the Ithaca Model 37 to the Remington Model 870 for its lighter weight, handling qualities and looks, the non-removable barrel on the cheapest Model 37 would be a deal breaker for me. Imo, Winchester Model 12s were the best pump shotguns ever made. Second best-the Browning BPS.
winchester '97
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I have toured the Ithaca plant in Ohio, they run a top notch operation, the stance of the current owner is that every gun that leaves that factory has to be perfect, they are test fired extensively, hand fitted, and generally scrutinized for any possible failure before they even leave the factory floor. The riot gun they currently make feels absolutely amazing, and they even make a 14'' barrel sbs version.
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