9mm in USPSA
- Thread starter spelsh
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3 gun
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With a High Power being a single action pistol you'd have to shoot it as a "minor" scoring gun in Limited or Limited 10. It can be done but isn't a serious contender in either class.
can a soft enough load be made up in .40sw to make it feel closer to 9mm? I'm just doing research right now on reloading, no first hand experience. My wife prefers shooting it over the other calibers, and I don't want to buy 2 guns and not ave the money for extra accesories or reloading equipment.
ChristopherG
Member
You can definitely download a .40 to minor power class (i.e., down where it feels more like a 9mm--some would say even gentler).
I wonder what kind of shooting you are hoping to do in USPSA. Do you know the classes yet, and have you decided whether you want to shoot production or limited?
What criteria led you to consider the Daly, and are there other models you've handled or considered?
I wonder what kind of shooting you are hoping to do in USPSA. Do you know the classes yet, and have you decided whether you want to shoot production or limited?
What criteria led you to consider the Daly, and are there other models you've handled or considered?
I suggest that you visit some local matches before you spend any $$. Here's a link to USPSA http://www.uspsa.org You can read about the sport, find your local area matches and types of divisions available. Good luck
Waywatcher
Member
Of course you could just shoot A's in limited 10 and be fine. 
sargenv
Member
Personally, I've been told and am convinced that a Glock 35 in 40 cal is about the best entry level gun on the market (and I dislike Glocks). You can download the 40 S&W to minor very easily (we call them mouse fart loads) and shoot production with them, or you could attach a mag well, new sights, new trigger mechanism, load to Major power factor, get extended base pads for standard cap mags (in states where legal), do everything you like to it (like the other double stack limited guns, STI, SVI, Para, etc) and have yourself a really nice L10 or Limited gun. What other gun can you effectively shoot in 3 USPSA divisions, at both minor and major than the 35?
The 9mm high power would really only be good in one or two divisions, and it would be very limited in Limited. Limited 10 minor would be about the best division for it. I talked to someone recently who was thinking about using a Sig 226 for IPSC. Again, same problem, the standard cap mags don't hold enough, it could be used for production but it would be at a disadvantage to Glocks due to the first shot double action, then subsequent SA after that.
Don't get me wrong, I use a 229 for Production and do ok with it, but after shooting a G34, there was a big difference. Oh, and firing the 34 for a few months, bumped me up to B class (argh!
with someone else's gun and factory ammo!). You can see how it's hard to hate a "plastic gun".
(I did say I don't like them right?)
Vince
ps.
Edited to add:
If you already have the Daly HP, use it. It's fun to shoot what ya brung and see how you fare. If you shoot all A's, then you have nothing to worry about. If you haven't yet made the investment, go to a few matches (IDPA, Steel, IPSC) and see what people are shooting. A majority of people not shooting the high ticket ZOOT steel guns are shooting the Glocks, some Sigs, H&K USP's, and CZ's and are very effective with them. I know one guy who shoots an H&K P7M8 because he has it.
The 9mm high power would really only be good in one or two divisions, and it would be very limited in Limited. Limited 10 minor would be about the best division for it. I talked to someone recently who was thinking about using a Sig 226 for IPSC. Again, same problem, the standard cap mags don't hold enough, it could be used for production but it would be at a disadvantage to Glocks due to the first shot double action, then subsequent SA after that.
Don't get me wrong, I use a 229 for Production and do ok with it, but after shooting a G34, there was a big difference. Oh, and firing the 34 for a few months, bumped me up to B class (argh!
with someone else's gun and factory ammo!). You can see how it's hard to hate a "plastic gun". (I did say I don't like them right?)
Vince
ps.
Edited to add:
If you already have the Daly HP, use it. It's fun to shoot what ya brung and see how you fare. If you shoot all A's, then you have nothing to worry about. If you haven't yet made the investment, go to a few matches (IDPA, Steel, IPSC) and see what people are shooting. A majority of people not shooting the high ticket ZOOT steel guns are shooting the Glocks, some Sigs, H&K USP's, and CZ's and are very effective with them. I know one guy who shoots an H&K P7M8 because he has it.
Where are you located? If you are around here I would be happy to meet you at a match and introduce you around, and I am quite sure we can get our hands on a BUNCH of different guns for you to take a couple shots with, see what seems to fit you the best....
If you already have the hi power
or are set on it, then go for it. I'd say shoot it in limited 10, and concentrate a bit more on accuracy. You'll eventually outgrow this gun, but will likely have learned some very valuable lessons.
If you are flexible, the CZ has to be a Great suggestion. I don't know if you can dress it up to Limited potential (mag capacity needs to be ~20) but you could get a .40 that would do great in L-10. Or, you could shoot DA/SA in production. Bonus is, it has similar feel/ergonomics with the HP, tho the gun is significantly different.
If you are even more flexible, a Glock is the best way to start. And I don't like them either
But you'd be silly not to consider one ....
or are set on it, then go for it. I'd say shoot it in limited 10, and concentrate a bit more on accuracy. You'll eventually outgrow this gun, but will likely have learned some very valuable lessons.
If you are flexible, the CZ has to be a Great suggestion. I don't know if you can dress it up to Limited potential (mag capacity needs to be ~20) but you could get a .40 that would do great in L-10. Or, you could shoot DA/SA in production. Bonus is, it has similar feel/ergonomics with the HP, tho the gun is significantly different.
If you are even more flexible, a Glock is the best way to start. And I don't like them either
But you'd be silly not to consider one ....
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Blacklabman
Member
I suggest that you visit some local matches before you spend any $$. Here's a link to USPSA http://www.uspsa.org You can read about the sport, find your local area matches and types of divisions available. Good luck
Excellent advice.
From my own experience.
I have tried the G35 and G34 over the years. I did not like either. I now use G17's in USPSA Production.
In Production, there is no PF.
Unless you would like to shoot other Diviisions, there in no sense in using anything other than 9mm.
Excellent advice.
From my own experience.
I have tried the G35 and G34 over the years. I did not like either. I now use G17's in USPSA Production.
In Production, there is no PF.
Unless you would like to shoot other Diviisions, there in no sense in using anything other than 9mm.
thanks
I live in Ohio. I have not purchased yet, doing lots of research. i have smaller hands and the Charles Daly was suggested as a frame that might suit my hand and to try one out.
I have not been to any matches yet. I would really like to attend with a tutor/mentor, and get an idea of what I would prefer using.
I live in Ohio. I have not purchased yet, doing lots of research. i have smaller hands and the Charles Daly was suggested as a frame that might suit my hand and to try one out.
I have not been to any matches yet. I would really like to attend with a tutor/mentor, and get an idea of what I would prefer using.
3 gun
Member
Where in Ohio? Try a CZ 75/85 series pistol for fit. Again where in Ohio? I shoot weekly, nearly year round indoors and out. Drop a PM or email my way and we'll see if we can't get some answers for your questions.
richardschennberg
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If you have ample funds and limited time, you are better off with major power, preferably .40 S&W for Limited. .45 ACP is great for Single-Stack, but that division is currently provisional.
If you have a limited budget but ample time for practice, keep your 9mm, get a timer, and practice Bill Drills and El Presidente for starters. 9mm will save you $ on practice and matches.
If you have both time and money, congratulations! Buy an STI double-column limited gun in .40 S&W, and either a Dillon reloader or a case of .40 ammo that makes major.
Richard
Schennberg.com
If you have a limited budget but ample time for practice, keep your 9mm, get a timer, and practice Bill Drills and El Presidente for starters. 9mm will save you $ on practice and matches.
If you have both time and money, congratulations! Buy an STI double-column limited gun in .40 S&W, and either a Dillon reloader or a case of .40 ammo that makes major.
Richard
Schennberg.com
money....
I wish I could afford an STI or SVI or Brazos or Dawson or......
Reloading is going to be the only way I can afford to shoot any reasonable amount each month. So that has taken a fair amount of money away from the amount I can use to buy my autoloader.
I wish I could afford an STI or SVI or Brazos or Dawson or......
Reloading is going to be the only way I can afford to shoot any reasonable amount each month. So that has taken a fair amount of money away from the amount I can use to buy my autoloader.
I wish I could afford an STI or SVI or Brazos or Dawson or......
Splesh, you sounded like me when I got into the sport 4 years ago
I have several "custom" guns ....hard chrome, trigger job, FO sights.........but for the last 3 years I have been shooting my G34 (production class). Why?
1.Wal-Mart's price for 9mm made easy for me not to reload
2.glock works 99.9%. the .01% error is mostly the operator's fault.
3.very affordable
4."custom" guns did NOT make me shoot faster and or more accurate ( my .40 STI shoots 1" in 25 yards but I don't!)
5.My highest classification for USPSA is production class.
I am not trying to sway you away from custom guns but I just hate to see you waste your money without trying it out yet.
I am positive that if you go to local matches, someone will let you try their stuff.....at least that what we do here in IL and WI (HSMITH).
Good luck and take your time.
Splesh, you sounded like me when I got into the sport 4 years ago
I have several "custom" guns ....hard chrome, trigger job, FO sights.........but for the last 3 years I have been shooting my G34 (production class). Why?
1.Wal-Mart's price for 9mm made easy for me not to reload
2.glock works 99.9%. the .01% error is mostly the operator's fault.
3.very affordable
4."custom" guns did NOT make me shoot faster and or more accurate ( my .40 STI shoots 1" in 25 yards but I don't!)
5.My highest classification for USPSA is production class.
I am not trying to sway you away from custom guns but I just hate to see you waste your money without trying it out yet.
I am positive that if you go to local matches, someone will let you try their stuff.....at least that what we do here in IL and WI (HSMITH).
Good luck and take your time.
Magnumite
Member
palcapt hit it on the head, splesh. The majority of your efforts in the first couple of years will be safe gun handling, marksmanship and figuring out what you do and don't like in a gun.
Try to shoot someone else's gun to see what you like. Production is a good class to start in since the equipment is very limited to modificitions - only tuning is allowed, I believe. In minor class club and pin matches, I used a stock Ruger P85 MkII for years. So buy the gun you feel will suit your needs and blast away!
Try to shoot someone else's gun to see what you like. Production is a good class to start in since the equipment is very limited to modificitions - only tuning is allowed, I believe. In minor class club and pin matches, I used a stock Ruger P85 MkII for years. So buy the gun you feel will suit your needs and blast away!
thanks
you guys are so helpful without being judgemental or overly opinionated! And I appreciate that. I only made the comment about STI etc to respond to one of the posts. I have no intentions of buying anything custom at this time. Maybe in a year or two, but certainly not now.
So, 9mm or 40s&w, small framed (single stack?). bring on the recomendations than.
you guys are so helpful without being judgemental or overly opinionated! And I appreciate that. I only made the comment about STI etc to respond to one of the posts. I have no intentions of buying anything custom at this time. Maybe in a year or two, but certainly not now.
So, 9mm or 40s&w, small framed (single stack?). bring on the recomendations than.
ChristopherG
Member
Single Stack? Not unless your hand size absolutely requires it. If you plan to shoot in Limited, you will want to have greater capacity than a single stack would allow. If you want to shoot Production, using either 9mm or downloaded .40, I don't know of a qualifying single-stack gun that will hold the 10 rounds you are allowed.
Since you do mention having small hands, you might wish to try one of the guns with replaceable backstraps, intended to accomodate different handsizes. I believe the S&W M&P has these, as does the Walther P99. The CZ is also a good and very workable suggestion.
If you get a chance to handle one, there really is a lot to be said for the Glock 35, as noted above; it can do a lot of different things in USPSA and elsewhere.
Since you do mention having small hands, you might wish to try one of the guns with replaceable backstraps, intended to accomodate different handsizes. I believe the S&W M&P has these, as does the Walther P99. The CZ is also a good and very workable suggestion.
If you get a chance to handle one, there really is a lot to be said for the Glock 35, as noted above; it can do a lot of different things in USPSA and elsewhere.
Since you are reloading ...
I'd go .40 It's a fraction more expensive than 9mm, but allows you more options later. If you are feeling gamey, you can download to minimal power factor, and tune your gun to the load. I don't recommend this, but you could.
I don't shoot production, but it is the best gun to start with IMO. You can keep it stock, or dress it up as a limited gun. Glock in 9mm can be dressed to an open gun too, keeping a lot of the ergonomics similar.
For varieties sake, I'm glad I didn't go glock. I own several diverse handguns and I enjoy them all. (One is a p99, as mentioned above, and it is a very shootable handgun! I also own a HP and it's great, but not a good USPSA gun). I hate glocks, well, they just aren't for me. I intended to start with a glock, but didn't like the trigger and ergonomics. I won a glock and traded it away.
Now, listen close, given the above paragraph, guess what ... If I could start over, I'd start with a G22 or G34. You will learn the feel of the pistol and trigger, and I could have spent the last 5 years on one platform (instead of BHP, P99, 1911, GP100 and a P16, all of which I've competed with).
If you think you'll only shoot production, then by all means, consider the 9mm, and a multitude of pistols. If you think you'll evolve to L or L10 then I think the glock is best. It also suffers from being cheap, having a ton of accessories, lots of support, stone cold reliable, etc
I'd go .40 It's a fraction more expensive than 9mm, but allows you more options later. If you are feeling gamey, you can download to minimal power factor, and tune your gun to the load. I don't recommend this, but you could.
I don't shoot production, but it is the best gun to start with IMO. You can keep it stock, or dress it up as a limited gun. Glock in 9mm can be dressed to an open gun too, keeping a lot of the ergonomics similar.
For varieties sake, I'm glad I didn't go glock. I own several diverse handguns and I enjoy them all. (One is a p99, as mentioned above, and it is a very shootable handgun! I also own a HP and it's great, but not a good USPSA gun). I hate glocks, well, they just aren't for me. I intended to start with a glock, but didn't like the trigger and ergonomics. I won a glock and traded it away.
Now, listen close, given the above paragraph, guess what ... If I could start over, I'd start with a G22 or G34. You will learn the feel of the pistol and trigger, and I could have spent the last 5 years on one platform (instead of BHP, P99, 1911, GP100 and a P16, all of which I've competed with).
If you think you'll only shoot production, then by all means, consider the 9mm, and a multitude of pistols. If you think you'll evolve to L or L10 then I think the glock is best. It also suffers from being cheap, having a ton of accessories, lots of support, stone cold reliable, etc
Magnumite
Member
This is a personal opinion so don't toast me too bad. I have 45 and 9mm caliber 1911 pattern guns and had a 40 caliber 1911 gun. I have other type 40, 9mm and 45 caliber guns. The 40's really don't impress me. It is a 45 wanna be in a 9mm gun size cartridge. History bears that statement out. I understand the arguments about capacity, loading to spec, etc. 45 can use a standard barrel, with a 40 you really should have ramped barrel... Defensively it is a very good round.
I have also heard about the lesser recoil. I don't buy that story either, from first hand experience. It is less when comparing 180 grain 40's to hot 230 45's, but not enough to impress me.
Now there is a definite difference between the 9mm and 45. For all this, I recommend the nine...less expensive to feed, lower recoil, nice cycling and accurate in a good gun. Everything to learn to shoot better.
Just my .02
I have also heard about the lesser recoil. I don't buy that story either, from first hand experience. It is less when comparing 180 grain 40's to hot 230 45's, but not enough to impress me.
Now there is a definite difference between the 9mm and 45. For all this, I recommend the nine...less expensive to feed, lower recoil, nice cycling and accurate in a good gun. Everything to learn to shoot better.
Just my .02
71Commander
Member
PLEASE try the Springfield XD. Grip size is similar to a HP. Slimmer that Glocks. Comes in 9 and 40. Ready to go right out of the box. TGO (Letham) won Production class using a XD in this years nationals.
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