9mm target powder choice

9mm powder for 124 gr coated

  • AA #5

    Votes: 14 25.0%

  • HS 6

    Votes: 6 10.7%

  • CFE PISTOL

    Votes: 22 39.3%

  • SILHOUETTE

    Votes: 10 17.9%

  • win autocomp

    Votes: 4 7.1%
  • Total voters
    56
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JO JO

JO JO

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9mm target powder choice for coated 124gr projectiles ,
these will be for paper punching / plinking
what would you pick from the powders available to me listed in the poll
Thanks
 
JO JO said:
Thanks for the suggestions but of the ones in the poll are my choices ,
Click to expand...
There are many reasons why members are listing faster burning powders for "target" load. Since powders you listed are "relatively" slower burning powders better suited for higher velocity full power loads, a better thread title would be "9mm accurate powder choice ... for paper punching".

JO JO said:
9mm target powder choice for ... paper punching / plinking
Click to expand...
"Target" load usually means lower velocity load with less recoil using below max load data (Sometimes down to start or even below start charge) for match shooting/paper punching instead of full power load (using near max/max load data) for maximum velocity.

The way many have found "target" loads is when conducting powder workup, accuracy is identified at lower charges (often at start charge and even below start charge with faster burning powders).

Because accuracy/smaller group is obtained when more efficient powder burn is produced as result of sufficient chamber pressure build that results in more consistent muzzle velocities, slower burning powders tend to produce optimal accuracy at high to near max load data and usually not well suited for lighter "target" loads.

I usually identify W231/HP-38 and faster burning powders as better suited for "target" loads but there are faster burning powders that tend to produce greater accuracy than others. Having shot USPSA major and minor power factor loads, when "target" load is mentioned, many will consider minor power factor of 125-130 to be minimal "target" load (1000+ fps with 125 gr or 135 gr bullets).

Based on my experience, WSF and BE-86 are two powders that have flexibility to produce accuracy down to around mid range load data as well as high to near max load data (And have used them for reloading duplicate factory JHP loads for practice as they produced higher velocities, even compared to some other slower burning powders). HS-6/CFE Pistol/#5/Silhouette are "relatively slower" burning powders than W231/HP-38 that are used to produce higher velocity loads and I used HS-6 for major PF loads. Technically, major power factor loads would quality as "target" loads as they are used for match shooting but so would 9mm Major loads (125 gr at 1400+ fps) but when we use the term "target load", it is often referring to slower velocity lighter recoil loads.

If you are simply looking for the most accurate load of four powders listed, that may depend on the bullet brand/type/weight/quality of coating along with your barrel more so than the powder selection so you may need to conduct powder work up for accuracy.
 
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Having used AA#5, CFE Pistol, and HS-6, I can say they will all do the job well. AA#5 meters the best out of all of them because it’s so fine, and is similar to CFE Pistol in velocity. I have found CFE pistol to burn a little cleaner towards to the top end of velocities. HS-6 is also good, though dirty at lower charges. Bottom line all great choices just depends on what you want to do with it, and testing for accuracy with your projectiles in your barrels.
 
JO JO said:
Thanks for the suggestions but of the ones in the poll are my choices ,
Click to expand...
In answer to the question you asked, vs. the question I want to answer, either HS6 or AA#5 are your best choices and my recommendation is to put together a short ladder (10x mid-point + .2gr., 10x mid-point - .2gr., 10x mid-point) of each powder on your list and compare the results. I suspect you will find AA#5 and HS6 perform about the same with good accuracy at mid-point but CFEP and Silhouette give better velocities and lower SD's at top-of-the-range loads.

If those are your only choices, go with a broad spread.
 
Jim Watson said:
You have a choice in powder? Most of us are using what we have or taking what we can find.
Click to expand...
They're coming back and most online sellers do have some good choices in every burn rate range and at reasonable prices. But, yeah, it's still slim pickin's.
 
Jim Watson said:
You have a choice in powder? Most of us are using what we have or taking what we can find.
Click to expand...

I've been lucky in that regard. The shop close to me has had a fair selection of powder every time I go. I also have a brass supplier that's four miles from me. Now if cci would build a plant nearby I'd be set.
 
Of those choices, for the intended purposes, I'd go with Silhouette. Followed closely by CFE-P.

I'm keeping what #5 I have for 230 gr. FMJ. :)
 
Please share your opinion using Blue Dot vs a fast powder like Red Dot, Tightgroup, Bullseye, and AA2 for a 9mm - 122gr lead target load. I am trying to find an accurate target load myself and my primary bullets will be cast bullets using range lead and a Lee 6 cavity die. The Lee powder coated bullets weigh more than 122gr and vary so I'm concerned that my groups will open up as a result. Decades ago I found a good load of 4.2gr or so of AA2 with an Oregon Trail Bullet. I tried replicating the load with Lee and Dardas bullets but the results were poor. My test loads were at 4.2gr =/- a few .xx grains. To me, the groups were poor. The best load was below some published recommendations at 3.4gr and 3/5 of the shots were within an inch. I plan to repeat the test for this load and see if the load groups well. In addition, I was thinking of trying 4.0gr Red Dot as Ken Waters recommends. The load is one of his most accurate through his Luger. So, the question I have is will a slower powder like Blue Dot make a difference or am I wasting my time? My experience has been that slow powders leave unburnt residue.
 
BJung said:
So, the question I have is will a slower powder like Blue Dot make a difference or am I wasting my time? My experience has been that slow powders leave unburnt residue.
Click to expand...

Ultimately, you'll have to try it and see if your gun likes it. Slow powders can produce excellent accuracy. Accurate #7 shoots extremely well in my 9mm Kart barrel with a wide range of bullet weights. By this I mean 15-shot groups around 1.5" at 25 yards (jacketed bullets). I also get good results with 3N38, N105, all slow powders.

Accuracy often comes down to a bullet/powder/gun combination. Not all guns like the same ammo.

If you're pursuing accuracy, the best results are often found with jacketed bullet (JHP, FN).
 
Charlie98 said:
Actually, AA#5 and HS6 are a tad faster than Silhouette, but it's likely we're splitting hairs.... they are all in the same general burn range.
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It is like splitting hairs. Graf & Sons list Silhouette slower than HS-6 and #5. Western Powders list is as faster, but WAP, forerunner of Silhouette is slightly slower burn rate. Hodgdon and Deshler of Germany doesn't list Silhouette.

I would bet lot to lot varies, and would explain a lot.
 
BJung said:
9mm ... 122gr lead target load ... powder coated bullets ... trying to find an accurate target load ... cast bullets using range lead and a Lee 6 cavity die ... Red Dot, Tightgroup, Bullseye, and AA2
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If your range lead is mostly from FMJ/JHP and plated bullets, your lead will be soft, almost pure lead soft. If range lead is from hard cast lubed/coated bullets, they will likely be harder at 14-16+ BHN.

It is good that you are powder coating your lead bullets as even start charge velocities will be too fast for softer lead and accuracy will go out the window. If your lead is soft, I would definitely suggest you stick with lower charges of faster burning powders.

BJung said:
I was thinking of trying 4.0 gr Red Dot as Ken Waters recommends.
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I think 4.0 gr would be OK for hard cast bullets (perhaps harder than 18 BHN) but if your lead is softer, I would use lower powder charges.

I have used Red Dot/Promo, Bullseye, Titegroup, W231/HP-38, etc. with MBC 12-18 BHN lead bullets (lubed and Hi-Tek coated) and 14-16 BHN Lee tumble lubed bullets with good results.

For 124/125 gr lubed/coated lead bullets and Red Dot/Promo, I initially referenced 2004 Alliant load data and used around 3.8-4.0 gr but now use lower powder charges based on Speer load data - https://reloadingdata.speer.com/downloads/speer/reloading-pdfs/handgun/9mm_Luger_125.pdf
  • 9mm 125 gr Lead RN Red Dot OAL 1.130" Start 3.3 gr (888 fps) - Max 3.6 gr (1004 fps)
  • 9mm 125 gr Lead RN Bullseye OAL 1.130" Start 3.5 gr (929 fps) - Max 3.8 gr (962 fps)
  • 9mm 125 gr Lead RN W231 OAL 1.130" Start 3.8 gr (911 fps) - Max 4.1 gr (982 fps)
 
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AK Hunter said:
I would say Clays or Titegroup because it takes less powder per load of each of them. The only drawback is you have to watch for double loads.
Click to expand...

Titegroup is all I use in the 9mm anymore. It just works and as noted it is a low cost solution (less grains of powder needed and less $/lb for the powder). My standard load is right at book max (4.4 under a Lee 120) and is at 80% load density. Watching for a double charge is no more difficult with this powder than any other in the 9mm. Other cartridges, yes, but not so much with the 9mm. And the Quick load calculated 1134 fps from a 4.5" barrel is plenty for my needs.

Note that my powder coated Lee 120 TC are cast from range lead blended with some softer stuff. The key to zero leading in 4 guns is that the bullet is big enough and neck expander is big enough to get adequate fit. I started with a Glock 17 that was not happy until I got up to 0.359". As other guns were added, I had to work on the throats of the other 3 of the barrels so they would plunk with my "standard ammo" that was tailored to work in that Glock 17. Each has worked fine with the fat bullets after fixing the throats.

I have loaded full power loads with other powders and the fat Lee 120s just to prove to myself that they worked. No other powder did any better than the Titegroup for my needs, so I stuck with Titegroup. Promo was probably "second best" of what I tried.

I have cranked out thousands and thousands of my standard load.
 
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I thumbed through my targets and did a 9-122 test using Blue Dot and testing my reloads through a BHP. The groups were not so good. I suggest a faster powder and AA#5 is the fastest you list.
 
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