9x23

[cowboy]

I would like to have a 9X23 made, as I am not aware of to many over the counter ones. What would make a good base and who would be a good smith to do the work, and be able to get it back by early Spring. I would like to keep the total cost under $1800. A few of the thiings I would like to have on it.
1911 format
Fixed nite sights
Flared mag well
Front and rear cocking serations
2/12 to 3 lb trigger
brown memory grove beaver tail
under cut triger guard
flat main spring housing
25 or 30 lpi front and back checkering
maybe 40 lpi on the front of the trigger guard
That is all I can think of righ now, but I am sure there will be more
I am building this for IDPA and out back shooting, not for carry
Keith

 

[sm]

Caspian Frame and Slide
1911 style
Check with Ned Christainsen ( Michiguns) up your way.
Richard Heinie

These two off top my head, great pistolsmiths, both gentlemen.
See American Pistolsmiths.

FWIW , I have been shooting someone's 9x23. One is a full tricked out race gun, another is a 5" model( single stack), and my favorite the Commander size( again single stack)--this may be the Perfect Carry Gun. Until I get rich and all I'll stay with a full size or Commander size 1911 in 45 ACP...but if I ever get a chance, I'll have one built...in the meantime I can shoot these when I want to...

 

[eerw]

Springfield and Colt are the two factory guns...sometimes they can still be found..or a 38 super or 9mm can be converted to by 9x23//replace the barrel and adjust other parts...

or as suggested..Caspian frame and slide..

two more suggestions for smiths to do the work..George Smith at EGW or Chuck Rogers..

George has down a couple 9x23s for me and all have been great in function, reliability and looks...

 

[farscott]

John Harrison of Precision Gunworks (Canton, GA) did my custom 9x23, and he did an amazing job. We started the project in early March of this year, and I had the gun in hand at the end of June, and the cost for the custom work came in under your target number. My best five-shot group with the 9x23 barrel, at fifty yards, is under an inch.

Any 9x19 or .38 Super 1911 is a suitable platform for a custom 9x23. I actually started with a Colt Series 80 Government Model chambered in 9x23 and added a 9x19 barrel.

Pics of my pistol can be seen at http://www.1911forum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=51304 .

 

[cowpuncher/pi]

I would ck. out Nowlin makers based in Oklahoma. The IDPA President in OKC shoots one in 45 acp. His round count is way over 20,000. He told me he has had no problems. They may be the best value for custom makers in the USA. Their base pistol comes in around 1350.00. They make one in 9x23. www.nowlinguns.com or 918-342-0689. Also the Nowlin family is big into IDPA and supporter's as well.

 

[Jim Watson]

I don't know what you are shooting at "out back" but 9x23 is way overkill for IDPA. It competes in ESP against .38 Super and 9mm P with a minimum power factor of 125. No reason not to either load it down to that level or just enjoy the bang of full power ammo at PF 180+, but I thought you might like to know.

Check ammo price and availability before you buy a low volume caliber like that, too. It will handload at the same cost as any autopistol round, but crawling around looking for the brass will not add to the fun factor. There are a lot of people adding 9mm P barrels to their 9x23s for economical blasting, but it will take a while to save the cost of an extra fitted barrel.

 

[Sean Smith]

Gotta agree, for IDPA you'd want either .45 for CDP or .38 Super/9x19mm for ESP. 9x23 would just be overkill on the PF. I'd save 9x23 for a practical weapon (124gr Silvertip@1,450+ is serious juce), or maybe in USPSA classes that allow .355" guns to hit Major PF.

9x23 is a totally rockin' caliber, but it is kind of obscure (it makes 10mm look like 9x19!) and not really suited for most "game gun" uses.

 

[sm]

The one's I "borrow" belong to guy whom was serious about IPSC. Saw the one my gunsmith used in competition and had to have one years ago.He competed with all 3. He carries one as CCW.

He also has taken deer and pigs with the 5 ". He would be the first to agree, yes its a serious caliber , it is not for everyone, he is blessed with money and time to shoot. If he just had to have one caliber for games, CCW and SD, he'd just build a Caspian 1911 in .45 ACP. Since he is out of the country and I'm allowed to shoot them...why not?

He doesn't compete anymore, he made an interesting comment that was alluded to earlier. He was CCW his Mil-Spec Colt in .45ACP, was out of state and invited to a local fun shoot..." kinda nice to just walk in buy generic ammo, some extra mags, borrow/share more ammo and mags and just go shoot".

Good Point!!

 

[farscott]

He was CCW his Mil-Spec Colt in .45ACP, was out of state and invited to a local fun shoot..." kinda nice to just walk in buy generic ammo, some extra mags, borrow/share more ammo and mags and just go shoot".

That is one of the major reasons I had a 9x19 barrel added to my 9x23 pistol. 9x23 rocks, but ammo procurement involves either planning or handloading. If I can find a Wal-Mart, I can find 9x19 ammo. Chasing 9x23 brass is a necessity when shooting the round. Sometimes it is nice to just shoot 9x19 and not worry about recovering every single piece of brass.

I keep hoping that 9x23 might become a bit more popular; I would love to see one of the major pistol manufacturers chamber pistols for this round. A 9x23 Glock or SIG Sauer would put this round on the map, especially if a law enforcement agency adopted the pistol. Once people try the round, its performance convinces; it truly is a .357 Magnum in an autoloading package. I have been playing with 158-grain loads for the 9x23, and the performance is impressive. However, the shooter (me) is not. This morning I never had a 5-shot, 50-yard group less than four inches. I know the pistol will shoot, so it is either me (most likely) or my loads. Still the quest is fun.

 

[sm]

I honestly don't believe the 9x23 will ever be as popular as say the 9mm, or 45 ACP . It is a great round, no doubt about it. The 1911 is my favorite platform and combine the two, what a combination.

Its comparable to the 28 ga, in a way. Most whom know the 28ga know what it does in bird hunting, clay games and the pattern board. It is very effective and the payload to bore is a great combo. It too is offered in many nice platforms, it is a bit pricey , one scrounges for hulls, and the greatest user is the competition shooter whom reloads.

John Q. Public will buy the 9mm and .45 ACP, the same as he buys the 12 and 20 bores. Mfg's are going to follow the money in ammo and platforms.

Bad groups:
Barometric Pressure--Morn
Humidity --Afternoon


What--you don't keep the" Official THR Excuse Book "in your range Bag?
I thought everybody had at least one copy.

 

[eerw]

yup..have to agree with y'all the 9x23 is a reloaders cartrdge or a rich man's cartridge to be able to stay stocked up..it is quite the performer...and I enjoy the ease of which it shoots and handles..

it is too bad that ammo is expensive and hard to find..wouldn;t a whitebox valueback be really cool at the Walmart counter...anyway..


would anyone be interested in sharing 9x23 loads???

 

[Clark]

I have bought Tokarev pistols for $150 and got a 9x19mm barrel for $39.

I got a 9x23mm reamer from Brownell's for $60.

Put a little oil on the reamer, a few twists of the wrist until the 9x23mm case chambers, and I have a 9x23mm.


I have been shooting twice [double] the max powder charge for 357 mag with 158 gr XTPs but at the shorter OAL of 1.36" [357 mag is 1.59"]. I takes some finesse to get that much powder to fit. Win brass was needed for this trick, it is too high in pressure for Starline 9mm Supercomp brass.

But my loads kick way to hard for normal people, and I just mention it to show how tough my Tokarevs have proved to be.

One can spend $1800 for a 1911 9x23mm that is heavier, wider, and will not take a 1.36" OAL cartridge.
It depends on what you are after, function or jewelry.

 

[telomerase]

Is there any advantage of 9 X 23 over .357 Sig? I like the idea of bottlenecked auto cartridges for feeding reliability.

 

[Clark]

A few years ago I was once stuck with more power out of the 9x19mm overloaded than I could get out of the 40S&W or 10mm overloaded.
Then I got better case support, and now I can get more power from overloaded 40S&Ws and my one 10mm than from an overloaded 9mm.


I am still stuck with the 357Sig.
My two 357S pistols, when overloaded, give up the primer while outputting less power than I can get from any of my overloaded 9x19mms.
I have tried necking down many brand of 40 S&W brass, and I can get just one more grain of powder before the primer falls out than from Starline 357Sig brass.

The 9x23mm OTOH, is putting out way more than the 9x19mm, which is putting out way more than the 357Sig.

I am not talking about factory ammo or book loads. For those the 357 Sig is more powerful than the 9mm.

 

[farscott]

The biggest advantage of 9x23 over the .357 SIG is the case allows the use of heavy bullets. I do not believe the bottlenecked case of the .357 SIG will allow the use of bullets heavier than 125 grains. I am not convinced that bottlenecked cartridges have any feeding advantages; I wonder if the rounds tend to tip downward in the magazine due to the bottleneck. I also believe the 9x23 allows higher velocities for any given bullet weight and barrel length than the .357 SIG.

r31973, Thanks for the excuses.

 

[Sean Smith]

From a 1911, anyway, the 9x23 is just about a perfect feeder... almost straight shot into the chamber with a tapered case.

Tokarev + 9x23 = insanity.

 

[Clark]

Sean,

Tokarev + 9x23 = insanity.

Is there any real data, calculations, or any useful knowlegde behind that statement?

I have been shooting 9x23mm in Tokarevs for a few years, and I load them up until the primer falls out of Win9x23mm brass.

I would like to know if you know anything.