A 25acp to dominate competition

[dashootist]

Hi,

I am looking for a full size handgun to dominate a local falling steel plate competition. Most competitors are IDPA/IPSA specialists, and they use 9mm or .40 and are pretty darn fast. But since there' no power factor requirement in this match, I'm thinking I could get a edge on everyone by shooting the least recoiling caliber possible. Accuracy is not a big issue; target is only about 20 yards or less away. Shooting fast is the big factor. Rimfire is declared illegal. Red dot is also illegal. Iron sight only. So 25acp would be perfect. Is there a full size steel frame 25acp with about 10 rounds capacity with crisp single action trigger and decent barrel length? If not, would a gunsmith be able to convert a 1911 22LR to a 25acp gun? My budget is $1000. I'm ready to do what it takes to dominate to competition.

 

[beatledog7]

I'm not a falling steel plate shooter, but if in fact the idea is to make the plates fall, I wonder if you can load .25ACP safely yet strong enough to reliably make the plates fall.

They do have to fall, right?

 

[2wheels]

Will a .25ACP reliably knock over a steel plate?

I've never once heard of a full sized 25ACP handgun, not sure what the point would be... I also don't know if you could convert a rimfire 1911 to centerfire.

Personally, and this may not be what you want to hear... I'd go with a 9mm and practice a lot, who cares if you don't dominate against experienced competitors? You're learning and having fun.

 

[1KPerDay]

Sounds like a trolling post to me..

And my question would be the same as beatles... will a .25 knock down the plates?

I'm ready to do what it takes to dominate to competition.

Then get a good 9mm or .40 and practice.

 

[mgmorden]

Most competitions have rules as to minimum bullet diameter. I know Steel Challenge requires at least 9mm luger or larger for centerfire competition.

In any event, you mention falling steel in which case if you go too light you may not reliably knock down the steel.

What a lot of the steel challenge guys do is to take a 9mm Luger handgun, run the lightest recoil spring they can get away with (often 11lbs or so), and then load up the 85-95 gr .380 bullets in them only as powerful as it takes to cycle the action. Done right you can have a 9mm shooting incredibly light.

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

With that $1,000, you could buy a lot of ammo to practice with 9mm and if you don't have a gun, you could get a used Glock or Ruger and still have a lot of money left to practice with.

 

[BCRider]

I've seen enough cases of even 9mm failing to knock over fallers where the lean adjuster rattled loose or that where shifted on the ground during matches to strongly suspect that a .25 would be a waste of time. Now if all you had to do was ring a fixed steel gong then that would be a whole other story.

Maybe a .380acp which is lighter in recoil than a 9 but still has a better amount of energy in the bullet?

Even better would be to shoot revolver if the stages are "revolver friendly" with only 5 fallers. .38Spl from a big N frame Model 27 or 28 has an extremely soft recoil. Almost .22 like.

 

[Shadow 7D]

Um, not going to find it
consider something like a S&W 52 with powder puff .38
or reloading your own 9mm for a powder puff round
you might find something in .32 like a CZ83 or Beretta 81-85 series, but not in .25

 

[TonyT]

You can use one of the 32 S&W Long semi autos made for international competition - Walther GSP, Pardini HP, etc. Loaded with 98 gr. LWC they will knock down the plates. Pricey guns with 5 shot magazines but you can load one inthe chamber and have 6 shot capability.

 

[brickeyee]

dominate a local falling steel plate competition

Look up momentum and you will start to understand why a .25 ACP is not going to do the job.

 

[45_auto]

I am looking for a full size handgun to dominate a local falling steel plate competition

If you aren't already winning or placing within a tenth of a second or so of the winner every week,then going to a .25 isn't going to be enough to help you win, much less dominate. At the top competitive level it's about 99% skill and 1% gun. You're not going to be able to make enough difference to overcome natural reflexes and talent at a competitive event. What kind of times do you turn in? Try just even hitting them (don't worry about knocking them down) with a .22 and see what kind of times you can achieve. My guess is that you still won't be close to the winner's time.

If you want to be competitive for the A class win in the stock gun steel plate events around here, you better be able to consistently take them all down in less than 1.5 seconds. I'm usually between 1.5 and 2.0 seconds and end up bottom of the A or top of the B.

Most people can't even hit them fast enough (not even trying to take them down) with a .22 to be competitive in the A class.

 

[MrBorland]

Try just even hitting them (don't worry about knocking them down) with a .22 and see what kind of times you can achieve.

45_auto's giving some good advice here. Also, plates can go down with a .22, but the hit has to be perfect. It'll likely be the same with a .25acp. The advantage you seek will be offset by your speed to get a perfect hit.

get a good 9mm or .40 and practice.

Gotta agree with 1KPerDay, and others. Winning matches comes from practice, not gear. There's simply no way around it.

 

[R.W.Dale]

before the days of the various combat themed shooting games 32 in either S&W long or ACP flavor was thought of as THE handgun target caliber.

Go over to gunbroker and look at the plethora of browning patterned 32/7.65 caliber pre war and early post pistols with target sights. A search for "MAB" usually finds you a few.

 

[dashootist]

Oh, I totally forgot about having to make the plate fall. I've tried to shoot those plates with 22LR, and it goes down only if it is hit high. The hinge on the the bottom. I've also tried 32 s&w long loaded hot; these have no problem with the plates.

 

[45_auto]

Oh, I totally forgot about having to make the plate fall. I've tried to shoot those plates with 22LR

What were your times just hitting the plates with the .22 (not knocking them down)?

What are the times of the guys winning the competitions?

 

[dashootist]

No time. Just mano a mano. I'm no where near being in the elite group. But I don't have fancy race guns with 2 lb trigger either.

 

[mavracer]

I'm no where near being in the elite group. But I don't have fancy race guns with 2 lb trigger either.

Yep if I just had better shoes I could win the NY marathon.

 

[BCRider]

As said by someone further up, if you're not already near the top then even a race gun with whatever trigger you like isn't going to put you there. And neither would a soft shooting .32 or .25. It's far more about the shooter and not so much what they shoot.

 

[NOLAEMT]

As has been said...

Its not the gun, and there is a reason that no one has heard of a 25acp race gun. There is no advantage to be had there.

 

[wally]

And my question would be the same as beatles... will a .25 knock down the plates?

The plates at our club fall to .25ACP about the same as they do to .22LR -- as long as you hit them in the upper 2/3 rds. Maybe sight edge to the .25 as it was with a 2" barrel out of my Beretta 950 compared to 4-7.5" barrel out of my various .22 pistols. The 25ACP rounds were 50 gr while the .22 were 36-40 gr. They used to make a 4" barreled variation of the 950, but I'm afraid if you found one it'd be collector expensive and the 950 sights are not even as good as a GI 1911.

Its not the gun, and there is a reason that no one has heard of a 25acp race gun. There is no advantage to be had there

Absolutely, its the Indian, not the arrow that matters, but at my age a red dot helps a lot more than lower recoil does, although no doubt I'm faster with the .22s than I am with a 9mm.

The reason .22 is not allowed at his matches, is likely that it would quickly evolve to being what everyone used unless they could regulate the plates so .22 wouldn't knock them down -- can be done at our club's plate racks, but for free-standing plates that would mean buying heavier plates. So I can see his point, but IMHO its just not worth it.

I'd suggest something like a full sized steel framed 1911 9mm shooting 147 gr ammo just hot enough to cycle the pistol (~3.5gr Unique works for me with Missouri Bullet company 147gr hard cast) and an upgrade to a fiber optic front sight.

 

[gazpacho]

25NAA

It is a necked down 32 acp. Have someone rebarrel a 32 acp beretta or cz, and try that.

 

[MedWheeler]

^^ .25 NAA is probably a good idea. ^^ What about the FNH FiveseveN? I've not shot one, but recoil is supposed to be quite marginal, though it goes for a little above your price point. Another possibility might be the .22 MicroMag 1911 pistol, also at just above a grand.

 

[railroader]

You need to reload. You can run 90gr. 380 bullets in 9mm cases. Use a reduced power recoil spring and you can set up a 9mm to run with very light recoil.

 

[Bohemus]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lercker_pistol
or Scorpion in .32

 

[Pyro]

Why not take a .25 acp and convert it to .45 acp?