A BG at your window at night.

[threefeathers]

a friend lives in a rural situation with the nearest neighbor hundreds of yards away.
He was home and at 0 dark thirty his dog began barking. My friend grabbed his flashlight and handgun and began searching. He saw movement near a window of his home. Wallking stealthfully he slowly opened his rear door and began to creep around the house. He did not light his flashlight because he could hear someone at the rear window that was around the corner.
He rounded the corner and saw a large fellow trying to life the window open. My friend quickly lit his 100+ Lumen flashlight that was in his left hand and pointed his handgun in his right hand, the crook reached in his belt line but quickly showed both hands empty when he realized my friend was armed.
It was then that my friend realized that he had left himself in a position he couldn't call for help, with both hands filled he couldn't use his cell phone and the nearest neighbor couldn't hear him.
The BG began to back up and suddenly broke into a run. My friend did not see a weapon on the BG so he didn't shoot and he was barefoot so he couldn't chase.
My friend backed up into the house, locked up and called the sheriff. My firend went to the neighbors houses the next morning and one or two told him they had also found someone on their land. One of the neighbors identified the fellow as someone he knew and the BG turned out to be quite a dangerous guy.

 

[Sam1911]

Interesting. As someone once pointed out, it is always a good idea to know exactly what you plan to do with that gun when you pull it out.

Aside from staging a face-to-face confrontation with someone who could have turned the tables and harmed your friend, it sounds like he did figured out just the right thing to do with that gun: stand there and let him run! Shooting someone running away from your home would be very bad.

It is also very, VERY good that the intruder did not manage to hear him leave the house, or just happen to be heading his way when your pal rounded the corner. (Or have a habit of immediately shooting at lights pointed his way!) There's a fine line between geting the drop on him, and him getting the drop on you. Seems like more could have been done, and far more safely, from inside the house.

 

[Texan Scott]

ding ding ding! ^ winner!

what if the guy had been faster, or not where the homeowner last saw him, or not ALONE, or had gone aound the other way and into the house, or... or... or...

the homeowner lost more tactical advantage than he gained. he put himself at INCREASED risk (and potentially DECREASED his legal justification for subsequent use of force); he put MORE distance between himself and any family member he wanted to protect or that might have protected him. DON'T go out looking for trouble! if trouble wants in that bad, make him do all the work.

 

[M2 Carbine]

He was home and at 0 dark thirty his dog began barking. My friend grabbed his flashlight and handgun and began searching.

Because it could be a number of things, like a Coyote, I can imagine myself "searching" outside to.

the crook reached in his belt line but quickly showed both hands empty when he realized my friend was armed.

In such as this the criminal probably would have been shot several times when he reached for his belt line.

State laws differ but a criminal has to have a death wish to do such as this in Texas.

It was then that my friend realized that he had left himself in a position he couldn't call for help, with both hands filled he couldn't use his cell phone and the nearest neighbor couldn't hear him.

This is why I favor a gun mounted laser/light like the Streamlight TLR-2.
The gun, sight and light are in one hand leaving the other hand free for using a cell phone, flashlight, opening doors, etc.

 

[Certaindeaf]

What kind of dog does your friend have? Sometimes they need let out at night, they being our best friends and all..

 

[RoboDuck]

The safest tactic would have been to stay put inside and call the sheriff.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Yea, you got a deathwish if you hear a noise and walk outside at night on your own property. I'd call the man.

 

[M2 Carbine]

The safest tactic would have been to stay put inside and call the sheriff.

Yea, you got a deathwish if you hear a noise and walk outside at night on your own property. I'd call the man.

"The man" is going to get pretty busy and right irritated if he's constantly called by country people every time they hear a critter/noise late at night.

But like I said, BG's on your country property (in some states) seldom happens because the BG stands an excellent chance of being shot dead and they know it.



Some years ago a friend's wife, in town, late at night, heard someone at the window. In the room she approached the window from the side them stuck the double barrel 12 ga in the guys face. He fell backwards in his haste to get away.
The guy is lucky that my friend wasn't home. My friend would have blown the guy's head off. (and it would have been a completely legal shoot)


Like the Sheriff told me a few years ago when, probably, a couple young punks did a little damage on my shooting range,
"If you catch them, when you finish with them, give me a call and I'll come out and pick up what's left."

 

[Pilot]

Never open your door, nor leave the house when you suspect a BG outside. Lock up, retreat to your bedroom, stay armed and call law enforcement if you still feel there is a threat.

 

[floorit76]

To the people recomending to retreat and call the PD. Do you realize that the response time in some rural areas can be measured in hours?

 

[Sam1911]

To the people recomending to retreat and call the PD. Do you realize that the response time in some rural areas can be measured in hours?

Of course. But you need them to come regardless of what happens next, so might as well get them on the way.

Note, no-one is saying call the police and then surrender to the bad guy hoping the cops will save you.

What is being advised is to use all your tools of defense to protect yourself most effectively. That means starting with using your positional advantage -- he's outside, you're inside. He can't get in without alerting you to his location and direction. You can position yourself, move, arm up, move your loved ones, make your calls, etc, without him being able to see you or reach you.

You can warn him off -- the VERY best defense -- without exposing yourself and risking injury or death. (Any violent interaction that ends with NO bloodshed is far better than being killed or killing anyone.)

If that doesn't work and he's determined to get at you, you can force him to come through your prepared approach -- through the choke points and into your "kill" zone. If you go out to meet him face to face, you're giving him pretty "fair" odds. If you make him attack your defended position his chances drop toward zero. (As do the chances that any accomplices can flank you or overwhelm you.)

 

[floorit76]

I agree that waiting for him to enter is a better tactic. I just like to remind the more urban members that things aren't the same all over.

 

[Sam1911]

"The man" is going to get pretty busy and right irritated if he's constantly called by country people every time they hear a critter/noise late at night.

We've beaten that horse pretty near to death before, but there are clear differences between calling the cops over a raccoon in the garbage and walking out into some felons' impromptu ambush.

You should use positional advantage to OBSERVE carefully to determine exactly what the trouble is, or at least isn't. Nothing going on outside needs you to RUSH out there right this minute and face it down. Take the time to figure out what you're dealing with before you expose yourself. If you can determine that the noise you heard ISN'T a home intruder or an escapee from the local maximum security prison, but is clearly an animal digging in your garbage or scaring your chickens, fine go scare it off or shoot it. A human intruder isn't likely to sound exactly like a raccoon eating your garbage, and you can use at least three senses in many cases to help you figure out what's going on -- as well as your windows, lights, CCTV/security system, dog and so on.

If you really, really can't tell what it is that has raised your alarms, hunker down, prepare, and wait in a position that offers you every advantage. If it's worth worrying about, you'll know soon enough.

 

[Kleanbore]

Posted by M2 Carbine: "The man" is going to get pretty busy and right irritated if he's constantly called by country people every time they hear a critter/noise late at night.

Why would anyone do that?

But like I said, BG's on your country property (in some states) seldom happens because the BG stands an excellent chance of being shot dead and they know it.

Whether it seldom happens or not depends a lot on where one is with respect to immigration paths or meth country, and on who walks though to get where and in what numbers.

Regardless, he or she who traipses outside with gun in hand feeling invincible also stands an excellent chance of getting shot.

My friend would have blown the guy's head off. (and it would have been a completely legal shoot).

You are making an assumption about who would have shot whom.

 

[Trent]

Interesting topic of conversation.

I also live out in the boonies, with a predictably long police response time.

Anyone have some ideas to improve on situational awareness here?

A couple I thought of;

* Exterior lighting, switched from indoors. (We have big flood lights on each corner of the house I can turn on from inside)

* Motion sensor lighting around entrances to the building (although I tend to ignore them as an "alert" due to 'coons, deer, and other critters setting them off all the time, it DOES light up an area when there's motion, meaning I don't have to take conscious action to do so; also helpful to find my keys when I'm coming home..)

* DVR low light cameras to cover the blind spots, and possible ingress points. (Decent models available online for 200-300 bucks)

I would think that given the above three things, you shouldn't HAVE to leave your house to see what is going on at any given time. Plus, if you feel you DO have to (someone breaking in to your car, whatever), you know what exit to use and what direction to approach them from.

Anyone have other ideas for rural living?

 

[alsaqr]

Regardless, he or she who traipses outside with gun in hand feeling invincible also stands an excellent chance of getting shot.

+1
Going outside at night based on a disturbance is asking for trouble. Example: There may be more perps than you can deal with.

 

[Kleanbore]

Posted by Trent: Anyone have some ideas to improve on situational awareness here?

A couple I thought of;

* Exterior lighting, switched from indoors. (We have big flood lights on each corner of the house I can turn on from inside)

* Motion sensor lighting around entrances to the building (although I tend to ignore them as an "alert" due to 'coons, deer, and other critters setting them off all the time, it DOES light up an area when there's motion, meaning I don't have to take conscious action to do so; also helpful to find my keys when I'm coming home..)

* DVR low light cameras to cover the blind spots, and possible ingress points. (Decent models available online for 200-300 bucks)

Good ideas.

 

[floorit76]

We used to use a wireless driveway alarm. There are IR and magnetometer models. We had the IR, and did have plenty of false alarms, but it was still handy. The magnetometer is great for vehicles, but not someone on foot. Our dogs figured out that the alarm meant that someone was coming, and would raise holy h#ll, so anyone coming to the door was greated by a couple aggitated critters. Loved it, except for the 2 am false alarms. Once a spider built a web accross the sensor and it went off constantly for a few days till I saw it.

 

[M2 Carbine]

You are making an assumption about who would have shot whom.

Not at all. The shotgun was in the guy's face before he knew it. The difference is the wife let the criminal go, but my friend probably would have pulled the trigger.



There's a big difference between "traipsing outside" to confront an unknown in daylight or dark and controlling the situation because you know the layout of your property, and the best action to take, whether the situation calls for staying inside or going outside.



But I do agree that most people should not confront a threat at night. Most people aren't competent enough to confront a threat in daylight and VERY few people have done ANY low light/dark live fire practice at all.
(personally I practice shooting live fire low light/dark shooting about 4-5 evenings a week)

 

[Kleanbore]

Posted by M2 Carbine: There's a big difference between "rushing outside" to confront an unknown in daylight or dark and controlling the situation because you know the layout of your property, and the best action to take, whether the situation calls for staying inside or going outside.

Knowing the layout of your property is a fine thing, but unless you know where all of whom may be out there happen to be and what they intend to do, you do not "control the situation."

But I do agree that most people should not confront a threat at night. Most people aren't competent enough to confront a threat in daylight and VERY few people have done ANY low light/dark live fire practice at all.
(personally I practice shooting live fire low light/dark shooting about 4-5 evenings a week)

So, just how do you propose to "confront a threat at night" without putting your self at great risk of being caught in a crossfire?

Having practiced shooting in low light is a fine thing, but remember, you have to locate all of whomever you intend to "confront" , and you have to identify them and ascertain their motives before you shoot. I would not expect real criminals to do that. That puts you at an extreme disadvantage.

 

[Frank Ettin]

It looks like all the basis have been covered. This topic comes up fairly regularly.