A Carbine. What Caliber?

[Warp]

If I am building a pistol caliber carbine it's in 9x19 because that is my main pistol round and because it is less expensive.

But if I want to pretend it can do everything, it's 10mm or. 357, determined by semi auto or lever preference (and willingness to pay for 10 and or reload)

 

[bigfatdave]

I have one in 9x19 (sub2000, takes Block19 mags)
I want one in .45acp now (mech-tech)

Which is ballisticlly superior in a 16" barrel isn't really interesting, I just like PCCs. Neither would ever see serious use past 50 yards, and probably no real range use past 100.

And .22TCM is the obvious choice for a PCC round anyway, it wasn't listed though.

 

[meanmrmustard]

I voted 10mm.

Because I can buy it these days without having to search too hard. Plus, it packs the wholop I want out of a PCC. Other than higher accuracy, what's the point of that benefit if the bullet doesn't kill crap when it arrives.

10mm kills stuff.

 

[wlewisiii]

So you're building a carbine to do everything. What caliber is it in? Why?

The one I'm building on a VZ-24 action is in 7x57. Pistol calibers are good for pistols, not carbines.

 

[Warp]

450 socom and_. 50 are a bit more expensive than 10mm. And one could easily have a pistol in 10mm for ammo consolidation

 

[mookiie]

I am saying .45 because you have stopping power if you need it, and you can tailor your bullet to control over penetration if needed. The only issue would be bullet drop at longer ranges.

 

[Revoliver]

Voted 10mm. If I'm going to build a cabine to do everything, I want it to be in a caliber that can squeeze every biy of benefit a longer barrel can give and vica versa with a fat heavy bullet.

 

[Reloadron]

So you're building a carbine to do everything. What caliber is it in? Why?

So you want a handgun caliber. From the available choices and only the available choices I would choose the 357 Magnum cartridge.

My personal choice would be a .44 Magnum which is not listed, so I went with the .357 Magnum.

So you're building a carbine to do everything.

Good luck with "everything" as with the given choices I don't see "everything" happening. Then too my everything and your everything are likely a different everything.

EDIT: Never mind, just caught it was .357 Sig and not .357 Magnum. I guess then from the choices the .357 Sig.

Ron

 

[45bthompson]

A Short 357 mag lever gun sure is handy .375 mag is big enough to hunt with. I can share ammo with my revolvers. Plus I can shoot .38's for cheap fun.

 

[Dr.Rob]

My only 'pistol caliber carbine' is a 44 Magnum lever action rifle.

Hard to 'build one from scratch', but if there was a way to make a rimmed 44 mag round feed in an AR action... yes I'd want one.

My only long gun stamped 'carbine' is in 5.56mm.

 

[2zulu1]

No choice for none of the above. In pistol calibers you'll be limited to TMJ/FMJ or WFNs, JHPs will not hold together at carbine velocities.

I have a CX-4 Storm, this is what a 165gr Gold Dot looks like when pushed too fast;



10mm will only exasperate an already bad combination.

A 124gr Gold Dot at only 1268fps;



If you're deadset on a carbine in handgun calibers, get a lever action in one of the mags or 45 Colt.

 

[B!ngo]

Carbine = uses pistol calibers.
Rifle = uses rifle calibers.

Nopee. As others have noted. This isn't a carbine quiz. It's a PCC (pistol caliber carbine) quiz.
With respect to PCC's, I'll take an MP5 in 9x19. About the best designed PCC in history. And having an AT94 (the MP5 exact clone w/16" barrel) I have a personal bias.
If money was no object, I'd likely go with either an MP5 carbine chambered in 10MM or a PS90 with 50 round magazines and a large supply of legal ammo.
Again, for PCC's that is.
B

 

[Panzercat]

If you're deadset on a carbine in handgun calibers, get a lever action in one of the mags or 45 Colt.

Me and levergun carbines are already well acquainted



Back to auto-loading cartridges...

 

[meanmrmustard]

No choice for none of the above. In pistol calibers you'll be limited to TMJ/FMJ or WFNs, JHPs will not hold together at carbine velocities.

I have a CX-4 Storm, this is what a 165gr Gold Dot looks like when pushed too fast;



10mm will only exasperate an already bad combination.

A 124gr Gold Dot at only 1268fps;



If you're deadset on a carbine in handgun calibers, get a lever action in one of the mags or 45 Colt.

What's the downside again?

I see violent expansion. If penetration was what you were looking for, coupled with expansion in soft tissue at higher velocity...why not copper solid hollow points?

It isn't the cartridge that failed, nor the rifle. It was your choice of ammo. As for 10mm, I don't see a speed increase hindering lead solids, or Barnes solid copper for that matter.

 

[BCRider]

'mustard, I could be wrong but I read into 2zulu1's post that the rounds expanded like this just due to the air and higher than normal velocities. If that's not the case hopefully he returns to clear up what made them expand like this.

 

[meanmrmustard]

'mustard, I could be wrong but I read into 2zulu1's post that the rounds expanded like this just due to the air and higher than normal velocities. If that's not the case hopefully he returns to clear up what made them expand like this.

I'm hoping not, because I'd have to call malarkey.

I've not seen that in ANY PCC firing bonded hollow points, let alone cast or copper solids. Ever.

 

[Walkalong]

I've got ARs...and when I wanted a pistol-caliber carbine, I went with a 9mm. Cheap to shoot, low recoil, and I've got ammo cans (plural) in the garage.

Yep, cheap, easy to carry plenty of ammo, ammo everywhere, free brass everywhere, plenty enough gun for close up, etc,.

 

[backbencher]

I voted for 9mm, but I own a Kel-Tec SUB-2000 in .40" S&W. The SUB-2000 is the bee's knees in PCC.

 

[Warp]

I had a Sub2k. I decided people only thought it was the bee's knees because there isn't any real competition, and sold it.

But it didn't fail on me when I had it, at least. That's not bad for a KelTec

 

[c1ogden]

I chose 9mm because its the only one on your list that I currently use and always have on hand. The PD issued Ruger PC9 carbines and they were very nice but if I had my choice I'd also like a 38/357 version of Ruger's .44 mag carbine.

 

[bannockburn]

I voted for the 9mm. I have plenty of it and my favorite carbine years ago was a Sterling Mk.6. I use to limit myself to 6 mags per range session because that gun could burn through ammo really quick!

 

[Luger_carbine]

I feel I would be remiss in my duties if I didn't suggest 9mm Luger

 

[BCRider]

So you're building a carbine to do everything. What caliber is it in? Why?

OK, I'll play too.

First off your choice of options most certainly tosses the "do everything" part in the flusher. Any pistol caliber carbine is going to be limited compared to a rifle caliber.

You don't believe this? Check out the external ballistics calculator at http://www.hornady.com/ballistics-resource/ballistics-calculator . It's a great resource for playing "what if....".

A 124gn 9mm zipping along at 1200 fps, which wouldn't be far off what the round would manage from a carbine length barrel, shows a whopping 44 inches of drop and velocity is down to 900 fps. It'll definetly still hurt anything alive you are shooting at but it's pretty obviously far from a "do everything" sort of option.

And none of the other handgun calibers do much better. Try them out for yourself.

As I see it the chief advantage of a PCC over the handguns shooting the same ammo is mostly the increase in stability for longer shots to 50 and 100 yards. This comes from being better able to support the rifle style more steadily than many folks can hold a handgun.

The increase in size and weight over the handgun also makes a PCC faster for shooting at multiple targets in many cases. This "many cases" referring to us simple types that can't hit targets as fast as shooters like Todd Jarret or Jerry Miculek or any of the other top match shooters. For us common folks generally a PCC can let us recover and get on the next target and get a shot off faster than we can do this with a handgun. Not a whole lot faster but enough that it shows in times for things like Steel Challenge or my own club's down home version of that sport. The PCC carbine guys can typically shoot the 5 targets in about 60% to 75% of the time they do the same stages with their center fire semi auto handguns.

If this isn't what you had in mind you might want to expand a little on your original post so we have a better idea of what you mean by "do everything".

 

[Auto426]

For an "everything" gun, I would opt for some more than a pistol caliber, like 5.56 in an AR. But if I wanted a pistol caliber carbine, I would opt for either a 9mm AR or a lever action in a magnum caliber.

 

[Panzercat]

First off your choice of options most certainly tosses the "do everything" part in the flusher.

I would require it to make me waffles in bed as well.

But seriously, in terms of do everything you're allowed some mental leeway since no round will obviously do everything. Except 30-06. But everybody knows that. So given the inherant known advantages and disadvantages, velocity tables penetration and sporty colors that the round come in (green makes for better zombie slaying, for example), I'm assuming you would opt for 9mm from the choices present as well.