A Letter to Ron Paul about reopening the Machinegun registry.
- Thread starter Sambo82
- Start date
- Status
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Certainly true. We can say that we don't consider people who do so "BAD" or "EVIL"...but yes, they are criminal.
bamawrx
Member
Id say non-registered machine guns easily exceeds 100,000 in number. If an amnesty were to ever be established everyone with a m2 parts kit or 80% side plate will be registering there "item". The total number of amnesty items would actually be closer to several hundred thousand given a 90 day amnesty period. You would be crazy not to pull grandpa's stuff out of the closet and put in on the NFA registry if the opportunity presented itself. Just think of all the parts kits sold at gun shows over the last 30+ years.
I don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but there are unregistered M2 Carbine machineguns floating around out there in semi auto form. Every now and then some guy inherits a rifle and wants to know what it's worth and posts pics on the internet or takes it to a gun show. Since it says M2 on it, it's a machinegun to the ATF. If it wasn't entered in the 1968 NFA amnesty registry, or the family didn't know it was and didn't have the paperwork and/or the previous owner didn't have any auto parts in it, they don't know it's a machine gun just because it's stamped "M2" on the receiver instead of "M1". I've seen an M1 that had all the script scrubbed where it should've said CAL. .30 M1 or M2.
It's a shame to lose a WWII piece of history because it wasn't registered or the paperwork is lost.
It's a shame to lose a WWII piece of history because it wasn't registered or the paperwork is lost.
AlexanderA
Member
A 90-day amnesty wouldn't be adequate. The period has to be much longer so as to allow time for discussion, and give people confidence to come forward. During the 1968 amnesty, there was a lot of talk (I heard some of it myself) that the registration was just a first step toward confiscation, and that they'd rather keep their guns off the books than take that chance. This turned out to have been a very expensive mistake.
Secondly, an amnesty solves only part of the problem. There should be a way of registering new guns going forward. So, opening the registry means two things: an amnesty for existing guns, and the ability to Form 1 / Form 2 new (or converted) machine guns.
Secondly, an amnesty solves only part of the problem. There should be a way of registering new guns going forward. So, opening the registry means two things: an amnesty for existing guns, and the ability to Form 1 / Form 2 new (or converted) machine guns.
Orkan
Member
Not being able to buy a new machine gun is very disturbing. If that's not "infringement" on our rights, then I don't know what is.
bamawrx
Member
The law's wording says something like "up to 90 day" amnesty can be declared by attorney general or something to that effect. That's why I said 90 day. I expected bush may do it at the very end of his term, but didn't happen. Of course, multiple 90 day periods could be declared. Be fine with me. There would be a mad dash to make or finish parts to then amnesty register, so I suspect that may be the hold up. Similar thing happened in 1986, but that was old manufacturing technology and no internet. You give us a 90 day period today and watch out. Just think how many side plates a water jet could cut out in a day for instance.
AlexanderA
Member
Remember that in an "amnesty" you are admitting that you have committed a crime. It's just that that admission can't be used against you. I'd rather not have that admission in the record.
bamawrx
Member
You can amnesty register something or wait and buy it later once its transferable again. Won't be mine or anyone's business which you choose. The point is that IF an amnesty were to take be declared many hundreds of thousands of new registration would likely be filed, and I could see over a million being a real possibility.
Frankly, you would be a fool to not drill auto sear holes in all of your AR receivers and file the paperwork during an amnesty. The price of transferables would take a temporary hit, but would quickly go back up. Just like what happened when Vector Arms had "new" uzi's for sale for $3,000 a pop. That held down the price of uzi's for a while, but they are now double that price since the supply was quickly absorbed by the market.
Frankly, you would be a fool to not drill auto sear holes in all of your AR receivers and file the paperwork during an amnesty. The price of transferables would take a temporary hit, but would quickly go back up. Just like what happened when Vector Arms had "new" uzi's for sale for $3,000 a pop. That held down the price of uzi's for a while, but they are now double that price since the supply was quickly absorbed by the market.
mortablunt
Member
I'm not a Ron Paul supporter, but could we get this guy running the ATF and gun policy?
Tootie
Member
Pseudo MG
Or to make life even easier, spend $350 for a bumpfire stock and you effectively have a machine gun for under $1,000 with no tax or other requirements. While I do own a couple of MG's, I am much more comfortable with the SlideFire stock. Easy to control, keeps you smilin'! I just wish there were more than one range in San Antonio to shoot MG's.
Or to make life even easier, spend $350 for a bumpfire stock and you effectively have a machine gun for under $1,000 with no tax or other requirements. While I do own a couple of MG's, I am much more comfortable with the SlideFire stock. Easy to control, keeps you smilin'! I just wish there were more than one range in San Antonio to shoot MG's.
Orkan
Member
Yet one can be a criminal, and be completely morally right. Consider those who wrote the declaration of independence for instance. They were all branded criminals. History is filled with examples of those who broke unjust laws and are regarded as patriots.
What makes people think our time is any different than those of the past?
The law is always used to enslave a populace. One cannot rule, and be a criminal, now can they? Rather, they modify the rule to suit their behavior. Now think of certain members of congress, and how they submit countless pieces of anti-gun legislation, while exempting themselves and their staff.
If one cares to, you can draw a great many parallels between our current so-called leaders, and evil tyrants of the past.
It's really not hard. One statement defines it in full, without any explanation or interpretation required; “Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.”
― Thomas Jefferson
The government, military, LEO, and various other agents of the government can legally buy newly manufactured machine guns.
I, as a citizen of this country in good standing, can not.
While not directly related to this thread, you can find countless instances of things that government agents are allowed to do or simply get away with that would land a regular citizen in federal prison.
The average person's grasp of true freedom in this country is enough to make me vomit. Our every move is regulated by the tyrants in our government, yet all anyone wants to do is "calm down" and marginalize those who speak out. Make no mistake, we will be our own undoing, as we've lost the ability to keep our republic. Statements by people on this forum in regard to our rights assures me of it. While trying to act so civilized and evolved, they submit themselves for rule by any willing tyrant.
Does it really matter what name the tyrant goes by? Republican, Democrat, socialist, liberal, conservative. It matters not. Anyone that would deny someone else their liberty or rights granted by God is by very definition a tyrant. Our government is a law creating force numbering in the hundreds of thousands. Their entire purpose, is to create law, yet there is no real consideration given to whether law is required.
How many laws can possibly be created?
We've reached a point where virtually every law that is created, will absolutely infringe on personal liberty for the sake of collective welfare.
The label of criminal has absolutely no meaning to me. The act of the person in question is where the value is assigned. Child rapist, murderer, thief. Those are absolutely morally wrong and everyone knows it from the time they are able to comprehend their actions.
I refuse to allow the government to decide what I view to be wrong.
If someone were to make an illegal machine gun, that is their prerogative. I'll hold no ill will toward them. If they go on a murderous rampage, it will not be the fault of the condition of their firearm.
Orkan
Member
That's exactly why the majority of them will never get on board with it. Greed is a terrible thing.
Walther P99
Member
I completely agree.. Unfortunately
zignal_zero
Member
Tootie - I have shot both the slidedire stock and MG's. You really find them comparable? To me, its like comparing intercourse to masturbation. HUGE DIFFERENCE
TurtlePhish
Member
Family friendly, zignal_zero, family friendly...
zignal_zero
Member
Yea it actually took me awhile to remember what the proper way to say those two things was
gun lover 18403
Member
- Joined
- Apr 28, 2012
- Messages
- 3
I wanted to let you know about a new petition I created on We the People,
a new feature on WhiteHouse.gov, and ask for your support. Will you add your
name to mine? If this petition gets 25,000 signatures by May 26, 2012, the
White House will review it and respond!
We the People allows anyone to create and sign petitions asking the Obama
Administration to take action on a range of issues. If a petition gets
enough support, the Obama Administration will issue an official response.
You can view and sign the petition here:
http://wh.gov/Eru
Here's some more information about this petition:
allow new machine guns to be manufactured and sold to
civilians
Machine guns have been banned to manufacture since 1986 .This petition
will make it legal to sell new machine guns to civilians . citizens can
already buy a machine gun but it has to be made before 1986 ,and they very
expensive ,often $18,000. the law that made machine gun illegal to
manufacture was unconstitutional because the second amendment says you have
the right to same weapons the military has .
a new feature on WhiteHouse.gov, and ask for your support. Will you add your
name to mine? If this petition gets 25,000 signatures by May 26, 2012, the
White House will review it and respond!
We the People allows anyone to create and sign petitions asking the Obama
Administration to take action on a range of issues. If a petition gets
enough support, the Obama Administration will issue an official response.
You can view and sign the petition here:
http://wh.gov/Eru
Here's some more information about this petition:
allow new machine guns to be manufactured and sold to
civilians
Machine guns have been banned to manufacture since 1986 .This petition
will make it legal to sell new machine guns to civilians . citizens can
already buy a machine gun but it has to be made before 1986 ,and they very
expensive ,often $18,000. the law that made machine gun illegal to
manufacture was unconstitutional because the second amendment says you have
the right to same weapons the military has .
Orkan
Member
If its run by the obama administration you are insane if you think they will act on any pro-gun issue.
Gun lover I really do appreciate people trying different routes, but I too honestly believe this administration wouldn't touch this. This might work when we get a more gun friendly President in office. Maybe you could start a petition to your state representatives?
- Status
