A Proposal to Guard Our Schools

[spider 69]

In light of the changes in our society, armed guards in the school makes sense to me. It's the realization that gives me pause.

Guards are expensive. States could opt to go with the Federal level which could mean the Department of Homeland Security. If not, then higher taxes are a certainty.

I have another idea.

Here in Fl we have more CCW permit holders than any other state. Some must belong to the PTA. Why not have volunteers be enabled to take a course, have an evaluation and be certified to provide this service?

It seems to me that having parents protecting our children would be ideal.

 

[chris in va]

By the time the 'parents' are thoroughly trained, vetted, certified, insured and paid, it would be the same if not more cost as an LEO.

 

[hso]

No, having amateurs serving in an official capacity is a nightmare for the school systems.

Unarmed, sure. Armed amateurs in place of professionals when there are laws for armed security guard certification, no.

Guns aren't the problem. Crazy is the problem. This one incident has people scrambling for something to DO right now, but there isn't anything to be done in hast. What needs to be done is for careful analysis to be carried out identifying the root causes of this sort of horror and the real threat of them followed by thoughtful development of solutions to stop this sort of thing in any practical way.

 

[nathan]

We have so many candidates if ever theres a move for school security . A lot of jobless people that can be tapped into this. If we can mobilize , train and send troops for combat abroad, how much more the safety of our kids, the future of this country.

 

[Rio Laxas]

I would like to see teachers trained to use non-lethal weapons. Ideally I would like to see teachers able to carry firearms as well, but acceptance of non-lethal weapons would be a start.

 

[HOOfan_1]

In light of the changes in our society, armed guards in the school makes sense to me. It's the realization that gives me pause.

Guards are expensive. States could opt to go with the Federal level which could mean the Department of Homeland Security. If not, then higher taxes are a certainty.
.

Having a single entrance and multiple exits would help. Control the entrance better. Fire doors which are closed and alarmed while classes are in session would alert people to intruders. Classroom doors which can be locked from the inside.

Securing the schools better is a MUCH MUCH MUCH better way to stop school shootings than any gun control ever could be. In the end, these shootings are not nearly as prevalent as the media make them out to be.

 

[velojym]

I'm wondering why an armed parent would be more dangerous in a school than, say, a mall.
The problem I see is with availability. We both work to afford our daughter's school in addition to our other expenses.
Same goes with teachers. If they're ok for spending the day with a classroom full of students, and are there for the right reasons (unlike the ones who repeatedly show us that it's more about their paycheck and other gravy than the kids) then I wouldn't have a problem with allowing them to defend my child if I'm not there to do it.

 

[spider 69]

I want volunteers-No pay

Part of my idea is to get people who are motivated by the desire to do good. Not money.

As velojym said "I'm wondering why an armed parent would be more dangerous in a school than, say, a mall. "

HSO, with respect, "armed amateurs" founded this country. I did originally add the caveat that they should be trained and evaluated/vetted.

HOOfan 1, A very good suggestion. I'm adding it to my proposal.

Chris in Va, insurance would be a good idea. I think that the state should pay it.

almostfree, by all means include teachers.

 

[Hypnogator]

From a law enforcement training professional...

The ONLY effective way to stop an active shooter bent on killing is IMMEDIATE armed response. It is a truism that when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. That was never truer than at Sandy Hook. Some propose allowing teachers and school staff to carry concealed weapons in schools, if they have concealed weapons permits. This might well stop an active shooter, or, if made known, dissuade a potential shooter from even attempting a mass murder. But allowing teachers to carry their concealed weapons would open the possibility that unauthorized persons could gain access to the weapons if left in a purse, briefcase, or desk drawer. Moreover, the responding teacher would be at a severe disadvantage in using a pocket pistol to confront a gunman with a high-powered semi-automatic rifle or shotgun, possibly wearing body armor. Finally, there would be a severe risk that a teacher attempting to intervene in an active shooting incident would be shot on sight by responding law enforcement officers.

Based on my training and experience training law enforcement agencies all over the country, I believe there is a better solution to effective immediate armed response while minimizing the risk to the armed responder. A fellow law enforcement trainer has accurately called active school shooters “monsters.” Every school building in the country has fire extinguishers to enable teachers and staff to fight fires, should they occur. I believe that schools should also have “monster extinguishers” strategically located throughout the campus – a securely locked container holding an easy-to-use rifle, such as an M-1 Carbine or AR-15, plus an armored and distinctively marked “raid jacket” that would instantly identify the responder to law enforcement responders and provide some modicum of protection from the shooter. Specially trained volunteer teachers and staff members would have keys to these containers, and would be able to respond instantly with effective lethal force to terminate the threat. The rifle is much easier to shoot accurately in an emergency than a handgun, and would penetrate all but the most cumbersome body armor.

 

[spider 69]

The ONLY effective way to stop an active shooter bent on killing is IMMEDIATE armed response. It is a truism that when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. That was never truer than at Sandy Hook. Some propose allowing teachers and school staff to carry concealed weapons in schools, if they have concealed weapons permits. This might well stop an active shooter, or, if made known, dissuade a potential shooter from even attempting a mass murder. But allowing teachers to carry their concealed weapons would open the possibility that unauthorized persons could gain access to the weapons if left in a purse, briefcase, or desk drawer. Moreover, the responding teacher would be at a severe disadvantage in using a pocket pistol to confront a gunman with a high-powered semi-automatic rifle or shotgun, possibly wearing body armor. Finally, there would be a severe risk that a teacher attempting to intervene in an active shooting incident would be shot on sight by responding law enforcement officers.

Based on my training and experience training law enforcement agencies all over the country, I believe there is a better solution to effective immediate armed response while minimizing the risk to the armed responder. A fellow law enforcement trainer has accurately called active school shooters “monsters.” Every school building in the country has fire extinguishers to enable teachers and staff to fight fires, should they occur. I believe that schools should also have “monster extinguishers” strategically located throughout the campus – a securely locked container holding an easy-to-use rifle, such as an M-1 Carbine or AR-15, plus an armored and distinctively marked “raid jacket” that would instantly identify the responder to law enforcement responders and provide some modicum of protection from the shooter. Specially trained volunteer teachers and staff members would have keys to these containers, and would be able to respond instantly with effective lethal force to terminate the threat. The rifle is much easier to shoot accurately in an emergency than a handgun, and would penetrate all but the most cumbersome body armor.

Thanks for this thoughtful reply.

While all valid points, I believe all can be dealt with. First, the use of rifles for those parents(or ex military) who meet the requirements(training/proficiency/psychological) is an excellent idea. The enhanced visibility, carried openly, they would give would, as you say, probably dissuade evildoers in the first place. Of course, there would need to be highly secure storage for these firearms, such as a safe in the school office. "Fire Extinguisher" stations could allow an evildoer to come between the responder and the firearm, and could leave the implements vulnerable to theft after school hours.

Clearly marked vests for the rifle equipped volunteers also has merit. For those carrying concealed a simple pre-cut plastic bag type affair could be issued in a sealed package, to be kept on their person and donned when needed.

The fact that some teachers may be carrying concealed implies that ALL teachers may be carrying concealed. Teachers and other school personnel with concealed carry permits would do a lot to augment this scenario, and would generate uncertainty for the evildoer. A part of their training would be in concealment and the imperative that their weapons must not leave their person.

 

[Screamin'Eagle]

I would not want parents as volunteers. You think the politics of discipline at school is a joke as it is, wait until Johnny's dad is a volunteer and witnesses Johnny doing something bad at school. Did I mention that Johnny's dad owns a company in town and has ties to the school board? How many ways can you say "corruption?"

Every school building in the country has fire extinguishers to enable teachers and staff to fight fires, should they occur. I believe that schools should also have “monster extinguishers” strategically located throughout the campus – a securely locked container holding an easy-to-use rifle, such as an M-1 Carbine or AR-15, plus an armored and distinctively marked “raid jacket”

This would be bad. These monsters plan this stuff out. They will know there is jacket. They will gain access to it by stealing a keycard or whatever and not only be a more difficult target, but then have the element of surprise and armor against law enforcement. Instead, there should be a procedure that includes someone calling 911, whether another teacher or a student to relay the teacher's position to 911 dispatch so they have accurate intel and can notify the officers.

 

[Risky]

The solution is simple. Promote the concept of teachers with current CPL/CCW/CCDW permits carrying concealed at the direction and discretion of their school boards. For 'may issue' states, start issuing to teachers. There's nothing in federal law against it. Nothing preventing in many state laws. Several school boards already do it. The problem is not enough are.

The other problem is that the other side and many on ours think that's too much task to handle for teachers or that there will be all sorts of unintended consequences without rigorous training. Horse hockey. Its the same 'wild west' propaganda spewed by the opposition when these permits were first came on the scene. Time has shown its not true. There's nothing different about a school that makes having a concealed firearm anymore dangerous than day to day anywhere else. If a school board is worried about a teacher losing it, require holsters with proper retention. That's it. If they want to pay for some sort of advanced training, awesome. If they can't afford it, that doesn't make those teachers any less effective than they would be defending themselves outside of school.

It makes me feel like the whole world around me has gone crazy! The solution is right there and it's basically free... and can start tomorrow for most states!

 

[Mp7]

If teachers should CCW ... why not hang a tactical shotgun into every classroom. That way, when the carnage starts u can count on every class having the proper equipment to defend against a possible intruder.


.... the simpler question: Do we really want to live in a world like that?

Not even every LEO is smart, well trained, talented and cool under live-fire.
Calling the reachers to battle is not the solution.

 

[T2K]

Agreed, Risky!

Just the simple act of moving from "definitely no one at the school is armed" (present situation) to "some teachers / staff may be armed" (allow those with CCP to carry in school, immediately) will change the whole dynamic in the minds of these nutjobs. They want absolutely zero resistance.

If they still go ahead with their mass murder plans, then clearly having some armed resistance is way better than none.

We don't need another federal bureacracy, licensing, training, insurance, etc.
This can happen right now.

 

[Risky]

If teachers should CCW ... why not hang a tactical shotgun into every classroom. That way, when the carnage starts u can count on every class having the proper equipment to defend against a possible intruder.


.... the simpler question: Do we really want to live in a world like that?

Not even every LEO is smart, well trained, talented and cool under live-fire.
Calling the reachers to battle is not the solution.

We already live in a world like that... and have been for awhile. We also don't need a trained, talented cool under-fire response with a tactical shotgun in every classroom. We just need an reasonably available immediate response when these things happen. Will it be a perfect, precise response and end the threat with no casualties? No, and no one should expect it to be. But we already know the result of a completely unarmed response from Friday before last in Sandy Hook... and honestly how could it get worse than that??

No one is 'calling teachers to battle'. No one is demanding to put a .357 in every school librarian's hand that's never even handled a gun before. Simply let those teachers that want to carry to do so and have the school boards develop a program to facilitate it.

People miss the point that schools are targeted like this because they are completely vulnerable to an armed attack if police are not present. Take away that vulnerability and you take away the desire to target it. These cowards aren't looking for a fight.

 

[suemarkp]

That would be the NRA's role and I think is what they've been trying to say: we'll setup a training program and provide the volunteers. Until then, they suggested cops or armed security at every school.

The problem I have with cops or even most school security is they are obvious by looking at them. They will be the first target if in uniform or wearing a shirt that says "Security". Same if it is a designated person (e.g. the principal). CCW and some armed parent in the corner is much tougher to assess as a threat.