A S&W Question Please

[Saw-Bones]

I have several S&W revolvers and all of them have the firing pin in the hammer.

I was wondering when S&W made the change to the internal firing pin and was it done to all their wheel guns?

I’ve never shot these newer revolvers… are the actions better, same or worse?

Thanks….. Doc

 

[RJM]

Well, I personally think the actions feel the same, but others think the older stuff feels better. I have paid for a Smith and Wesson action job on a revolver and that feels awesome and it made the alright trigger feel of a regular 686 into a top notch trigger feel.

Not sure of the date of the switch from hammer firing pins...I've had both and they both worked great.

 

[MrBorland]

I was wondering when S&W made the change to the internal firing pin and was it done to all their wheel guns?

'bout 1997. AFAIK, S&W revolvers since then have a frame-mounted firing pin.

I’ve never shot these newer revolvers… are the actions better, same or worse?

Whooo boy, you're gonna get some strong opinions here. With the introduction of the frame-mounted FP came the introduction of MIM parts. Many will swear the actions of pre-MIM were superior due to more hand fitting. Others will say MIM parts need little (if any) fitting, so the actions are more consistent. In the end, I think it's up to the gun in question. If you look hard enough, you'll find jewels and dogs in each flavor.

In the end, I'd just offer that guns with frame mounted FPs and MIM hammers/triggers may not have the fit and finish of older guns, but functionally, and IME, they work at least as well as the older guns (the frame-mounted FP, for instance, was an improvement, IMO).

And keep in mind that actions aren't immutable, and that it's a rare factory action (hammer- or frame-mounted FP) that can't be improved (often vastly) with a quality action job.

 

[dakota1911]

I have several of both types and they all go bang all the time.

 

[bshepherd]

I have several hammer mounted FP versions and one of the newer type. The newer one also has the MIM parts. The older guns sound more solid when you dryfire them. The new versions sound tinny. It is probably just the mim parts. They shoot fine however.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

New ones shoot fine and hold up well. That's all I'm willing to say on this.

I will check in later though while having a beer, and enjoy reading the internet version of World War III, which will be contained completely within the confines of this thread.

Who's throwing the first punch? C'mon......... Let's see it..........

AND..........

 

[Saw-Bones]

RJM - Was the trigger job done on the new and improved (?) model or the oldie-but-goodie gun? Whichever one it was might give us a hint on which one needed it… maybe that will get a flame started!

MrBorland - “In the end, I think it's up to the gun in question. If you look hard enough, you'll find jewels and dogs in each flavor.”

I know you’re right. I went to a big-time S&W distributor that allowed LEOs to make purchases there and the first Model 29 they offered me had the worst trigger pull I had ever experienced. The salesperson brought out another one and the trigger action was so good that I never had to have it tuned up. I was on the police pistol team and used it competition right out of the box.

dakota1911 - Okay, there’s a vote for each one’s reliability. Which one goes bang the best?

bshepherd - Do you have to use snap caps in the newer ones?

460Kodiak - Hey, you came to the party… time to dance.

 

[CajunBass]

I've owned both. Never seen a dimes worth of difference.

I like the old guns simply because they're older.

 

[MrBorland]

Well, you weren't asking me, but I'll chime in again anyway...

Which one goes bang the best?

They both go bang just fine. Since the newer hammer's got a bit less less mass (and inertia) without the firing pin, though, I believe the newer style allows you to tune the action a bit more aggressively (i.e. lighter). De rigueur race guns can be tuned very aggressively, in part because they utilize the newer style hammer & firing pin design.

Do you have to use snap caps in the newer ones?

No. Snap caps are cheap insurance, but I've got many tens of thousands of dry fires on my newer 686s without snap caps or issues. If one is still concerned, the frame-mounted firing pin is very easy to replace at regular intervals.

 

[Jim K]

The old hammer and trigger were punched out of sheet steel (not forged in recent years) and then machined to final shape. The machining left tool marks that were removed by doing a "trigger job" to smooth things up.

But MIM parts don't need machining and are smooth out of the mould, ending the need for expensive trigger jobs. This naturally aroused some resentment among smiths who specialized in that work.

Jim

 

[Twiki357]

Just as a comparison, in my primary carry cycle are a 37-2 (1997) with hammer mounted firing pin and a 637-2 (2011) with the frame mounted pin. With my eyes closed, I can’t tell the difference in performance.

 

[pittspilot]

I have a bunch of new and old smiths, and have inspected a bunch. My experience.

Old Smiths: Well hand fitted guns, especially 27's and 29's seems to be nicer than the modern guns. However, there is a a lot of variation. There are some real dogs out there.

New Smiths: Far more consistency gun to gun, but I don't see the really nice ones, like the hand fitted models. Also, the bluing on old guns is light years better.

 

[StrawHat]

S&W used a frame mounted firing pin when they introduced the 22 Jet, if I remember correctly. Maybe also on the 25 caliber CF they used in a "K" frame. So, back in the 50's?

Kevin