Accurizing a Mosin-Nagant

[krs]

You want to bed the action tightly into the wood - it must not be able to move at all.

You want to let the barrel free as much as possible by relieving the interior of the handguard pieces so they don't contact the barrel and shorten each piece slightly so that it can move even while held on the rifle by the various clips and bands that may do that. The trick with a military rifle that keeps it's stock is to minimize the tensions placed on the barrel at every point. Best is no contact but failing that you have to see that nothing places the barrel under any tension so that it and whatever necessary attachments to it can move.

I'm not sure that Mosins can shoot but any rifle can be improved.

5 shot groups under 1" at 100 yds? Nothing to it!

 

[Autopistola]

Mine was a good shooter out of the pawn shop, but you wouldn't know it with the heavy, gritty trigger pull. I looked around the net for trigger mods and settled on a non-permanent one: make shims that fit on the bolt that connects the sear to the reciever. first I modified a washer, then made more shims out an aluminum soda can. In total, it took a washer and six aluminum shims until I was satisfied with the trigger pull and its safety. YMMV, so take it one step at a time.

Also, I noticed before the trigger shimming that the bolt would actually tweak in the reciever while pulling the trigger, and it was very hard to open/close the bolt handle up and down. That all changed after the shim job!

I lucked out with a '39 Tula ex-sniper. The crown is OK, the bore pitted and rusty, and the handguards clamp down hard on the barrel. Still shoots 1.5MOA with Simmons scope.

 

[abouyet]

I was thinking about bedding my mosin all the way down the barrel groove in the stock to make it uniform with no pressure points but solid instead. I know free floating is the way to go but what do you think?

 

[Shadow 7D]

good article on corking at www.boxotruth.com
Surplusrifle has some good article and in the message board you can find the original Finnish modifications or is it Russian modifications to the trigger, basically the spring/sear is bent and thinned along with polishing, the contact point is reshaped from a slope to a more solid square, those who have done the mods per the blueprint have reported consistent almost match triggers about 3-4 break.

 

[Joshua M. Smith]

This is an old thread.

Can we revisit it? We've come a ways since it was posted, and I think it would be fun to see where we Mosin freaks were then, and where we are now.

For my part, I'd never heard of a Mosin! I'd just come back from college in Vincennes IN and owned a pistol and a shotgun, the rest of the collection I owned as a teenager (including a Winchester 9422 Magnum!) were sold to pay for college.

I'd yet to purchase my first centerfire rifle as Indiana only allowed shotguns for deer at the time.

Sometime during the duration of this thread I walked into a gunshop and saw a Russian rifle called an "M44" (whatever that was!) for $150. I bought it to find out if I'd end up enjoying centerfire rifles!

Josh

 

[stytos]

Perhaps way too excessive, but I'm doing an entire Mosin Nagant project. It's a 1934 91/30. I ordered a heavy, threaded, bull barrel from McGowan barrels, ordered a Timney trigger, a Bushnell Elite Tactical 6-24x50mm scope, a Troy Medieval muzzle break in .308, and a stock from Richard's Microfit. The barreled action isn't back from McGowan yet, should be here by the end of Nov, beginning of Dec (it's Nov 15th now). This morning, I ordered some Devcon Plastic Steel.

My idea going into this Mosin was to make a Mosin that can hit accurately at a 100 yards and beyond. Yes, I might screw this up; and I'll be upset/annoyed if I do. But if I can do it as I believe I can, then I'll have a Russian .308 that hits accurately for 1/2 the cost of the .308.

 

[danweasel]

Well, I bedded mine with JB weld and did all the other "no-cost" mods (trigger shim and polish, corked the barrel, cleaned up the hand guard channel, shimmed the action screws, and refinished the stock). Why did I do all this? Because Mr. Smith up there ^^^ has my front sight and I was getting antsy, hahaha!

 

[Joshua M. Smith]

Dan, you're gonna like it!

 

[Clark]

Since 2003 [when this thread began] I have changed what I do to Mosin Nagants.
I have concluded that for me:
1) Timney trigger is the best, adjust low and adds a good safety.
2) Bending the sear is the next best.
3) Shimming under the sear is inferior to bending the sear
4) The Hubber trigger is a waste of money and time.
5) Reducing the firing spring force is a waste of time.
6) Polishing the trigger where it touches the sear is a waste of time.
7) Polishing the sear where it touches the trigger is a waste of time.
8) Polishing the sear where it touches the cocking piece is a waste of time.
9) Polishing the cocking piece where it touches the sear is a waste of time.
10) I still pillar bed with 3/8" tubing by I use 1010 steel and not brass now.
11) I no longer mill and weld scope mounts together. I have concluded that the ATI mount with a third hole is good enough for anything.
12) The MN extractor relief cut and capricious receiver clocking is so much trouble that I will rebarrel more Mausers and Rem700 type rifles for myself than Mosins.





I have made some youtube videos on Mosin Nagant gunsmithing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPn8IdNJ_SE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEyS9Q_u10I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOjYro4w0Bc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSmvBGYFUK4

 

[carbine85]

I added a few comments below in red

Since 2003 [when this thread began] I have changed what I do to Mosin Nagants.
I have concluded that for me:
1) Timney trigger is the best, adjust low and adds a good safety.
2) Bending the sear is the next best.
3) Shimming under the sear is inferior to bending the sear. It can be helpful if you don't want to take a chance of over bending the spring. I use the shim to tweak it.
4) The Hubber trigger is a waste of money and time.
5) Reducing the firing spring force is a waste of time.
6) Polishing the trigger where it touches the sear is a waste of time. Can't hurt and takes 5 minutes
7) Polishing the sear where it touches the trigger is a waste of time. Can't hurt
8) Polishing the sear where it touches the cocking piece is a waste of time.This can help make for a cleaner break.
9) Polishing the cocking piece where it touches the sear is a waste of time.Doing this makes for a nice clean break of the trigger
10) I still pillar bed with 3/8" tubing by I use 1010 steel and not brass now.
11) I no longer mill and weld scope mounts together. I have concluded that the ATI mount with a third hole is good enough for anything.
12) The MN extractor relief cut and capricious receiver clocking is so much trouble that I will rebarrel more Mausers and Rem700 type rifles for myself than Mosi

Using the old Russian method of changing some angles, polishing, and cleaning up the surfaces can be very helpful and save the expense of buying a new trigger group. I have done this on several rifles with very favorable results.

 

[Clark]

When I say, "waste of time" I mean no measurable improvement as measuring trigger force, measured with a force gauge as shown in my above video.

When we want to get from an 8 pound trigger down to a 3 pound trigger and we try something on many parts from many guns and there is not an ounce of change, it is a waste of time.


When I shimmed under the sear and posted about it 9 years ago, that was my first Mosin Nagant. I have sporterized many of them now and threw a bunch of engineering hours at measuring the effectiveness of trigger mods.

 

[AMG9130]

I bought my '39 Tula 91/30 not too long ago, and the thing had trigger work already done to it. It came out of its storage cardboard box, lathered and smothered in cosmoline. My trigger is so light, you blow on it and it fires. I just barely tap it and BAM! I know its dangerous, but I love it. It's extremely dangerous, actually, because even shaking the rifle aggressively will set it off. Not safe, but with a little bit of brains (for safety), it is such a help at the range, or when I'm trying to kill something.

 

[BBBBill]

I bought my '39 Tula 91/30 not too long ago, and the thing had trigger work already done to it. It came out of its storage cardboard box, lathered and smothered in cosmoline. My trigger is so light, you blow on it and it fires. I just barely tap it and BAM! I know its dangerous, but I love it. It's extremely dangerous, actually, because even shaking the rifle aggressively will set it off. Not safe, but with a little bit of brains (for safety), it is such a help at the range, or when I'm trying to kill something.

First - Welcome aboard. Stick around and learn from the others here.

Second - your post indicates that you probably don't have much experience with guns and that you really have not thought through what you are doing. You admit that it is "extremely dangerous," that even "shaking the rifle aggressively will set it off," that is "not safe," yet you continue to use it because "it is such a help at the range, or when (you're) trying to kill something."

Really? What happens when you maim or kill something that you don't intend to kill? You've just admitted on an open forum that you are willing to accept the risk of that happening. That admission may come back to haunt you. And don't think that deleting that post will protect you. You might delete it, but an archived copy will be available to anyone who cares to find it until the end of time. It WILL be used to hang you if that day ever comes when your gun went off at the wrong time.
A quality trigger will allow a light, safe trigger pull, without the danger associated with a misadjusted/misfit/damaged gun such as you have and is cheap insurance against such an event.

Please take it out of service NOW and get it looked over by someone who knows what they're doing. You would be doing everyone a great service, most especially yourself.

 

[carbine85]

I would consider anything below 3 lbs with a standard trigger unsafe. It sounds like yours can fire upon closing the bolt. It's totally unsafe.

 

[Joshua M. Smith]

Hello,

The trigger can be made to be safe with a 2.5lb break.

It must be a true two-stage to be safe, though, and have a couple, few other things done to it to keep it safe.

Otherwise, about 4.5lbs to 5lbs is the safe lower limit on these.

Regards,

Josh