ak build

[gpr]

i am looking to do a ak build...am i right in understanding you can build a receiver/gun, but you can't sell it...if you buy a regestered receiver and build the gun, it would be legally transferable....gary

 

[Sam1911]

Nope. If you build a (Title I ... rifle, pistol, shotgun) gun for your own purposes and decide eventually to sell it, that's perfectly legal.

The ATF asks that you mark it with a serial number and maker's name and city...but there's some debat about whether that is legally REQUIRED or not.

 

[tyeo098]

The ATF asks that you mark it with a serial number and maker's name and city...but there's some debat about whether that is legally REQUIRED or not.

But one could have some fun giving a firearm its identifying marks.
For example:
AK00000000000001
Sn-1p3 (like, serial number 1p3, but it spells snipe, get it?)


But the ATF just doesnt want you churning out unserialized firearms as a business.

 

[rule303]

Make sure you read and understand section 922r as far as compliance parts go, then go ahead and build it.

 

[Sam1911]

But the ATF just doesnt want you churning out [STRIKE]unserialized[/STRIKE] firearms as a business.

...without a federal firearms manufacturer's license, period. Serialized or no.

 

[DaisyCutter]

I built my own FAL about 10 years ago. Hand fitted it, she was my first and only build. Imbel receiver, new chrome lined Argy barrel, gucci trigger group, etc.

It's the finest, most reliable firearm I've ever handled.


Build you that AK. Your own TLC will go further than some off the rack rifle.

 

[Bobson]

How exactly does one 'build' his own weapon? I mean, I can see how a properly trained engineer or machinist could have the necessary knowledge, but you would also need to own all the machines and tools required. I would imagine that would be one hell of an expensive (and big) backyard shop.

 

[M-Cameron]

How exactly does one 'build' his own weapon? I mean, I can see how a properly trained engineer or machinist could have the necessary knowledge, but you would also need to own all the machines and tools required. I would imagine that would be one hell of an expensive (and big) backyard shop.

it depends on how complex of a firearm you want to make.....

a small mill, lathe and a good set of hand tools are all that is required to make a decent firearm.....heck, even finishing an 80% AR lower constitutes 'making a firearm'

granted not everyone has room for a mill and a lathe.....but if one knows what they are doing, its possible to make a simple single shot using nothing more than a hacksaw, and some files......

 

[Bobson]

Interesting. Guess I wouldn't know what I'd be doing haha

 

[Sam1911]

In many (and probably MOST) cases, when someone says they're building their own gun they mean they're assembling one from parts. Generally, that means they're buying a complete, finished firearm receiver for a popular model (AR, AK, FAL) and a pile of parts to make it a complete, functional rifle. Those are "other firearms" on the form 4473 and must be sold by the manufacturer through an FFL dealer. This takes a few tools, usu sally, but depending on the complexity of the gun, it can often be done at your kitchen table.

Sometimes, it means that they are buying (or making) a semi-complete receiver -- maybe an 80% complete milling of an AR receiver, or a sheet metal "flat" with the holes drilled in it for an AK's receiver shell -- finishing that part themselves, and then adding a pile of parts to make it a complete, functional rifle. These 80% millings or "flats" are not firearms until completed, and can be sold via mail order. This takes a few more tools and a bit more know-how and usually involves mills, lathes, presses and/or other heavy shop equipment.

Sometimes it means that the person is literally MAKING every part, or some collection of parts, from raw steel sheet, plate, billet, etc. That's very rare. Few hobbyists have the equipment to do that.

From a legal standpoint, in the first instance you haven't "made" a firearm. The original manufacturer of that receiver did. Now, oddly enough, if you were a gun shop and wanted to buy stripped receivers and assemble complete firearms for sale, that would require a manufacturer's license, but that doesn't matter to a home-builder.

In the second two instances, you are indeed making a new firearm for your own use, and as long as what you make doesn't fall into the National Firearms Act '34, "Title II" categories, then that's perfectly legal to do.

 

[Bobson]

Ah, gotcha. Yeah, assembling a rifle out of parts hadn't even occurred to me. For whatever reason, I envisioned a guy taking chunks of raw metal allows and literally machining the parts.

 

[mortablunt]

You can make it for your own personal use, but you can't build it just so you can go and make money off of it.

 

[gpr]

so i go back to my original question...build a 'flat' for keeps...or registered receiver and do what ever/when ever.....gary

 

[tyeo098]

so i go back to my original question...build a 'flat' for keeps...or registered receiver and do what ever/when ever.....gary

Its not "for keeps" for ever per say, its the same reasoning with a straw sale, at SOME point you're going to buy a gun, and at SOME point you're going to want to sell it. Its just a matter of how much time passes that makes the difference.

Ex. When I bought my CZ75B from some guy with 3 teeth in Tampa, I was 19.
The guy with 3 teeth had bought it from an FFL, but since sufficient time had passes since he bought it, and sold it to me, it wasn't a "Straw Sale."

So go ahead and build your flat, have fun with the AK. When you grow bored with it scribble "AK01 Tampa, FL" on the bottom and sell it for whatever you want.

 

[Sam1911]

registered receiver

? Registered? That ususally referrs to a Title II gun (machine gun or short-barreled rifle).

If you're talking about regular semi-auto rifles, it isn't registered with anyone. It just has a serial number.

 

[gpr]

i mean a serial numbered reciever, vs a 'flat'....gary

 

[Owen Sparks]

A buddy once bought a semi-auto MAC-10 pistol (remember those?) with no serial number of any kind. When he showed it to me I pointed it out and he became nervous and asked if he should throw it in a lake. (he only has $100 in it) I told him that he would probably be alright as long as he did not try to sell.

Would buying an un-serial numbered firearm through ignorance be a viable excuse?

 

[Sam1911]

Buying, and owning an un-serial-numbered firearm is not a crime.

Defacing a serial number -- or possessing a firearm with a defaced serial number -- IS a crime. I'd be surprised if his MAC was built before serial numbers were required (1968), so the chances are it have been removed.

Ignorance is a common enough response to criminal charges. It is certainly possible that you could convince an investigator that you weren't culpable and charges might not be filed. However, the firearm would surely be forefeit.

The US Code (18 USC 44, I, 922(k)) says:

(k) It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to transport,
ship, or receive, in interstate or foreign commerce, any firearm
which has had the importer's or manufacturer's serial number
removed, obliterated, or altered or to possess or receive any
firearm which has had the importer's or manufacturer's serial
number removed, obliterated, or altered and has, at any time, been
shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce.

So the crime of receiving the gun does depend on "knowingly." The possession issue does not.