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AK47 - please help me define / find one

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Wanderling, Feb 11, 2017.

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  1. md7

    md7 Member

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    To Sam's point.... I shoot an AR squared up, feet shoulder width, right foot slightly back, knees bent, and leaning forward on the balls of my feet. Not the most comfortable shooting position, but helps you move.

    I'm 6'1" and usually use the the third slot back with a standard M4 type stock or 2 slots back with a padded sopmod type stock. An AK stock's length would probably fit this type of shooting well.
     
  2. MartinS

    MartinS Member

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    If you want to stay within 600 bucks forget the red dot and the hobby stock. The rifle will have everything you need except practice and ammo . The front sight ears are a poor man's EoTech at close range, thank you Gabe.
     
  3. Inebriated

    Inebriated Member

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    Try a K-Var polymer or '74-style wood grip, it's much much nicer than what is likely on your friend's Romanian. They have palm swells that help give it a more comfortable feel.

    In any case, if you've got $600 to spend on a home defense and plinking gun, I say to save for another couple weeks and get a Colt 6720. They're ~$850, light, reliable, and accurate. While I regularly use AK's and integrate them with AR's for various things, and I still would prefer a $600 AK over a $600 AR, something in 5.56 is my pick for a home defense long gun. I don't feel that 7.62x39 offers anything positive in the role of HD, where a threat is likely to only be across a room. Plus, if I did, there are a number of good barrier-blind 5.56 bullets out there that should offer good terminal performance on the other side of the barrier. But that's neither here nor there for HD in my mind.

    And if your budget is already up to $850, look at the new Arsenal SLR-107-11's for the AK side of things. It should feel nicer in-hand than your buddy's Romaninan gun.
     
  4. Mosin Bubba

    Mosin Bubba Member

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    I would recommend buying an off-the-shelf rifle, but if you are feeling cheap or mechanically handy, this might be worth a look.

    http://palmettostatearmory.com/blem...o-1-7-stainless-freedom-rifle-kit-43526b.html

    $360 (usually they'll run a promo for free shipping), plus whatever a lower costs you.

    I have never built a lower, but I don't think you could cause any misfires or gas issues if you make a mistake. The upper is where that headspacing, gas flow type stuff is at, and that comes pre-built. You are just assembling the trigger, bolt and mag release, and screwing on the buffer tube. The end result will probably end up cheaper than any retail AR, and it's going to be way higher quality than your average bargain gun.

    For off-the-shelf stuff, I like the Delton Sport I have. It was $500 new and it has a pencil barrel that I really like. There are some corners cut with it, but for the volume of shooting I do, I don't really care.

    The Ruger AR-556 and S&W Sport are both about $600 and are probably the most popular entry level guns. I've never shot either, but you don't hear owners complaining about them.
     
  5. Maverick223

    Maverick223 Member

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    I don't have much to add regarding the ubiquitous AR-15. I've shot a lot of them, and they're honestly okay rifles, but I just don't care to own one. On the topic of other options, though, I would highly suggest taking a look at the VZ.58. Mine has proven to be much more ergonomic and accurate than the AK as well as being significantly lighter and exhibiting better build quality (milled steel receiver, et cetera), but utilizing the same ammunition thus making it an economical choice to shoot as well as relatively potent (by intermediate cartridge standards). You should expect to replace the grip (many options, Zahal probably being the most prevalent) and perhaps add a butt-pad (I'm told the one for the AK fits fine) to lengthen the stock if the small furniture proves uncomfortable though (I don't, but I know many do).
     
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  6. Phaedrus/69

    Phaedrus/69 Member

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    I kind of feel the same about ARs. On the one hand I really do like them, and I feel they do a lot of things very well. But at the same time the design has some peculiarities that I'm not crazy about. Probably they're not an issue to folks that cut their teeth on them but I had almost 40 years of shooting under my belt before I bought my first AR! The first thing is that the charging handle is not intuitive to me at all. I'd much rather have something that works like an MP5, UMP or CZ Scorpion. I would rather have a reciprocating charging handle than a forward assist. I also am not crazy about the dust cover or the safety lever. On the other hand I love handing and ergonomics overall. The ability to Lego is awesome. I love the high quality and ubiquity of the magazines and I feel the 5.56 round is a pretty good one (plus the option to get .300 Blackout and other calibers is nice).

    I think my next long gun will probably be a Bren 805. I wish it was a little lighter but I think it's closer to what I want in a defensive carbine.
     
  7. Maverick223

    Maverick223 Member

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    Phaedrus/69, that 805 is nice...as is the Scorpion, CZ75, and as mentioned the VZ.58 (I like my VZ.52 as well, but I don't know if I can lump it in with the others). I think the Czechs just build great firearms in general. Unfortunately the VZ is starting to creep up in price, but even still they're a pretty good value like most all of the Czech firearms (The 805 is pretty high too, but not when you compare it to a SCAR-16, and while they're both good rifles I like the CZ better). That said, I think I might wait for the 806 (which is claimed to be a lot lighter) if I were in the market and had the option to wait a year or two.
     
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  8. Phaedrus/69

    Phaedrus/69 Member

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    I dunno, the 806 might be imported in a couple years but it may never be imported. Worst case I get the 805 and later add an 806 to go with.:D
     
  9. Maverick223

    Maverick223 Member

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    Eh, they aren't KelTec, if they say it's coming I think it will. I wouldn't necessarily bank on their timeline (supposedly in the middle of next year), because most everyone is overly optimistic on the drop date (I'm still waiting for that Bond Bullpup that was promised middle of last year...). The condition of "too many rifles" is a fallacy, so I have trouble believing that one of each might be a bad thing.
     
  10. MechAg94

    MechAg94 Member

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    Not sure if this was mentioned, but Palmetto State Armory is selling an AK Rifle kit for about $400. It is an AK without furniture or trigger. I believe the furniture/trigger kits start at a little over $100. They are supposed to be the same parts they use in the AK's they build that have tested decently. A cheaper way to get started in an AK and probably better than a lot of other "cheap" AK's.
     
  11. Wanderling

    Wanderling Member

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    Well, Vz.58 is about $1,300-500 from what I saw, and while I have outmost respect for any Czech made weapon, that's a hard price for me to pay for an AK clone. And it's not really an AK clone internally from what I understand, so the parts are only coming from one source.

    I do appreciate the suggestion, just not the right rifle for me at this point.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2017
  12. Wanderling

    Wanderling Member

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    I appreciate everyone's patience, as I fluctuate between an AK and AR... I actually grew up in the USSR and spent plenty of time assembling / disassembling it with my eyes closed (they started teaching us from about the age 14 and by 16 we were supposed to field strip and re-assemble an AK in 1.5 minutes, or 45 sec per operation). I also shot it on few occasions but this was when I was still in my teens, much different body built, and the shooting was very heavily controlled - only from the prone position, only in semi auto mode, only after careful aiming, so not much different from shooting a sports or hunting rifle. And they wouldn't let us use more than 3-5 rounds at a time (as I recall it was 2 rounds for "warm ups" and 3 to qualify). So I wasn't really much exposed to actually using the platform when I came to States, anyway, and only got familiar with shooting it in the past decade when I became interested in guns.

    Anyway, I do remember the fit and finish of the Soviet made AKM and AKMS we used in school and college, and to be honest by comparison, the WASR doesn't get me too excited, especially their wood furniture looks like it was made out of scrap wood and lacquered by a drunk. At least on the couple of Romanian WASRs that my friends own. I could also swear that the fire selector switch on these older guns was made from better steel, the one on Romanian WASR looks like it was cut out of a sardine can. So while logically I understand that the ugly stock and selector switch are not in any way impeding the functionality of that gun, I have very hard time paying 700 for it, or whatever the going rate is. And the WASR is supposed to be one of the better made ones.

    Also, even though I've spent more than half of my life in the US by now, the AR still looks exotic to me just like an AK would to someone who grew up here.

    I'd buy both if I could... but my wife may have a problem with this :)
     
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  13. Maverick223

    Maverick223 Member

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    There are still some CSA copies floating around for around $1k (though they are getting scarce at this point) and the VZ2008 is often seen for $600-700, so that's in your budget. It isn't an AK in any way (no interchangeable parts save for the ammunition), but I didn't realize that was still the point of this thread after you stated you were considering an AR. There are, however, plenty of sources for parts...to name a few: NEA, Bonesteel, & FAB Defense. There are others as well, these are just the manufacturers off the top of my head. The aftermarket isn't as strong as the AR platform, but it's probably comparable to the AK now that it has been gaining in popularity (this wasn't always the case).
     
  14. igotta40

    igotta40 Member

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    I had my Inter Ordnance AK at the range today, I really like it. I've read the reports on the ones from N Carolina plant, mine's a new one from the new Florida factory. It has a 6 position stock and Picatinny rail hand guard so it looks like it's mixed with a AR. It also came with a scope and bipod and in my opinion, at 13 pounds, it's more of a defensive arm than assault rifle. I'll find a photo for you.
     
  15. igotta40

    igotta40 Member

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    Here is my Inter Ordnance AK47
     

    Attached Files:

  16. Browning

    Browning Member

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    If it's a choice between one or the other I'd rather have a PSA AR over an AK based upon accuracy. However if you have your heart set on a AK I'd look around for a used Chinese, Hungarian that isn't an AMD, Romanian SAR or Yugoslav rather than a WASR. I picked up a Chinese 922 compliant MAK a few months back before the election at your price point and I've seen others here and there, so they are out there.

    Here's what it can do at 100y with Wolf 123 grain HP. The top group is with a Ruger 10/22 match rifle with match ammo and a 3-10x scope, so unfair comparison.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. drobs

    drobs Member

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    I have a few AK's. My most recent one is a Serbian M92 pistol.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Stock sets on AK's are easy to change. My Sar-1 (middle in below pic with Kobra Red Dot) has had 5 different sets on it and I'm contemplating a Magpul set.
    [​IMG]

    My Sar-1 currently wears these stocks:
    [​IMG]

    My home built under folder Romanian G wears these as well:
    [​IMG]

    This was posted earlier but its a steal of deal at $379.99!
    http://palmettostatearmory.com/blem...te-barreled-receiver-finished-516445020b.html
    You'd need some parts to finish it off though.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2017
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  18. Wanderling

    Wanderling Member

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    Are you sure you have enough AKs ? :)

    Anyway, I'd like to thank everyone for help. After much deliberation I decided to get a M&P AR15 Sport II. I understand that it's a pretty basic rifle but I want to try the platform, I want something that is going to work out of the box (hopefully) and feel this would be a good place to start. Should have it come by the weekend.
     
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  19. drobs

    drobs Member

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    I think I need 1 more...
    Post up some pics when you get the M&P.
     
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  20. Ignition Override

    Ignition Override Member

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    Wanderling:
    You'll probably like the M&P Sport II. Bought mine 'nib' about a year ago.
    It works fine, and with my 20-rd. Pmags (I don't need/like larger mag ergos) has been a 100% perfect operation. The trigger is pretty crisp, just slightly tighter at the break than my SAR-1 or nib Saiga rifles.
     
  21. Wanderling

    Wanderling Member

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    Will do, most certainly ! Too bad that it looks like it will be raining with strong wind here the entire weekend...
     
  22. Inebriated

    Inebriated Member

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    Best time to shoot.
     
  23. 35 Whelen

    35 Whelen Member

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    I have both, but have had AR's longer. I'm not a fan of semi-auto rifles at all, but wanted to have a few around.

    I love the ergonomics of the AR, but the smaller, underpowered cartridge of the AR doesn't impress me. On the other hand, the AK is an ergonomic abomination, but rugged and chambered for an arguably more powerful cartridge. So, I have two AR's and two AK's!

    I bought my first AK, a 20.5" Saiga knowing in advance that AK's in general have a reputation for poor accuracy. Well, imagine my surprise:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Mind you, these groups were fired with the tangent sights and 50+ year old eyes.

    So I wanted a shorter, handier AK and against the advice of all the cackling hens over on the AKFiles forum, I bought an Inter Ordnance AKM247. This rifle was $499.00 and again, kind of surprised me. Certainly not match accuracy but not bad at all for 200 yds.:

    [​IMG]

    Note that in the below picture I had installed a Tech Sight aperture sight which makes a world of difference on these rifles.

    [​IMG]

    35W
     
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  24. md7

    md7 Member

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    Pretty good shooting, 35W. Nice pics too!
     
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  25. drobs

    drobs Member

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