Am I wasting my time?

[armoredman]

I'm asking this on several forums to get a consensus of sorts.
I am rather anal about trimming and chamfering rifle brass, especially 308 and 223. Right now I have components coming in to build some range fodder stuff, 100 yards or less, steel target hitting practice stuff using 55 grain pull down bullets sourced locally. Trimming and chamfering takes quite a bit of time using my Forster trimmer and hand tools for chamfering - do I need to? See, at 1.760 I let it slide, but a LOT of this once fired brass comes in 1.765-1.785 or so...mostly on the lower end of that range. Obviously they worked once...since I am not loading for a match, what do you think? Rifles used would be AR variants and maybe the BREN 2 MS...but I baby my baby...maybe not the BREN. Chambers cuts would be 5.56mm and .223 Wylde. It would save a great deal of time and work... I would, of course, continue doing that for my serious hunting ammo and such.

Thoughts?

 

[Bazoo]

I’d omit trimming but check for length. I’d also crimp with a lee collet crimp most likely which isn’t dependent on length.

 

[armoredman]

I use Lee dies with the Factory Crimp Die, due to me using the Expander, (flaring), die for flat base projos. Interestingly enough, I use an RCBS Small Base decapping/resizing die.

 

[AJC1]

I'm asking this on several forums to get a consensus of sorts.
I am rather anal about trimming and chamfering rifle brass, especially 308 and 223. Right now I have components coming in to build some range fodder stuff, 100 yards or less, steel target hitting practice stuff using 55 grain pull down bullets sourced locally. Trimming and chamfering takes quite a bit of time using my Forster trimmer and hand tools for chamfering - do I need to? See, at 1.760 I let it slide, but a LOT of this once fired brass comes in 1.765-1.785 or so...mostly on the lower end of that range. Obviously they worked once...since I am not loading for a match, what do you think? Rifles used would be AR variants and maybe the BREN 2 MS...but I baby my baby...maybe not the BREN. View attachment 1067538 Chambers cuts would be 5.56mm and .223 Wylde. It would save a great deal of time and work... I would, of course, continue doing that for my serious hunting ammo and such.

Thoughts?

You need to complete the process to make your brass in spec. If you have measurements to prove your cases will not pinch the bullet and blow your gun up then you have more leeway. Randomly asking if skipping steps of reloading is begging for trouble. Make the absolute best ammunition you can every time and you may be lucky and not have a problem.

 

[Fooey]

Get a Wilson case gauge. Makes for fast checking for fit. Personally I found the longest brass I have and seated a bullet and blackened the mouth of the brass with sharpie pen. Chambered and you can see if it is too long. (no Primer or powder) You can get a good idea of your chamber length. It will look like it was roll crimped kinda. But that is just me. better yet get some chamber cast metal and do a cast of your chamber and see what it is exactly. Some rifles can take pretty long cases and some not. If you don't want to go thru the trouble to find chamber length, just get the Wilson gauge and go by that. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[Hartkopf]

As AJC1 posted, I wouldn’t want to pinch long brass in the chamber and possibly cause a spike in pressure. Brass prep sucks but I would continue to trim.

 

[N555]

I have the layman pencil sharper style case trimmer I can trim like 700 to 800 per hour.
Set it to 1.75 and run them all through it.

 

[Wreck-n-Crew]

I am not a fan of reloading large batches of rifle ammo either and if ammo prices get low enough i wont have to load big batches anymore.

Getting close to being there now. Especially considering the price of primers and powder.

When the next panic hits and i have to break out the rifle loading supplies again. Its a vicious cycle.

I guess you could say i was spoiled only having to load large quantities pistol for so long and only small batches of certain rifle cartridges wasn't so bad.

 

[redcon1]

Thoughts?

I recently trimmed/chamferred/deburred a hundred rounds of 5.56 with my Forster set up over the course of a few days...while I was waiting for my Giraud triway cutter to come in.
I did 100 rounds with the Forster and they certainly looked beautiful and perfect but it was a pain in the hand. Then I got the triway within about 1 week and I did 200 hundred cases in the course of 30 minutes. It took longer than that to adjust the blade. they look pretty darned good. 200 cases trimmed to 1.750, chamferred and deburred in 30 minutes. Then of course there was primer pocket swaging and uniforming and flash hole uniforming. Those flash holes were hideous. It took about two and half hours to do all of that on my case prep center while I watched a movie. I may need to adjust the blade on the triway a little for a more pronounced chamfer but they're all good and it's so very very easy.

 

[redcon1]

Get a Wilson case gauge. Makes for fast checking for fit. Personally I found the longest brass I have and seated a bullet and blackened the mouth of the brass with sharpie pen. Chambered and you can see if it is too long. (no Primer or powder) You can get a good idea of your chamber length. It will look like it was roll crimped kinda. But that is just me. better yet get some chamber cast metal and do a cast of your chamber and see what it is exactly. Some rifles can take pretty long cases and some not. If you don't want to go thru the trouble to find chamber length, just get the Wilson gauge and go by that. Just my 2 cents worth.

I have the Wilson gauges for everything but I like the JP enterprise gauge better since it's min spec. I like the Sheridan gauge even more since it's also min spec and has that cut out that let's you see where/why the case is hanging up but I only have one of those for 300 blackout, I have the JP gauges for 5.56 and 7.62 and they work just fine. They're especially handy for making sure lake city machine gun brass get's sized enough the first time IMO. That stuff seems especially tough to get trimmed down to size the first time around too.

 

[armoredman]

I thought as much, don't like cutting corners, really, so I'll keep on keeping on - after all, if it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? Wish I could afford a high speed/low drag trimmer setup, found my Forster in a pawn shop with pilot and collet for a whopping $5. Before that I was using the infamous Lee Zip Trim, before THAT it was the HAND trimmer by Lee....after doing 20 I was done.
I should clarify - bulk for me is 100 at a time on a single stage. I have never owned a progressive or even a turret press, and I enjoy the fun of loading...minus that brass prep.
Thank you all.

 

[armoredman]

What do you guys think about this tool? Frankford Arsenal 4 station trimming tool.

"The Frankford Arsenal Platinum Series Case Prep and Trim Center offers 4 work stations to quickly and easily prepare brass for reloading. The permanent trimming station indexes off the case shoulder to trim shouldered cases from 17 Remington to 460 Weatherby without the use of shell holders. The other 3 stations accept any case preparation accessory with 8-32 threads. The Platinum Case Prep Center includes a VLD chamfering tool, Outside Chamfer Tool, as well as large and small primer pocket uniformers. The built in storage box keeps all accessories organized and close at hand. Plugs into standard 110 volt outlet."

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1012719754?pid=628405

$160 - I could probably afford that one.

 

[lordpaxman]

Trimming and chamfering takes quite a bit of time using my Forster trimmer and hand tools for chamfering - do I need to?

I wouldn’t skip the trimming step with rifle if needed, but for target practice I don’t chamfer. Since I didn’t want to measure before trimming I decided to get a more automated way of processing for this step. I use an M style expander die instead of chamfering, so far it works just fine. Since I use range brass there’s always crimped pockets as well. When you add up all the prep steps and time it takes, especially when you add in how quickly you can unload all the reloads, something like an RL1100 starts to look like a useful tool. Expensive, but useful, at least in time savings, and that’s one I pay attention to. Good luck.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I'm asking this on several forums to get a consensus of sorts.
I am rather anal about trimming and chamfering rifle brass, especially 308 and 223. Right now I have components coming in to build some range fodder stuff, 100 yards or less, steel target hitting practice stuff using 55 grain pull down bullets sourced locally. Trimming and chamfering takes quite a bit of time using my Forster trimmer and hand tools for chamfering - do I need to? See, at 1.760 I let it slide, but a LOT of this once fired brass comes in 1.765-1.785 or so...mostly on the lower end of that range. Obviously they worked once...since I am not loading for a match, what do you think? Rifles used would be AR variants and maybe the BREN 2 MS...but I baby my baby...maybe not the BREN. View attachment 1067538 Chambers cuts would be 5.56mm and .223 Wylde. It would save a great deal of time and work... I would, of course, continue doing that for my serious hunting ammo and such.

Thoughts?

Do not charge your process!
That’s how bad things happen.

 

[Chuck R.]

I would at least check the brass length to make sure none are too long.

Every winter I prep 2-3000 .223 brass for the upcoming match season, most of it is range pick up brass from matches or an indoor range where I shoot IDPA matches..

My normal procedure for my 3Gun match and practice ammo:

1. De-cap brass using a standalone old RCBS Rockchucker press
2. Clean all brass in a tumbler with SS pins, this also gets the PPs pretty clean
3. Sort using a primer pocket gauge, looking for loose pockets and crimps, loose pockets get tossed, crimp pockets get swaged
4. Anneal using a BC1000 annealing machine
5. Full length size on a Dillon 550, using a tool head with just a sizing die
6. Run in a Dillon vibrating cleaner with walnut to remove the lube
7. Run all the brass through a Giraud Tri-Way trimmer set up for min length (some brass doesn't get touched due to it being short)
8. Reload on the Dillon 550 with a tool head missing the sizing die (CFE223 Powder and Hornady 62FMJ). NO CRIMP
9. Separate all the PMC brass loads and use these for the long stages.

The above normally keeps at 1.5 MOA, which is fine for the normal distance targets. The PMC loads are just slightly more than 1MOA.

 

[dgod]

Chuck R has a very good plan, the only one I saw that included Annealing, it looks like that addition would get you where you wish to be.

Good Luck
Dan

 

[Blue68f100]

Chambers cuts would be 5.56mm and .223 Wylde. It would save a great deal of time and work.

These chamber do not give you any more room for the brass, no extra length. They only effect how much space the bullet has to move before engaging the lands.

Trim the brass as you should to keep it below max. I trim mine to 1.750", which is middle of the road.

 

[Bronco72]

I finally got a RCBS trimmer with the 3 way cutting head! Each head is specific to a certain caliber. Trims to length, chamfers and bevels all at the same time. It is adjustable for each function so you can set it where you want it. I am anal about bottle neck cartridges not so much about straight walled rifle and even less about pistol cases.
I knew a guy who blew up his M1A after about the 3rd or 4th reload not trimming his brass! Luckily all it did to him was sting him pretty bad.

 

[lightman]

I trim everything that I load. Trimming is part of the loading process and I consider it important. I run everything through my Giraud trimmer. Anything that doesn't touch the cutting blades gets set aside so I can chamfer them by hand. Essentially I use the trimmer as a case length gauge.

 

[rdnktrkr]

I use the Lee trim die with a powered screwdriver that way I know all cases are the same length or shorter (I also crimp ammo for the ARs), I think skimping on any procedure when reloading is asking for trouble when you get to the range.

 

[ParallelCode]

Personally I hate trimming. However, it is a crucial step I would never skip. If time is too limited, something like a Giraud Trimmer would make short work of a pile of brass.

 

[DMW1116]

I try to keep the process the same for rifle or for pistol rounds. Decap, clean, decrimp primer pockets, lube, size, measure, trim, debur inside and outside. That way I don’t wonder what I did different for this batch. Anything over max length gets trimmed. For accuracy testing anything over the trim length gets trimmed.

 

[Remington1911]

I can tell you just what is going to happen.

You are going to tell yourself eh why bother.....then you will miss, and guess what thought is going to hit you in the forehead first.

Me, reloading is really Zen time for me, I do it the same way every time. I just enjoy the process....and now that I can trim brass with out tears forming so much the better.

 

[CoalTrain49]

After I size I gauge check my brass for length. I trim/chamfer the ones that need it. Usually about 50/50 for some weird reason. All of my brass is Lake City range pickup so I have a little consistency.

If I were looking for match grade ammo I would just buy it. I probably can't build it with the gear I have. About the best I can do is 1 MOA with a bolt rifle.

 

[n2omike]

What do you guys think about this tool? Frankford Arsenal 4 station trimming tool.

I have the FA trim station and LOVE IT! The cutters it comes with are lower quality, but it uses the same case trimmer head as the RCBS, and the primer/debuting heads use the same threads as common Lyman tools. I bought upgraded bits made by McJ from Amazon.

Below is a video of it trimming, deburring and cutting the primer crimp on a 5.56 case. Entire operation only takes a few seconds.