And this why why we oppose waiting periods

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DeepSouth

DeepSouth

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Sad story, and an example of one of the reasons we oppose waiting periods.
NJ should be held accountable, at least to some degree.

The 39-year-old hairdresser from Berlin Township, New Jersey, was afraid that her ex-boyfriend might try to hurt her. Fearing possible domestic violence, she reportedly filed a restraining order against her ex, installed security cameras and tried to get a gun for self-defense but New Jersey’s gun law are notoriously draconian, and the process to merely obtain a handgun permit takes months.

Browne was found by law enforcement stabbed to death in her driveway on Wednesday night. Her ex-boyfriend, identified as Michael Eitel, 45, has since been arrested and charged with murder.
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http://www.theblaze.com/stories/201...while-waiting-for-nj-to-allow-her-to-have-one
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From the original story, not a waiting period. Just red tape.
The application process typically takes two months or more as police collect information on the applicant, including fingerprints and reference checks. "We did not get the fingerprint information yet,"
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Full story vv
http://www.courierpostonline.com/st...04/woman-fatally-stabbed-berlin-twp/28461361/
 
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Agree that the state should be held partially responsible. It will never happen though. Sad story.
 
Reminds me of the LA riots after the Rodney King verdict.. word was that many people, including some "higher-ups", tried to get guns for protection, and were equally denied/delayed.
 
"Agree that the state should be held partially responsible."
Uh, the state is specifically liable for denying her access to a means for self defense. Same as if New Jersey's officers had held her in cuffs before here ex as she was murdered. The system is so screwed up, there wasn't even a chance for an individual 'crat to assume liability --it was too slow for this to have been any one person's fault for a denial/etc.

The only way justice can be served for this woman's death is for a) the killer to be destroyed at the hands of the state (to prevent this one criminal's future bad acts), and b) the end of this monstrous crime against New Jersey residents' civil rights perpetrated for the last century (to ensure this tragic circumstance never again repeats due to NJ's obstruction)

I really hope her family has the sense to demand more than blood money from these accessories to murder running the state.

TCB
 
You are aware that there are those who would consider it a good thing that potential gun violence against Michael Eitel was prevented by NJ gun laws?
 
We all need to be hitting up the various bloggers, media contacts, reps, and leaders who will listen to us, and make them repeat this story. This what we've been talking about all along, and fearful of; that gun control facilitates the deaths of the weak at the hands of the criminal. That no one is made safe by legal constructs like laws or restraining orders or cameras or policeman, but solely by their ability to avoid conflict and the means to devastate a threat if they cannot.

Our outcry was able to spare Shaneen Allen and her family the outrage and disruption of a lengthy prison sentence; perhaps we can pull together for a positive effect with Carol Bowne's story as motivation. And before someone says that waving a bloody shirt makes us no better than the anti's, know that the only reason she lacked the handgun meant to defend herself from this guy is gun control. Unlike so many killers who circumvent legal structures to acquire the means for violence/destruction that are held as reasons to erect more legal structures, this woman followed the rules and instructions of the state that enacted them with the promise of safety and protection for all its citizens.

"You are aware that there are those who would consider it a good thing that potential gun violence against Michael Eitel was prevented by NJ gun laws?"
And we need to make them proclaim that loudly and proudly in defense of these unjust laws. Preferably before a federal judge considering constitutionality of the same.

Imagine that; this case as the basis of precedent for finding legal liability in those who establish gun free zones or restrict our access to the means of self defense, then utterly fail to protect those affected. Force the state to actually protect us when they say they will, or leave us the means to do so ourselves.

TCB
 
You are aware that there are those who would consider it a good thing that potential gun violence against Michael Eitel was prevented by NJ gun laws?
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I am aware of that, but my opinions of such people are not, shall we say "high road."

The term "gun violence" really gets under my skin. I'll never forget when Ted Nudget asked Piers Morgan if he cared about violence that didn't involve a gun. They'll lie say they do, but their actions are contrary.
 
Waiting periods do not accomplish anything. They do not prevent the crooks from getting guns illegally, and there is no waiting period when a weapon is purchased illegally.
 
i wonder if NJ lefties feel any remorse whatsoever, or even understand, that their votes directly led to this woman's death. all are complicit.
 
"I wonder if NJ lefties feel any remorse whatsoever, or even understand, that their votes directly led to this woman's death. all are complicit."

Here's a disturbing thought;
If the moral weight of complicity is divided among all the participants, no one is at fault for this obvious injustice, and nothing will be done to prevent its reoccurrence. If the moral weight of complicity is multiplied among all the participants, the scale of the injustice here is incalculable, and utterly taints those who would be charged with correcting it.

In short; New Jersey needs outside help and/or interference, and badly. Nothing else can save them.

TCB
 
Most oppose waiting periods because it puts you at the whim of some over paid civil servant. Says, "You can have it, but we think you're going to do something bad regardless of your past, so not until we say you can have it. Never mind why. We know more about what's right for you than you do."
 
"Man sought in ex-girlfriend's slaying kills himself", Associated Oress, 6 Jun 2015, 4:48 PM EDT
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/N/NJ_WOMAN_SLAIN_EX_BOYFRIEND_SOUGHT_NJOL-

Michael Eitel went to the home of a former girlfriend who had vacated her home after hearing of the murder of Bowne. Police searched her home and garage Friday and found nothing. Before she returned Saturday, she requested a second sweep. About 1:30 pm today police found Eitel had hanged himself in her garage.

At least a nice non-gun suicide and not an evil gun suicide. I am beyond cynical snarkiness and not feeling very High Road right now.
 
Shall Not Be Infringed

What's so hard about this? Unconstitutional and downright despicable

The fat governor should be charged as an accomplice to the murder.
 
I don't get it . The second article states he was charged (the first article indicated he was arrested and charged). Do you sppose the first article was incorrect or did they let him out on bail? I would think they would not file charges before the suspect was in custody.

Bail?
 
Sounds like a textbook lawsuit against the state, as long as the family goes along with it. I'll bet the NRA would represent them pro bono, and the family might even get some money out of a settlement, along with a positive judgement that may save future lives.
 
What a tragic story and indeed the reason why waiting periods like in Jersey are utter BS. And some of the same crew that would snivel about a "war on women" would be just fine with woman, like this unfortunate lady, being completely disarmed.
 
barnbwt said:
"Agree that the state should be held partially responsible."
Uh, the state is specifically liable for denying her access to a means for self defense. Same as if New Jersey's officers had held her in cuffs before here ex as she was murdered. The system is so screwed up, there wasn't even a chance for an individual 'crat to assume liability --it was too slow for this to have been any one person's fault for a denial/etc.

The only way justice can be served for this woman's death is for a) the killer to be destroyed at the hands of the state (to prevent this one criminal's future bad acts), and b) the end of this monstrous crime against New Jersey residents' civil rights perpetrated for the last century (to ensure this tragic circumstance never again repeats due to NJ's obstruction)

I really hope her family has the sense to demand more than blood money from these accessories to murder running the state.

TCB
Click to expand...
The killer meanwhile committed suicide.
 
barnbwt said:
"I wonder if NJ lefties feel any remorse whatsoever, or even understand, that their votes directly led to this woman's death. all are complicit."

Here's a disturbing thought;
If the moral weight of complicity is divided among all the participants, no one is at fault for this obvious injustice, and nothing will be done to prevent its reoccurrence. If the moral weight of complicity is multiplied among all the participants, the scale of the injustice here is incalculable, and utterly taints those who would be charged with correcting it.

In short; New Jersey needs outside help and/or interference, and badly. Nothing else can save them.

TCB
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philosophy was never my forte in college, i just wish people who claim they 'mean well' and 'think of the children' would understand that their misguided and ignorant well meaning and thinking of children kills people.
 
He was charged with murder while there was an active manhunt, so the intital report he was arrested and charged is apparently the mistake. Newsroom assumption may have been arrest preceeds charge. Rush to print error.

He had been in trouble before for abusing a girlfriend. I do not know if that was the girlfriend in whose basement he killed himself. But the implication of what could have happened if she had not stayed away from her home, and called the police to check it out twice before returning, is scary.
 
Ironically, this entire sorry event is proof that gun control is worthless. First, It prevented a woman from protecting her and as a result it caused her death. Second, it did not prevent her from being killed as she was knifed to death. Third, it did not prevent the piece of crap from killing himself as he did so with a noose.

So, in this case, gun control was a complete and utter failure. It failed in every way possible.
 
Everyone has to be aware of the fact that NJ gun laws are what they are because of the way people vote or don't vote in NJ. They elect the law makers that make those draconian laws and obviously feel that they work. I think you would have to ask someone who lives in NJ if they think those laws protect them. My guess is a majority of them either have no opinion (probably don't vote) or think they do. I'm not picking on NJ, you would probably get the same answer in CA.

I think it unfortunate that people can't arm themselves and feel badly for this woman because she couldn't. As was stated, the people in NJ probably don't see it as anything out of the ordinary and just a small burden to be able to live in a state that has a maximum amount of gun control.
 
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CoalTrain49 said:
Everyone has to be aware of the fact that NJ gun laws are what they are because of the way people vote or don't vote in NJ. They elect the law makers that make those draconian laws and obviously feel that they work. I think you would have to ask someone who lives in NJ if they think those laws protect them. My guess is a majority of them either have no opinion (probably don't vote) or think they do. I'm not picking on NJ, you would probably get the same answer in CA.

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CoalTrain49, And those who have no opinion on government are not even ashamed of it; they are proud of it and know not of this "Second Amendment". They are not even aware that their state is limiting their civil rights.

I have even been called a "pawn of the NRA" for supporting a Constitutional Right. I don't call those who are literate First Amendment pawns of the newspapers and book publishers by merely creating a market for their product.

chuck
 
Waiting periods should be opposed because of their dubious constitutionality, that they manifest an undue burden to the Second Amendment right, devoid of a rational basis or legitimate legislative end.

A policy of emotionalism and demagoguery is not the way to challenge waiting periods, or any other unwarranted firearms regulatory measure.
 
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