Another hole in the memory question.
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Captain Quack
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Thank you, LiveLife. And as it happens, the dummies in that range turned my beloveds Taurus G3c into a jam-o-matic. All very close to 1.140. We were doing a magazine test since we just got it back from Taurus for a magazine issue. Almost every round stuck in the chamber. Had to pop the mag and really rack on the slide to get it to move and pop it out. What have I done wrong now? Wrong OAL?
Captain Quack.
Captain Quack.
LiveLife
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Steps for 9mm load development are outlined here - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-and-discussions.778197/page-10#post-11419509
You first determine Max OAL using your barrel then determine Working OAL by function testing feeding dummy rounds from the magazine and releasing the slide without riding it (You do the same to also check for bullet setback).
So start long around 1.150" - 1.160" and incrementally decrease the OAL by .005" until dummy rounds reliably feed and chamber from the magazine.
You first determine Max OAL using your barrel then determine Working OAL by function testing feeding dummy rounds from the magazine and releasing the slide without riding it (You do the same to also check for bullet setback).
So start long around 1.150" - 1.160" and incrementally decrease the OAL by .005" until dummy rounds reliably feed and chamber from the magazine.
fxvr5
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They might be too long. First thing is to do the plunk test to see what length will fit in the barrel without sticking. The loaded round should drop in the barrel, spin freely and drop out.
Take the barrel out and test it. Instructions here: https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/reloading-tips-the-plunk-test/99389
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Captain Quack
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I know what I'm doing this after noon. Thank you for your excellent advice fxr5. LiveLife. Do you know every thread on this site, lol. I've bookmarked that thread, and it will be tonight's reading. Next time, use more than one round for the plunk test. I've decided to take a break from this for a couple of days. I did the plink test with some blazer 9mm 115gr. They plunked in but not out and would not turn. I'm and confused and befuddled. I see some good single malt in my future.
Captain Quack.
Captain Quack.
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kalielkslayer
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OK, I guess “if it plunks, it’ll work” doesn’t count if you go shorter than SAAMI specs.
I guess I took for granted EVERYONE would stay within SAAMI specs.
I stand corrected, kind of.
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Captain Quack
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Update: I have discovered that rounds that will plunk in my Ruger Max-9 will not plunk in her Taurus G3c. I'm also going to test my micrometer tested to make sure it's accurate.
LiveLife
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I verify accuracy of my calipers with ZZ pin gages and Brown & Sharpe micrometer - https://www.travers.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=.355 pin
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Captain Quack
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The good weather will be here on Thursday and Friday, so we definitely want range time. 1.132-1.138 plunks nicely in my Ruger. I'm rolling them out in batches of 20. Then I'm metering each one. Anything outside those parameters does in the pull bin. I'm hoping I can figure out what to do about her Taurus. What plunks in mine rides high in hers. I'm going to get a new caliper meter tomorrow when we go to the big city for more medical stuff. I've changed and gone over everything else. Only hardware left. This is the result. 1.132-1.138 which plunks in my Ruger fine on the left. Any outside that range in the bin on the right. I saw OAL's from 1.011 to 1.167 (that's one of each on each end.)
CQ
CQ
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It sounds as if the Taurus barrel has a short leade or tight chamber or both. Short leade is a known issue for CZ pistols, but I have not read of it for Taurus.
Try plunking your sized cases (not loaded rounds) in the Taurus barrel to test for tight chamber.
If short leade is it, seat the RMR bullets deeper, find another bullet with a profile that works for you, or have a gunsmith ream the Taurus barrel.
Try plunking your sized cases (not loaded rounds) in the Taurus barrel to test for tight chamber.
If short leade is it, seat the RMR bullets deeper, find another bullet with a profile that works for you, or have a gunsmith ream the Taurus barrel.
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Captain Quack
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You're answering my questions before I can ask them, lol. I was going to start a new thread for that. LiveLife referred me to some good conversations about that. (and the sized cases plunked fine)
CQ.
CQ.
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Captain Quack
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Working on the rounds for the Taurus 9 mm. Bought myself a new digital caliper meter. Thousands didn't always quite match up with the old one, so I am assuming the new one is correct. Stupid question. Which part should I use to do the measuring? Inside, middle or outside the "fangs". (Because I can't think of the right word this morning.)
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NMexJim
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GeoDudeFlorida
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Jaws
LiveLife
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Here's a tip to measure more consistently ... Use pin gages to verify accuracy of calipers, like using check weights to verify scales as "best practices".
When several calipers I had started giving different readings, especially depending on the amount of force I applied on the wheel or whether I used the middle or the tips of the jaws; @Walkalong suggested I get some measuring standards. Since I often measure round/cylindrical objects, decided to order cylindrical .355"/.400"/.451" pin gages - https://www.travers.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=.355 pin
To enhance repeatability, I measured the pin gages with EYES CLOSED so I could apply same amount of force on the wheel. Well, dial calipers I bought over 20 years ago were worn and did not consistently verify the pin gages to .001", but digital calipers from Harbor Freight bought about 10 years prior verified the pin gages repeatedly (NOTE: Quality of HF digital calipers has decreased in recent years so definitely verify with pin gages before buying ... FWIW, HF dial calipers never consistently verified pin gages to .001" for me and I stopped checking after getting FA dial calipers). Of course, Brown and Sharpe micrometer verified the pin gages consistently.
I ordered Frankford Arsenal dial calipers and it consistently verified the pin gages with eyes closed or open whether I used the middle or tips of the jaws. FA dial calipers is the primary measuring tool I have on the bench and after several years, continues to verify pin gages along with B&S micrometer.
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Captain Quack
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I'm rapidly running out of room on my bench, lol. But these things are too important to not have. Thank's guys.
GeoDudeFlorida
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Don’t do what I did and decide to go full-on minimalist. I ditched the bench and reloading room completely and now just store my stock and equipment, and have a adopted a fully-portable set of reloading solutions. I can reload anywhere - in fact, I HAVE to reload somewhere because there’s no other place to do it.
Minimalism has it’s ups and downs but, in the long term, for me the advantages outweigh the disadvantages. I doubt my version would work for very many other people, though.
NMexJim
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Actually, a set of micrometers is a thou or two more accurate than a set of vernier calipers however, it's a moot point full of minutia. I keep both on my bench just for giggles.
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Captain Quack
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This used to be my computer workbench. Maybe I need to get rid of all those 12 Bluetooth earpieces and 8,000,000 6 foot cat 5 cables and the first generation USB wifi dongles and all 17 mice all the way back to 9 pin. Maybe I can find someone who wants a antique collection of computer parts. That would free up half my shelving. I would love to hear about your portable reloading solution! We do have a shooting "shed" at the range, and it would be nice to haul what I need out there and set it up and just roll changes right there instead of rolling 50, half hour to the range each way, rolling another 50 with the corrections. You know how it works.
GeoDudeFlorida
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I need to take some new pictures of the stools.
These are kind of old and I have made some changes to the APP stool. Also need to get some pics of the tackle-boxes I use for taking stuff along.
NMexJim
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Once I find a load that works, I will roll at least a 1k. I just finished w/ a 1k 9mm and another of .380. I'm in the process of another 500 9mm. I normally will shoot 200 or so in a season. 'Tis the season.
For me, it was a matter of finding a load that was near my carry ammo in terms of recoil and point of aim. I would suggest that you find a load you like and shoot a lot of them.
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Captain Quack
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This is the range report.
115 gr at OAL 1.10* 4.3. Unique was to put it nicely. A dismal failure. In her Taurus G3c it was a jam-o-matic ever though when I ran them through from the mag by hand, all 12 fed fine. I said to myself,"self I says. That's why we're here." Loaded up her mags with blazer 147gr so she can have some shootzemboomen fun. More jams. I was watching her do the drill when I noticed the slide was not going forward all the way into battery. The back end was about 3-4 mm from being in battery. About one out of 4 would not go back to battery. Tried some blazer 115 gr. Same issue. Ok. these things happen. It'll be going back to Taurus again. It's a new pistol. I said to myself,"self I says. That's why we're here." She switched to her Taurus 605 revolver. After 4 rds the trigger locked and wouldn't move. The cylinder came in and out. You could cock the hammer. Just no trigger movment. I said to myself,"self I says. That's why we're here." Going to see about sending that back to Taurus as well. Decided to be stupid and try those OAL 1.10* in my Ruger Max-9. After 5 shots, my beloved started waving her arms. "That last one just went POOT! and you didn't hit the target or the backdrop!" A squib. Again. So we went to the range with 3 working guns and came home with no working guns. We stopped to do some grocery shopping for dinner on the way home, and I HATED being without my pistol in public. Medical offices are bad enough.
I'm officially blaming gremlins and will be filing an official report with the Gremlin Tracking Agency (GTA, Part of Homeland Security)
But this is why we have range test days. Since it was the gremlins, I don't feel bad about it. A vice. A hammer. A brass rod, expressing frustration with said hammer. De-squibed. First day of 70+ temps. Sunshine. Only one other person on the range. It was much more gooder than staying home, by far. Except maybe fishing. (That's Monday) We're on second spring and going to enjoy it while we can before it snows again.
Captain Quack.
115 gr at OAL 1.10* 4.3. Unique was to put it nicely. A dismal failure. In her Taurus G3c it was a jam-o-matic ever though when I ran them through from the mag by hand, all 12 fed fine. I said to myself,"self I says. That's why we're here." Loaded up her mags with blazer 147gr so she can have some shootzemboomen fun. More jams. I was watching her do the drill when I noticed the slide was not going forward all the way into battery. The back end was about 3-4 mm from being in battery. About one out of 4 would not go back to battery. Tried some blazer 115 gr. Same issue. Ok. these things happen. It'll be going back to Taurus again. It's a new pistol. I said to myself,"self I says. That's why we're here." She switched to her Taurus 605 revolver. After 4 rds the trigger locked and wouldn't move. The cylinder came in and out. You could cock the hammer. Just no trigger movment. I said to myself,"self I says. That's why we're here." Going to see about sending that back to Taurus as well. Decided to be stupid and try those OAL 1.10* in my Ruger Max-9. After 5 shots, my beloved started waving her arms. "That last one just went POOT! and you didn't hit the target or the backdrop!" A squib. Again. So we went to the range with 3 working guns and came home with no working guns. We stopped to do some grocery shopping for dinner on the way home, and I HATED being without my pistol in public. Medical offices are bad enough.
I'm officially blaming gremlins and will be filing an official report with the Gremlin Tracking Agency (GTA, Part of Homeland Security)
But this is why we have range test days. Since it was the gremlins, I don't feel bad about it. A vice. A hammer. A brass rod, expressing frustration with said hammer. De-squibed. First day of 70+ temps. Sunshine. Only one other person on the range. It was much more gooder than staying home, by far. Except maybe fishing. (That's Monday) We're on second spring and going to enjoy it while we can before it snows again.
Captain Quack.
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Captain Quack
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That's what I plan to do NMexJim. Find one that works. Preferably, in both 9mms. Sit there all day until my arm falls off. I've got about 2500 115 gr FMJ RN and RMR is just 35 miles down the road, and we're down that way every other week. I bought 1k new Winchester cases when I had the chance, on top of what I already had. The score on the primers made 1k rounds possible. Recently bought 10 pounds of powder on top of what partial bottles I have from the before time. Get the good load and pull. The Beloved Wife is also going to be pulling the handle and placing the bullets, while I sit and watch and fix whatever the Loadmaster throws at us.
Captain Quack.
Captain Quack.
