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Answering the call.

Discussion in 'Strategies, Tactics and Training' started by sm, Jun 14, 2009.

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  1. sm

    sm member

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    We have new folks cycle into THR all the time, and one area of concern many have is "answering the call".

    -They come home to find a front door open, or window busted out.
    -They arrive to business and find a door ajar, or window busted out.
    -They get a call at work, the home alarm is going off.
    -They are at home, and the business alarm is going off.

    I was born into and have spent decades in high risk work. The same principles that apply to me, apply to J.Q. Public.

    The reality is, most folks are not aware of some models of criminals, and not being disrespectful, instead stating fact, some of these "professional criminals" will never be a concern for you.

    Simple, you do not have what they want, as their time is money, and there is not enough return in investment going after what you have.
    You have seen them, been around them, even stood in line with them , or sat next to them in a restaurant.


    That said, everyone is a prey to some predator, this is just the natural order of things.

    This is why one should know, their local area and its laws.
    Jurisdictions vary with politics, "definitions" , "interpretations" of enacted laws.

    If you really want to know what crimes are being done in your immediate area, go spend time in a courthouse.

    If you really want to know what is the law in your area, and what "what a prudent person" can and cannot do, "without a reasonable doubt", go sit in on some courtroom cases.

    It does not make a tinker's damn what goes on in Texas, Vermont, or Alaska for instance, if you live in California, Maryland, or Wisconsin.

    Keep in mind, a jury of your peers does not mean 12 folks that are exactly as yourself.


    First Responders , such as Law Enforcement, Fire Fighters, Emergency Medical Technicians, Search & Rescue, and others chose to become these Professionals.

    They Run Toward Serious Situations.

    This was their choice to become one that runs toward trouble, and have invested the time and money, with getting properly educated and trained to do these Professional Jobs.

    They continue to train, and continue to take re-certifications in many skill sets, needed for their profession.

    They have to pass re-certs, license exams, and qualifications, or they cannot work.


    J.Q. Public has to accept all this.
    J.Q. Public may not like it, or agree , still they have to accept all this.
    Besides the safety of J.Q.Public, their is the safety of others, and this includes not impeding Professionals as they First Respond and carry out their professional duties.

    It is human nature to want to "do something".

    The brain is the most useful tool, and one has to train the brain, and use the brain effectively to stay safe, and to keep others out of harms way.

    .
     
  2. sm

    sm member

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    True.

    My first wife arrived home to see the glass window busted out near the front door.

    She noticed this as she pulled up to park in front of the house. She never came to a full stop, instead drove to a trusted neighbor, and called police, and then me.

    Inside the house was a Black Lab, and Golden Retriever.
    Those dawgs were family, and meant more to use, than many folks we knew.

    My wife stayed with the neighbor.

    This was all practiced plans, it had to be. Plans that went into full tilt boogie serious in the blink of an eye.

    Bodyguards went with me, and additional Security for the workplace.
    Why?

    -Kidnap the wife going into that house, meant Evil could use her as hostage, against me.

    -Kidnap me en route to investigate, and I could be used as hostage against those I worked for.

    -Get us both, and we could be used against each other, to give up information useful for Evil, as not only hostage for my work, also her family.

    The neighborhood was "locked down", no marked units near, undercover cops were the nearest, in vehicles that blended in.
    Plainclothes were next near.

    What happened?

    En route I saw the mailman, and I pulled over. Which gave body guards a fit up front of me, and the ones behind a "what the hell now?" .

    "Excuse me, have you delivered mail to such-n-such street yet?" - I asked.

    "Yes I have and that Black Lab did not like me, as I rang the doorbell and he busted out some panes on the window. I called the local police and ..."

    Our regular mailmen were on vacations, this fill in mailman the dawgs had not met yet.
    Lab was on the couch, most likely asleep, and when the door bell rang, he did not know this person on the porch and went into full bore protection mode.

    He not only busted out glass, he busted out the wood that holds the glass panes.

    To him, the threat left.
    Good thing, because knowing him, he would have gone through that window, eventually, and put some serious hurt on "that stranger on my porch".

    So I arrive, codewords, passwords and practiced plans, and I inform Law Enforcement, and Body Guards what the mailman shared.

    The concern was the dawgs, and police clearing the house.
    The dawgs knew some cops, so it was my suggestion, they do the clearing.
    I also called my house, and let the dawgs hear "daddy" on the answering machine.

    "Hey guys, daddy here, you know ___ and ___ and ___ and they are coming over to say hi and bring treats".

    So three undercover cops arrive, with other officers taking the rear.
    If, anyone was in the house, they would hear three fellas were coming over, and with treats.
    I never said they were cops, just three names the dawgs knew.

    Undercover used a key to unlock door, the first cop, entered and was stopped there, two dawgs all excited in seeing him and "where are the treats?"

    The other two cleared the house. To the dawgs, this was normal for these three to be in the house and wander about.

    Neighbors, never got wind of any this. I stay private, do not advertise, and gave perceptions I wanted given.

    Just a couple with two dawgs, and three dudes coming to visit as they have before.

    Further out from the house, folks wandered what was going on. Rumors varied from a branch bank being robbed, to a warrant for arrest for someone, to some house that must be being raided for dealing dope.

    Wife and I were dumb as bricks "no, we did not hear about all the excitement the other day..."

    Black Lab , I had checked out, he did have some cuts.
    Golden Retriever went to the vet too.

    Gals at the Vet bathed and dipped, got them all handsome and pretty , and spoiled them rotten as they did with treats.

    Lab had this look "sorry about the window daddy, but I was in fear and just did what I did to keep that stranger out of the house".

    The front window had to be fixed, and it had different look, since the Lab really did mess up the wood where the panes fit.
    Oh well, that window needed some attention and sprucing up anyway.

    The dawgs had treats for the nice officers the next time they came over.
    Male Black Lab "bought" beer, and actually handed them out.
    Female Golden Retriever had "made up" little bags of peanuts, beef jerky, and cheese crackers.

    Dawgs ran the house, we just lived there...you know how it goes.
     
  3. xm21

    xm21 Member

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    What are you trying to say?Seriously:confused:
     
  4. sm

    sm member

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    True.

    I goofed up, but Lady Luck showed.

    I had been up for over 36 hours, pushing close to 48, and finally got to go to an apartment I was staying in , showered, gotten a bite to eat and gone to bed.

    Phone rang and "Alarm is going off at the office" the caller said about 2am.
    I am out of sorts, sleep depraved, not fully awake as I had zonked out and hard.

    So I snag clothes, gun, and head out the door. About halfway to where one of my vehicles was parked, my gut started screaming!
    I was fully awake, and in a dead bore run back into apartment, which I was able to do.

    I called a undercover cop that lived near, and he called this in...
    I called bodyguards , and had the alert go out to anyone else on the alarm call list.

    My mistakes:
    Alarm company never said the codeword, and therefore I did not give the codeword reply.

    I did not call the Alarm company back, as was another measure, to once again verify and make sure law enforcement, or if applicable, Fire Dept had been called.

    No, like a damn fool I get on my clothes, grab my gun, and walk outside at around 2am to get into my vehicle and by myself drive to check out an alarm going off.

    I may have only been 19 years old, still that was NO EXCUSE.
    I was raised into and had been trained better since I was a brat. I had earned being responsible to have...well...let me just say I had been on alarm call lists and all that goes with it since I was 13 years old. Before that, I had been "in on all this" since I was born.

    I know how I was made, and that location given up. Trust me, it was nothing I did ,or anyone I worked with did.

    This was long before Internet, and all the ease Internet affords one now.
    I will not share how easy all this was even back then, as we do have those not totally legit reading forums, still even with "old fashioned" and "antiquated ways" criminals have always been able to do what they do.

    It does not take a rocket scientist to see an Alarm sticker on a window. A sticker I had fussed and fumed about being on that window and I wanted removed...

    Still 3 serious armed bad guys, were on my parking lot. Word is there were more armed bad guys and at least one more vehicle.

    The apartment was furnished and did not have a balcony.
    I and mine had beefed up door and windows. We had shooting lanes and backstops, and cover...

    I stayed put, and waited for help, and codewords and passwords were used.

    That apartment was never used again by me or mine. The two vehicles I used, were moved and used out of state.

    I traveled, and normal to live out of a duffel bag...

    One the all clear as given, including the office, and others I worked with as this was serious security concern as "professional thugs worked areas", I spent the night with another undercover, female officer.

    I dunno, it just made sense for young gal and guy in jeans to be seen together and coming in..."like a couple that partied all night and having breakfast at this place ( Waffle House type thing of back in the day) , the idea being this gal had picked up some guy...which sorta went along with what she did undercover.

    My personal items were removed by 7am and I was never seen at that complex again, nor were anyone else that used that apt.

    Apt complex, just figured that apt was vacate, as it was from time to time, until two weeks later they were informed the business no longer had a need for it.

    Apt mgmt was accustomed to some apts being leased to churches for them to use as guest houses, or a medical facility for guests, or temp housing for some students.
    Or similar situations...
    I was just a 19 year that worked for a company that was in town from time to time and used that business apt.


    But you know what?
    Time are bad and are going to get worse. J.Q Public, would be wise to call alarm company back, have code words, and all and not just walk out the front door to answer an alarm, no matter what kind of business they are in.
    I don't care if it is Barber Shop, HVAC supply, Toy Store, or anything else.

    Situational Awareness: You cannot be "up" 24/7/52. You cannot, the human body will not let you. The human body is designed to protect itself, and it will, whether you want it to or not.
     
  5. sm

    sm member

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    Don't look like prey, think like a criminal.
     
  6. Rockwell1

    Rockwell1 member

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    You used two whole pages to say one line?
     
  7. Hungry Seagull

    Hungry Seagull member

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    Enough reading if taken slow the way things are done heah in the south, will be sufficient to learn something.

    I dont mind a bit of reading. Few tidbits here and there.
     
  8. psyopspec

    psyopspec Member

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    sm's posts are some of the most valid and valuable information that show up on THR. Period, end of story. If you can't or won't glean anything from the wisdom of those with experiences relative to the topic at hand, move along. There are those who hear, but they do not listen.
     
  9. conw

    conw Member

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    1) This is THR, no need to be rude to valued members
    2) sm is a treasure trove of info and experience. He writes stuff differently from the way some do, but he also has a lot more to share and a heck of a lot more to teach...but this is not strategy and tactics 101, so if you don't have any reading comprehension for the way he writes go back to basic stuff. If you want Cliff's Notes on taktikool house klearing, check Soldier of Fortune.
     
  10. xm21

    xm21 Member

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    sm,gotcha'.Sometimes it is hard to see the forest for all the trees;)Hungry Seagull I reckon' I know a little about the south and you do not sound like you were born or raised in Dixie.
     
  11. sm

    sm member

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    J.Q.Public has to know the local law of where they are.

    You cannot take the law into your own hands, except as defined by law in your area.
    Most often this means when you, or someone of disparity in in fear of life, or in some felonies such as arson.

    You. Had. Better. Make. Damn. Sure.

    Just because you have a gun, does not mean you are Wyatt Earp and have free reign to clean up the town.
    Legal will eat you alive.

    The classic example is coming upon a altercation in a alley, and seeing "gun" and shooting the person with the gun.
    You just shot an undercover cop, that was doing his /her sworn duty.

    Answering the call may be best to dial police direct, or 911, and "man with a gun at such-n-such location".

    Man with a gun calls, will get LE to arrive, and quickly. Yes, Undercover and Plainsclothes are accustomed to such calls made against them.

    Oh, if the responding officers do not know the Undercover, or Plainsclothes, these will drop guns, right then, right there.

    Protocol so responders can sort this out. Good Guy, Bad Guy, don't matter, the gun is dropped, and one hits the deck, and spreads them.

    Undercover, in order to maintain cover, are accustomed to be cuffed, and tossed in the back of a squad car.
    There may be some "resisting arrest" and "assaulting an officer" tossed in as well.

    So just because you have a Concealed Carry Gun, and Piece of Paper saying you can, does not mean you can play Wyatt Earp.
    Nor does this mean you will get to lay your gun down real nice and easy on soft grass as to not scratch it.

    First Responders do not know who the hell you are, and will not until everyone is sorta out.

    Re: Open Carry.
    My take is simple, if you can legally open carry, accept the fact not everyone is up to date on the law.

    Do not get upset if a "person with a gun" call is made about you. You have rights, and were within your rights, just as whomever made a call to police about a person with a gun, has a right to do so as well.


    Yes, wear the damn gun.
    Software, not Hardware, even if you do wear a gun, concealed or open carry, as is legal for you to do so.

    Software to not got where trouble is, leave when trouble shows up, and skill sets to deal with trouble, including use of firearm.

    Software to know that the best way to answer a call, might be to Observe, Report, and be a darn good Witness as to what all went down.
     
  12. Old Guy

    Old Guy Member

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    Most adults are not to aware of their surroundings, and can really get in to serious trouble in "Assuming" what the see, is "What" they know.

    A test, walk into your local Breakfast restaurant, and in walking to your seat, look for who is looking at you, looking at them!

    Very few, and to see you, they must be facing the entrance, it is natural for an aware person to respond at least visually to movement.

    Criminals eat breakfast you know. We eat pancakes (one big one!) about once a week, and are well known at our local First Watch, going there for 5 years.

    Rarely, but sometimes a glance on the way in flicks the "Oh-Oh" switch, they don't fit! Or you are sitting, and the same thought comes to mind on some one entering, it's not sweep your Wife to the deck and a open fire moment, not yet ever!

    You sometimes get a wee nod when your eyes catch eyes, try it, not many see you, seeing them.
     
  13. mbt2001

    mbt2001 Member

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    First off SM is the bomb. He is kind of like Opera, listen, HEAR, TRY TO UNDERSTAND and you will be AMAZED at what he is saying.

    Back to the post...

    Keep reading those posts until it sinks in. MOST people's security precautions are bunk and give them away even AS they do not work. Raise your hand if your WIFE or YOU would have seen the broken glass without stopping and move on and take the right action (call police / hubby / get to an area of comparative safety with someone you KNOW and TRUST that follows protocols designed for this). I mean someone watching the house might have thought she was checking addresses for a friends house or dodging a squirrel. Or would they stop the car and run screaming, crying and raving into the house and get smoked or worse? What about you, could you sit still and act with constraint, or would you run headlong into a completely unknown situation.

    Evil WANTS you to act like some emo driven nutcase. That is why they use the tactics they do.

    Caution is a state of being. You have to TRAIN yourself to be that way. Seriously, there are people who have spent thousands of dollars getting tactical training at Thunder Ranch, but come home and stand in front of lighted windows... Or tell their "neighbors" that they are leaving town for 2 weeks... et cetera.

    Everyone THINKS that when the chips are down, they will be "ready" or "more careful" or whatever. The problem is that they have so throughly trained themselves to be careless, that they virtually cannot stop themselves from being that way.

    Evil attacks not when you are rested and kitted out, but when you are tired, had too many drinks, unsuspecting, read WHEN / WHERE you are WEAK.
     
  14. lions

    lions Member

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    As my Grandpa used to say, "Sit down and shut up, you might learn something."

    I'll concede the fact that sometimes sm's writing style can be hard to follow. But follow it anyway because you will learn something.

    The longer I'm around THR the more I figure out whose opinion to listen to and whose to throw out the window, you can guess where sm's opinion stands with a lot of people around here.
     
  15. xm21

    xm21 Member

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    My question to sm about what he was trying to say was typed after reading the first post,when I pushed submit reply and my post came up I saw that sm had another post up about the break in,my question was about the first post only.The first post had me thinking that he was advocating not doing anything in the defense of your life or property and letting the authorities handle it because they are the only ones "trained" to handle those who would do you harm.Reading his other posts in this thread I can see where he makes observations about the advantages of thinking like a criminal,and the disadvantages of rushing into a situation where you do not really know what is happening.Sort of like what happened in NYC recently where a cop shot a guy running down the street with a gun in his hand.Turns out the victim was also a cop who was out of uniform and chasing someone who had tried to break into his car.Mbt2001,I liked the first paragraph in your response and the rest of your post was thoughtful also.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2009
  16. KenWP

    KenWP member

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    I am afraid I can't really get the hang of this thread. What are you talking about. The replies ramble on and on but make no point about what they are trying to say.
     
  17. xm21

    xm21 Member

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    Misinterpreted first post of sm

    Asked sm for clarification

    Subsequent posts from sm helped me to get his point

    A couple of members posts seemed to question my reading comprehension

    I thought mbt2001's post was enlightening and I appreciated his non confrontational manner of communication

    I trust this post did not ramble on and my point is clear,eh;)
     
  18. bababooey32

    bababooey32 Member

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    Lions

    Sorry lions...you appear to be confusing sm's "elusive writing style" (generous) with genius. Gibberish is gibberish. Borderline illiteracy combined with questionable story lines (bodyguards, female undercover rendezvous and stealth relocation?) makes these posts send my BS meter off. 26,000 posts or no, this one is hogwash.
     
    Biker likes this.
  19. Grey Morel

    Grey Morel Member

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    "valuable resource" aside...

    It doesn't matter how much experience or wisdom you may have collected over the years if you can't arrange it in coherent statements. I'm not going to wade through the gobble-de-gook to find the grains of truth, and neither are 99% of posters.
     
  20. lions

    lions Member

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    bababooey32:

    Reading most of your other posts you seem to like being abrasive, almost like you are looking for an arguement. I could be wrong but the point is, I really don't care to argue with you. If you don't want to read the "hogwash" then move along and stop "wasting" your time here.
     
  21. ArfinGreebly

    ArfinGreebly Moderator Emeritus

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    Bin Thar, Dun Thet

    I see we have the usual assortment of "sm is unreadable" along with the requisite "he can't be for real" crowd.

    Yeah, I found some of his stuff "confusing" at first. Helped when I remembered how to read "conversational Suthern."

    My wife's father had a storytelling style that was similar. Took me a while to get so I could pick up the nuances. For years, I "tolerated" his "obvious embellishments," and then I had a sit-down dinner with two of his sisters. Didn't take a lot of prompting, and they were telling tales of "Bunny" (yeah, my FIL's nickname) that made his "embellished" stuff look pale.

    I had to adjust my perception after that. Here was a fella who'd "bin thar, dun thet" and he was only telling me as much of the story as he figured I could handle. The only survivor above decks of a Kamikaze attack on his ship. Installed generators in dams built before I was born. Built bunkers at an obscure location in the Nevada desert. Built missile silos in the plains states. Hard-drinking, womanizing, Lincoln-racing, tough-as-nails SOB who raised two girls on his own (with help from his mother).

    Some of us live lives that trickle timidly through the gullies of time.

    Others live full-on, open-the-floodgates, carve-me-a-canyon lives that simply aren't comprehensible to those of us who figure a trickle is all the pressure we can take.

    I'm grateful I had the opportunity to know a "bin thar, dun thet" man, cut from the cloth of those who have lived lives on a grand scale, with the pedal down, yet who knew how small their lives were. I could never get "Bunny" to brag. Sometimes, if I approached it right, I could get him to "tell me a funny story."

    Bunny was "Suthern articulate." Phrases like, "I tell yew whut, boy!" (which can mean . . . a lot of things).

    I did learn to understand him and, within the scope of my timid life, to appreciate what he was and what he'd done. Kinda humbling.

    He was as rough a diamond as I've ever met, but the experience helped me to look past "rough" for the gem.

    Hard to read? If you stay with it, that'll pass.

    Embellished? Can't say. I'd guess -- and this is just me -- that it's more like "edited for content," and the full story would just be too . . . immodest.

    I still have a lot to learn, so, for myself, I'm gonna pay attention.

     
  22. bababooey32

    bababooey32 Member

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    So I'm "abrasive" because I enjoy a good debate and sm is a "genius who can teach us all a thing or two" after the posts above?

    No, not really. But I do only tend to post when I have a difference of opinion, so I see how you can get that sense. BTW - I prefer to "debate", rather than argue. Debating is a bit more civil and has some rules that make separating the men from the boys a bit easier.

    Fair enough. For the record, I DID try to wade through this stuff a couple of times. I was hoping it wouldn't be a waste of time. Anyway...off to another thread....
     
  23. ArfinGreebly

    ArfinGreebly Moderator Emeritus

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    Debate?

    bababooey32, debate is always welcome.

    Stick around. Get to know the folks here. Especially those who have been with us a long time.

    There's a lot of stuff to read -- heck, even just skimming the archives takes months.

    Everyone has a style.

    Take what you can use, there's a lot to choose from.

    From time to time, review stuff that seems confusing on the first pass.

    Hope you can benefit as much as I have.

     
  24. conw

    conw Member

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    Saying someone whom nearly everyone feels contributes valuable info "sets off your bs meter" is abrasive to the point of being trollish. I think everyone takes a little while to get what sm is saying. Here's an idea: next time you have a question and if you're lucky enough that he answers it, pay attention. Then you will realize that just because he doesn't type just like you, he probably still has some relevant stuff to say.
     
  25. sm

    sm member

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    My writing style is one I developed many many years ago for various reasons.
    Since Internet is public, I "may" be giving the perception I choose to.

    I also have works that I have given permission to be used in English text books, and have written other works as I was asked to write them for other text books for English, Sociology, Psychology, Criminal Justice and have been asked to be a consultant or "resource" on works written by others.

    No disrespect, I have earned being elusive and cryptic, as I have survived over five decades of something that involves high risk.

    I was born into a high risk environment, and spent my life with all the things that go with the environments and industries.

    You just think I am being elusive and cryptic about me, my privacy and safety, you would not believe how I am in keeping "people, places and things" private and confidential.

    My skillsets have been used to assist undercover cops for instance. For one, I am not a cop, and no disrespect, still one of the most difficult things a cop, or former military person, and especially one that becomes a cop to do is, not act like a cop or former military.


    Second, since I was very familiar with some settings, industry and the language used, and security is paramount, I could assist these officers in blending in.

    Third, my lessons were passed onto me, by those that had been doing what I did for a long time.
    You cannot get some of what you need in life, from a textbook, you have to get it hands on, from someone that has been there and done that.

    Those I respectfully refer to as Mentors & Elders, include some interesting men and women.
    In addition to those that "had come before me" were others these mentors felt had mindset, skillsets and other tool sets, that were of our benefit.

    Including ex cons.
    You want to know how a certain model of criminal is - spend time with one, and learn from them.
    Prostitutes are another group of persons one can learn a lot from.

    When I share about "perspectives", "blending in", "don't look like prey- think like a criminal" and other things...I do so from having been there, done that, and mentoring from those in the work I did, and ex cons, whores and others that "read the room" , "choose prey" and "take the mark down".

    Insurance Investigator buddy of mine, that worked "intelligence" for a branch of the military taught me a lot.
    We were introduced because he needed someone that knew the language and workings of some industries.
    I learned from him a lot!
    We got along great, razzed all the time we argued as to whom was "teaching whom".
    The reality is, one always learns more when they are assisting another, than the one that is supposed to do the assisting.

    Re: Models of Criminals
    There are a bunch of different models of criminals. Not only was I and mine concerned with what most folks have concerns of in regard to types of criminals, we had, what we termed "professional thugs".

    No disrespect, still many folks are not aware such professional thugs exist. Many folks have been in their presence and did not know it.
    The reality is, most folks will never be a target, much less a victim of such professionals.
    A professional's time is valuable and what you have, is not worth their time, for what they get in return.

    The weakest link in anything to do with strategy and tactics, is the human being.

    You can live in a gated community, with the most hi-tech alarm and surveillance system, with the most up to date safe , not a residential security container, instead a real safe, or real vault door and be a victim.
    Armed security within the gated community, even having personal body guards, or as they are referred to now-a-days, personal protection personnel.

    If some models of criminals want what you have, be this physical items, or what is in your head, they already own it, just a matter of when they choose to retrieve it.


    True.
    Professional thugs had me as primary target. My reputation was that of being "damn difficult to peg".

    There is that "elusive" , "cryptic" , and other terms I am described as being.
    These are part of the tool sets Mentors & Elders passed forward to me.
    Nobody speaks ill of anyone in my tight circle, and for damn sure these I refer to as Mentors & Elders- nobody!

    Professional Thugs could not "peg me", so they had a secondary target, and went for that one.
    I knew these folks.
    Short version as I have shared this elsewhere, is while the professional thugs, had him, and drove him around for hours upon hours in the trunk of his vehicle, the "not so" professional model of criminals they had to employ at the last minute, repeatedly had their way with his wife.
    Thank goodness their child was sick, and the medicine prescribed kept that young child sleepy and asleep as his mom was repeatedly raped.


    As soon as this all came out, I was distanced from the area, and these folks.
    It hurt to do so, but I was a professional too, and I knew, as did others I worked with , the professionals were hoping I would stick around to not only find out as much as could, I would also want, no, insist on being in working with detectives on figuring this crime out, and finding those that did this.

    My life has "compartments", some in other professions call this "dis-association", meaning you cannot get too close, and think with your feelings.

    It hurts like hell when you cannot be there for victims , victims because they came for you, and you could not be pegged and as a result these folks were targeted and victimized.
    Just one of many life realities I have to live with, as I own them.


    Re: Defaults of Character.

    I have more than you folks reading this do.
    Derek does not have enough bandwith for me to list all my defaults of character.

    One default is, I care, I really do care.
    So I pass forward as passed to me, and I admit making mistakes as I do so.
    Still I got heart, and I do care.


    Re: Original Post.

    You can bet your bottom dollar that first wife and I cared about those two dawgs.
    Oh we cared about the house, and stuff inside.
    Still the reality , and it took some serious sit down and lessons with this wife, that "stuff" can be replaced, just people cannot be.
    Dawgs, are in a special gray area, or as she preferred to say "rainbow" area, in reference to the "rainbow bridge, where all dawgs wait to meet owners again".

    No, we did not want anything to happen to those dawgs, and had it been some other emergency, well, being honest, I and she would put the safety of those dawgs ahead of some humans we knew.

    Sounds cold, still reality is often cold , raw, and harsh.

    She knew, she had to continue driving on, seeing the glass busted, with the dawgs inside.
    It hurt like hell, it ate her up the whole time waiting for all this to play out, still she kept it together and did what she was instructed to do, and we had practiced over and over and over again.

    She had two master degrees in psych, and had been published, and at the time besides having over a hundred clients, she was teaching, and taking some more classes herself.


    That by far was the most difficult "dis-association" she had ever gone thru, and she had been through a client committing suicide.



    My original intent of this thread, means nothing to me now, the flame is smothered out.
    So as far as I am concerned, it can be locked, or better yet deleted.
    Yes, delete would be best, as I have nothing else to share about the subject matter, and I will think long and hard before I choose to share something along these lines again.

    Trainers and Instructors are correct, it seems folks that want it, do best when they have to take vacation time off and pay for it.


    No. I will discuss the matter further. I do not have to explain some things about me, as I have earned the right not to.
    So no PMs, I will not reply.


    -s
     
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