I have had this rifle for over 25 years now. Fired it the first time with black powder with 50 grains FFg topped off with Cream of Wheat filler. All over the target at 50 yards, some keyholing. It slugs .406 and I was using a .408 cast bullet. Previously, I had only fired smokeless rounds, and I think I had some keyholing and the best I could ever do was a decent group 12" high using AA5744 powder and jacketed bullet. For those who shoot .40-65, any decent loads come to mind?
Any luck with .40-65
- Thread starter orpington
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Curator
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Keyholes in your target are a sign that the bullet is not right for your gun. Since you did not include the make and model of your rifle, it is difficult to diagnose, Original .40-65 rifles were made with a slow twist rifling for short bullets of about 200 grains. More modern .40-65 rifles are given a faster twist for longer, heavier bullets of 300-400 grains. Off the shelf bullet moulds often give poor results when their dimensions don't appropriately fit the chamber of an individual gun. What gun? What bullet? Have you checked your muzzle for a possible burr or damage? More information is needed to give sound advice.
Curator
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orpington,
Everything about your load formula seems correct and should shoot fine. I had an original W1886 in .40-65 40 years ago and shot similar loads successfully. I suspect that your bullets are getting sized down as they are seated in your cases. Possibly a slightly larger neck-expanding plug or somewhat harder bullet alloy will solve this problem. Your accuracy might also improve with a .409 or even .410 diameter bullet. Chamber throat size is more important than bore size in getting good bullet fit. I have two "modern" .40-65 rifles with .406 bore diameters and they both shoot best with .410 diameter bullets.
Also, copper fouling or bore leading will cause severe degradation in accuracy. Getting all the copper fouling out is essential for cast bullet accuracy. Getting leading out of the bore is too. Copper requires a chemical to dissolve it. I have found that a nylon bore brush wrapped with a tuft of Bronze wool will dry-scrub leading out like scraping burnt off toast. Leading is nearly always caused by hot gas leakage past the bullet in the bore.
Everything about your load formula seems correct and should shoot fine. I had an original W1886 in .40-65 40 years ago and shot similar loads successfully. I suspect that your bullets are getting sized down as they are seated in your cases. Possibly a slightly larger neck-expanding plug or somewhat harder bullet alloy will solve this problem. Your accuracy might also improve with a .409 or even .410 diameter bullet. Chamber throat size is more important than bore size in getting good bullet fit. I have two "modern" .40-65 rifles with .406 bore diameters and they both shoot best with .410 diameter bullets.
Also, copper fouling or bore leading will cause severe degradation in accuracy. Getting all the copper fouling out is essential for cast bullet accuracy. Getting leading out of the bore is too. Copper requires a chemical to dissolve it. I have found that a nylon bore brush wrapped with a tuft of Bronze wool will dry-scrub leading out like scraping burnt off toast. Leading is nearly always caused by hot gas leakage past the bullet in the bore.
Catpop
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Orpington
Curator is correct- "Fit is King"
and .002 is not normally enough to seal lead boolits to bore without excessive leading. I,like him, have found it may take as much as .004 to seal it up.
I also suggest a cerrosafe cast of chamber, throat and a hint of bore to get a real handle on this issue.
Good luck
Curator is correct- "Fit is King"
and .002 is not normally enough to seal lead boolits to bore without excessive leading. I,like him, have found it may take as much as .004 to seal it up.
I also suggest a cerrosafe cast of chamber, throat and a hint of bore to get a real handle on this issue.
Good luck
Sunray
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Keyholes in your target indicate a lack of bullet lube too. Had that happen during my Great BP Cartridge Experiment. However, not enough velocity can do it as well. I'm not seeing any bullet weights less than 250 on the assorted BP cartridge sites though.
As I recall, the Lyman BP Handbook and Reloading Guide has proper BP load data for the .40-65. Not at home to look.
As I recall, the Lyman BP Handbook and Reloading Guide has proper BP load data for the .40-65. Not at home to look.
the Black Spot
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Could have constriction in barrel where rear sight is causing bullet to swage down in size?
My 40-65 is a very different rifle. It is a fast twist single shot with a .408 groove dia.
My very best groups use a 300 grn gas check cast to .410 and Not sized. I load SR 4759 loaded JUST hot enough to not leave unburned grains in the bore. That is 24 grains. Do not use this load in a Ballard especially a cast iron Ballard.
If you use the original 260 grain bullet weight you might have to increase the powder charge about 2 grains. For a sanity check 4227 and 5744 have burning rates very close to SR4759. You can check that data for sanity or use those powders if you can not get SR4759.
My very best groups use a 300 grn gas check cast to .410 and Not sized. I load SR 4759 loaded JUST hot enough to not leave unburned grains in the bore. That is 24 grains. Do not use this load in a Ballard especially a cast iron Ballard.
If you use the original 260 grain bullet weight you might have to increase the powder charge about 2 grains. For a sanity check 4227 and 5744 have burning rates very close to SR4759. You can check that data for sanity or use those powders if you can not get SR4759.
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