Any reason not to stay in a safe room

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FriedRice

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Scenario: Single, relatively well trained, armed civilian in a mostly decent urban neighborhood, only one on the block with posted alarm signs and stickers. If windows or doors are breeched, a deafening alarm goes off and alarm company tries to reach me on my cell, no answer, then dispatch sends out LEO, probably 10 minutes away on any given night. The safe room is the bedroom. Two windows, both have two sets of window hung on each frame, one inside, one outside. You'd have to be thin to get in my windows without ripping the frame out. I'd hear it and respond immediately. One door entry to the room, weak door, paneled in the middle.

I am an unattractive target for an average home invasion. There's nothing flashy outside. The car is garaged. My neighbors are close. There are many better targets on this street. My house is also well lit at the entries.

So, if the alarm sounds in the middle of the night, is there any reason for me not to hole up in my room, barricade the door and take up position behind cover with my guns, phone and tactical ear muffs? This would create only one way in, and I will be ready. Backstops are in place past the line of fire if they come in through that door.

My thinking is that since I am an unattractive target for home invasion, the BG who really wants to get in knows me, and means specifically me harm. Unfortunately, this is part of my world although hopefully not likely. Seems like I'm a harder target at home. I would be easier to get to on the street. If I were specifically targeted, thinking like a BG, I wouldn't target me at home.

I understand threads like this can be divisive so I'd like to stay with my scenario if possible. There is no one else to protect in the house. All guns are in a safe with the exception of those in my room. Local LE has paper on my safety issues and I've met at least one of the officers on my beat. Please feel free to point out anything you think I've missed tactically. I am not planning for a societal collapse invasion, and this isn't gang territory. The best answer is to let LE clear my house, correct?

I also like to know why, so if you make a suggestion, I'd appreciate reading your reasoning so I can assess and learn more.
 
Excellent point on the fire. I'll close that gap in the safety plan. Shouldn't be hard to figure that out. I'm assuming that they may be looking for me to die of smoke inhalation or exit through a door, I'll probably kick out the window with guns on me. I will double check and make sure I've got sufficient fire alarms with fresh batteries.
 
As said before, except for a fire I see no reason to leave.

You could set some extinguishers up throughout the house if you haven't done so allready. Sounds like your allready set up pretty well with a good plan.
 
I'm not sure how you have your safe room arangements; it is hard to offer a valid suggestion.
It would be nice to have closed circut T.V. cameras, that would be a big plus on getting inside their decison making process. place shotgun muzzle to door as B.G. holds his ear against it to listen for signs of life.
t would also help when the cops get there. You can friend or foe through the camera and also have a record of what went down for your lawyer.
 
That's not an idea I've thought of, Averageman. But if someone invades my house and makes it to my saferoom, there isn't going to be any problem establishing jeopardy, ability and opportunity. If it was a common burglar, maybe. But my house is much less attractive for that compared to others on my block. And the chances of a person who knows me doing this are relatively rare. I'm a much better target on the street. I'm trying to walk that fine line lpl had a link to in another thread. Overpreparation/paranoia would interfere with my safety plan. So I'm going for "reasonable" and prepared. The camera would cross that line for me. But thank you for the suggestion and for your reasoning behind it. It's a good exercise for me to think through. If I were in witness protection or something like that, maybe. But fortunately it's not THAT bad.


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I am not sure I have the total picture.

But I believe you really need to I.D. the perp or who ever is on the other side of that door - or firing would be reckless [ at least in NY state ].

A truly secure door to the safe room would make an entry threat a mute point.

better to have 'non confrontational' security and then you dont get to go before the Grand jury to show why you fired.

AND there must be a form of knowledge that allows you to be SURE that you do not fire at LEO's and that those I.D'ing themselves as LEO = are in fact so.
 
I would not shoot without identifying the person and assessing their intent, quickly, as they bust through the door. I will be able to hear when the police shows up and I'll either be talking to dispatch to ID them or having them slip their card under my door. I will not even stand in front of the door until I know they are LEO. I don't think I need a camera for that. It's also not going to be just one officer clearing my house, IMO. LE please correct me if I'm wrong but you wouldn't show up to a house alarm call and clear my house alone, right? And you wouldn't bust down my safe room door unless you heard signs of trouble on the other side, right? Any other ideas from LE for positive ID without a camera?


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I know from personal experience (false alarm) that sometimes it is only one officer that clears your house.
 
you have the same plan as i do. if i hear a commotion in the home i am staying in my room where i have the upper hand of seeing the BG first.

now when my wife and I have children then a new plan must be implemented.
 
Quoted

I would not shoot without identifying the person and assessing their intent, quickly, as they bust through the door. I will be able to hear when the police shows up and I'll either be talking to dispatch to ID them or having them slip their card under my door. I will not even stand in front of the door until I know they are LEO. I don't think I need a camera for that. It's also not going to be just one officer clearing my house, IMO. LE please correct me if I'm wrong but you wouldn't show up to a house alarm call and clear my house alone, right? And you wouldn't bust down my safe room door unless you heard signs of trouble on the other side, right? Any other ideas from LE for positive ID without a camera?"

I have been sent to clear ahouse and LARGE building without backup and was told by radio "keep us advised".

And I would not be inclined to put my light and gun away to take out my I.D. card if there was a remote threat from lethal force [ such a the reason I was searching your house ].

SO the camera or another way to I.D. officers entering would be cool,and what if your phone line were cut AND your cell took a dump ?.
 
The cell phone is never dead and I don't have a land line. The alarm runs off a separate wireless system and has back up power as well. So LE will show up and I should be able to talk to 911 while I'm inside. A camera would just show an officer in uniform. That is not a good enough ID for me. We would need to have some dialogue before I opened that door. Also, when they run my address, they should see exactly why I'm not gonna open my door without a positive ID.

I've never met a city cop here who doesn't have a card. You really think they wouldn't slip that under my door if I asked for positive ID? Or at least give me their name so I can verify with dispatch they are who they say they are? None of that requires a camera.

The chances that someone would come at me at home is fairly remote. If BG has watched my routine, there are many better times to catch me. And I vary that up quite a bit.

How does LE usually handle this? They know there's an armed civilian inside so I would think we'd be going step by step to make sure there isn't very serious mistake. Would they come bashing through my door without letting me get positive ID, knowing I'm armed? I should hope not. Any other LE want to weigh in on this? I can also email a local LEO who is working with me for security at work and ask about their protocol.

And thanks for the poly carb link for the windows. I'll check it out.
 
retired LEO

I had to leave the job about 4 years back and it has not changed much.

My point was if I am in your house due to a break in and possible ARMED bg - will I drop all my gear to retrieve my I.D. card - NO is my answer.

As to a cell phone failure,think blockage [ if they REALLY want you ] and or cell tower failure [ or sabateage ].

Since you seem to believ that you are a possible target and have actually prepared a hardened room,I guess you should prepare for all possible scenerios.

Including as was mentioned a fire set to burn you out,AND a bg set to fire if you exit.

btw,what is to stop a bg from coming to your door to ask you a question = in uniform ?.

Postal,police,UPS,pizza delivery ,gas company,girl scout cookies,grass cutter/snow removal,door to door sales, = do you call the police for each and every such incident ?.
 
And thanks for the poly carb link for the windows. I'll check it out.
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Are you in particular danger?

The reason I ask is that fortification beyond a certain level can often pose increased danger to the occupant.

For example I know in the bad areas of some neighborhoods where strong steel bars are on all the windows to keep bad guys out, people often burn to death in their homes during a fire because if the fire is blocking a door they cannot quickly use a window.



Likewise people in cars with "bullet proof glass" suffer much more severe injuries if they impact said material during a car accident. It is like striking a brick wall.
Such a strong window also traps them in the vehicle if it tips over in a rain filled ditch, flooded road, pool or other body of water, and the doors won't open. Doors often won't open after a crash or rollover either because of the deformed metal, leaving the windows the only way out. Leaving the occupants to drowned trapped.
Or if a fuel leak or fire starts after an accident, the ability to smash a window and escape can be lost because the bullet resistant windows are too strong.
Leaving the occupants to burn trapped.

Since the risk of a motor vehicle accident is far greater than the risk of being shot at in a vehicle for most people, this means they are placing themselves in greater danger from a likely scenario (crash) to protect them from a less likely scenario (being shot at) by having "bullet proof glass".
Unless they are a high profile target likely to be shot at, or going into a situation where being shot at is quite likely, it can be counterproductive to safety.




Keep this in mind while fortifying your home from threats. If you have an electrical short, or a pet starts a fire are you going to die because your home has been hardened against commandos?

There can be various risks associated with increased protection from other risks.

As for not staying in a safe room? I know molotov cocktails were not uncommon in gang attacks (primarily against each other) some years ago.
Starting a house on fire and shooting people that come out or try to escape is also not an uncommon tactic against targeted individuals, though unlikely to be used against someone not targeted. The old "smoke them out" used for centuries in warfare.
 
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run a port to a neighbors WIFI, that you trust, that way if they jam a cell, cut a landline, you still have a way to communicate, and if you have an alarm, better for it to have two ways to contact the security company, also second the need for interior CCTV if you have a video system, that way you can see 'out' with out being seen.
 
If everything of value (or replaceable through insurance) is located within the safe room with you, then why not?

However, remember that burglars tend to return to easy scores. Once they've been in a house and met no resistance they tend to keep returning until nothing is left to steal.

"What if" the easy score you give them this time, leads to a return visit at a time you're not ready to get into the safe room? You're at work, the wife is in the shower, and two BG's come through the back door on their return visit?

Nothing is black and white.
 
Posted by KodiakBeer: However, remember that burglars tend to return to easy scores. Once they've been in a house and met no resistance they tend to keep returning until nothing is left to steal.
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Is that assertion supported by factual evidence?

Is that statement intended to imply that leaving a safe room to confront burglars is a good idea?
 
Good point about making sure to be able to get out. If you're careful about mounting the polycarb you can make it easy to get out but hard to get in. Frames with quick releases on the inside is one possibility.
 
Is that assertion supported by factual evidence?
Click to expand...

Yes. http://blog.frontpointsecurity.com/2010/11/08/home-security-systems-%E2%80%93-burglars-do-return-to-the-scene-of-the-crime/

Is that statement intended to imply that leaving a safe room to confront burglars is a good idea?
Click to expand...

No, it's intended to point out that there are other factors to consider. Ie: stopping a burglar at the door may be a better choice than running and hiding. It's a decision that each of us have to make and there is no black and white answer.
 
KodiakBeer said:
"What if" the easy score you give them this time, leads to a return visit at a time you're not ready to get into the safe room? You're at work, the wife is in the shower, and two BG's come through the back door on their return visit?
Click to expand...

While my experience in LE leads me to believe otherwise than your first point (other than under rare circumstances) the concerns raised in the latter part of the above are valid...except in the case of the OP. The OP laid out a very specific question to address a very specific concern:

FriedRice said:
if the alarm sounds in the middle of the night, is there any reason for me not to hole up in my room, barricade the door and take up position behind cover with my guns, phone and tactical ear muffs?
Click to expand...

FriedRice said:
My thinking is that since I am an unattractive target for home invasion, the BG who really wants to get in knows me, and means specifically me harm. Unfortunately, this is part of my world although hopefully not likely.
Click to expand...

The circumstances being set out in the question would put the OP already in the safe room with the object of the attack to harm the OP
 
Very good point

Just noticed that a poster mentioned "what if your in the shower" = I am guessing that your kitchen and all other household comforts are not in your safe room.

So how do you handle all that on top of my other,so far unanswered posts ?.

Just trying to keep it real world,like in getting the newspaper on a morning,either by going to the door or taking a walk.

Seems to me that a 'hardened room' is a minor solution to a possible major problem.

Especially if as you mentioned the police have it already down as to your addy and future calls.
 
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