Appropriate qualifications for CCW

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blue86buick

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I recently applied for a CCW permit here in good ole Linn County, IA. As the reason for my permit, I put down (almost verbatim):

"To exercise the right to bear arms as guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment, as well as to do as instructed in the Boy Scouts of America; Be prepared."

Well, as Iowa is a may issue state, the sherrif is allowed to deny me a permit. And he did, I got back a letter with a $25 check from the sherrif's office. After talking with the folks at my favorite gunshop, they indicated that for Joe Q Public, the only reason Sherrif Zeller will approve a permit is if you state that you carry large sums of cash, and specify on the application, $500 (or greater). Then, in order to be valid, whenever you carry, you must have $500 dollars on you.

Not only that, but there's a shooting qualification too. Based on some of the tests I've heard on here, I wouldn't mind that....but this is a score of 80 or better on a 25 yard pistol target. Is this unreasonable to ask, or is that a easy score to obtain.

Also, what's it like to get a CCW in Oklahoma or Tennessee? I could've taken a job in OKC, OK this spring, and didn't :banghead: and used to live in TN, and wouldn't mind moving back.
 
Sheriffs and judges like to play games , you might check carefully to see if he is within the law to make restrictions. However I have always supported manditory training and urge people even when not mandatory to get it. A gun is not a magic wand. You have to know how to use it safely and proficiently ,understand the legal and moral aspects, know when to shoot and when not to shoot.
 
BLUE..

If you havent done so already go over to packing.org and check out my posts under last thursdays news section. Also check out under the Iowa posts or members sections for my situation in all this.

I have a sheriff who issues permits but does so restrictive that I think it is illegal for him to do so but I cannot find any information on it or anyone to give me an answer? To elaborate, what he does is he issues a permit that says not valid in vehicle and not valid in incoorporated city limits -WTH, last I knew you didn't need a permit to be out plinking or hunting in the woods anyway? I had a deputy try to tell me you need a permit to be at the range with your pistol -BS. Also his excuse for not issuing is that he doenst want his deputies pulling over a car with a gun in it. We all know how messed up that thought is. It's the non permits ones you have to worry about as well as in a discretionary state ppl from counties that do issue are allowed to carry anywhere.

I guess I might have to spend a few dollars on a lawyer to look into it for me?
 
How about several firearms with frequency, (1-3 times a week) with papers from your range, gun skul and competition scores? Worked for me and I'm in California.
 
Yep here in Kali, I put down that "I commute between my place of residence and place of business (some 200 miles away) on a weekly basis, often carrying non-negiotable securities worth millions , and hence I need a CCW to protect myself "(which is all true)

Guess the Sheriff was in a charitable mood as he apporoved it.:D
 
Well, that might help. Although, before I could use that, I'd need to HAVE several firearms (only 1 CF pistol right now), go to a "real" range (only 1 close by, $10/hr..i usually shoot outdoor), I don't compete (yet?), and haven't taken any gun classes. Although, all those might help! :) I figured I'd get CCW before my collection got too big, and I was frustrated at not being able to carry any of them.
 
they indicated that for Joe Q Public, the only reason Sherrif Zeller will approve a permit is if you state that you carry large sums of cash, and specify on the application, $500 (or greater). Then, in order to be valid, whenever you carry, you must have $500 dollars on you.
Click to expand...

I don't get this one at all ....

How many threads do we have going right now discussing that fact that it is almost never acceptable to use a firearm to protect property, only life and/or serious injury ????

One of the threads has a DA's announcement to that very effect.

So here the sheriff is saying that you can carry a gun to protect $500 or more, but not to protect your life.

We have a major contradiction here!

Edit: here is the link...

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34126

and the quote...

"It is never legal to use deadly force solely to protect or recover property, Gibbons notes. Taking a human life cannot be justified on those grounds."


:cuss:
 
We have a major contradiction here!
Click to expand...

We do, indeed, have a major contradition between issuing C.C.W. permits to protect property, but they can be used only to protect life; the essential contradiction, however, is between Iowa law and the United States Constitution.
 
I don't compete (yet?), and haven't taken any gun classes. Although, all those might help!
Click to expand...

Take classes. There should be an instructor who can get you in a class that qualifies for a CCW permit. Then take a few more. Present that to him, and maybe you have more of an argument. I got denied under "may issue" in Minnesota because I didn't take any classes. When I told the sheriff if I take the class will you approve me, he went "well....you know...ummmm...you see..." So the answer was going to be no. I took the class anyway figuring it's at least good training, then we got shall issue passed, so I beat the rush that's happening now.

If you are in a real rural area and your sheriff is elected, you have a better chance. City chief of police that only answers to the mayor - forget it.

As far as the 25 yard target goes, I think that's a bunch of crap. Most shootings happen within 21 feet. I'd tell him if you shot someone that far our they really weren't a threat and you'd be in way more trouble. Also, ask the sheriff to shoot 80% that far with his service gun.

Bottom line is get the training.
 
REMBER your right to VOTE and to be VOCAL- VOTE the bastards out of office. Small men trying to be God and exercise what power they might have. Hope their families need help beyond or fater that the local sheriff or pd can get there- it might change theri attidude.
 
I also live in Linn Co and am well aware of how hard it is to get a permit. The "$500 rule" is the standard that has been in place sine before Zeller took office. That is considered the minimun ammount of money that you need to carry on a regular basis to be "in fear" of being robbed. I see no chance of that changing anytime before the next election.

There is a group at work in Iowa trying to get the law changed. Check out CCW4Iowa.com.

On another note I assume that you are referring to Sports outfitters for hte range. There are several other places to go shoot. Look into the Issac Walton League. They have a nice facility as well as some training classes if I am not mistaken. Also there is a public range about 20 minutes from Cedar Rapids that is also a good place to go. Feel free to PM me and I can give you directions.
 
The test for the permit is very easy. I had a security job for a whgile and had to take the test. It is not very difficult at all if you are familiar with firearms. They let you practice and give you tips on shooting during the class. If memory serves me right it is a two day class. The first is a night of classroom. The next is range time and then the qualification. I had not done much shooting prior to taking the class and passed it the first time.
 
It's not so much that he made restrictions, moreso that it's "may issue", he can say "nope.", and he does. The only reason he (seems) to feel that you're justified, is if you make yourself more of a target, by carrying large sums of cash. Then, people will be more likely to confront you with deadly force, which THEN justifies you using deadly force to protect your life. Rather fscked up logic to me.

Standing Wolf: Technically, it seems to be what he considers justifiable reason to carry, not Iowa law.

dandean316: That's what I was thinking....I'm guessing they un-signed me from the class, but I'll go anyway. Say "oh?? i haven't picked up my mail in a couple weeks. :D" Whether or not I was going to get the permit, I wanted to go through the whole process....it's good experience, and education. Yes, 25 yards is BS. As you said, if they're that far away, they're not a threat. And if I'm shooting at someone at that distance, I probably won't hit them (which...actually...might be why they want you to be that accurate at that distance. Right...BS.) :scrutiny:

Skunkabilly?? (always read it Skunkability!) CF=center fire. Bersa Thunder .380 ACP. Not sure about CA...

I'll vote against him, next election.

Apparently. Kinda makes you wonder why life insurance policies aren't just for $500.
 
Iowa

In Iowa, the sheriff in each of Iowa's 99 counties has SOLE discrection as to the issue of permits to carry concealed weapons.

This may not sit well, but it's the law- right or wrong.

I would like to see Iowa as a shall issue state, but don't see that law being enacted anytime soon.

As far as going to the range and having a permit, i don't think that is the case. As long as you transport the weapon in a legal manner you are within the bounds of the law in this state.

12-34hom.
 
Around here ( a certain may issue state south of Tennessee) the only 'right' answer is "self defence". It also helps to write in "W" when you fill in the 'race' question.

:confused:
 
different strokes for different folks...being a geek, when i see CF i think compact flash. :)

sorry to get yer hopes up, then dash them down like that! :neener:
 
again..

Blue or anyone in this area or Iowa..

I am a certified NRA instructor, I would be happy to give you the basic pistol class for the teaching experience. If nothing else I can probably atleast teach you how to shoot decently or better without the pressure or spending a dime except to get down here and ammo. I also have a few different gun to try to see what you like or if you do better with one or other? Just -email or contact me anytime

Their CCW class probably encompases the personal protection too, but again due to Iowa law there is no standard and it could be there own made up class and course? The one I took for mine was classromm only and less than a boyscout saftey class. It touched on nomenclature and basic basic saftey and that was it!!

I have heard Linn County doesn't issue at all? You could always go pay a small fee and get the list of CCW holders from them - it is public info. See who is on the list, if they ring a bell politically etc and maybe see if any would speak to you about it.

The only way we will end this crap is to get shall issue passed. My state reps were receptive to the idea, but 1st we need to get rid of Villsack-O-???? and then fight groups like Iowans for the prevention of gun violence!

later
 
years ago, my friends grandpa applied for a CCW in MI. the sheriff told him something about haveing to have over $100 on him at all times, or he wouldn't issue the permit. so, the guy took a $100 bill, made a mold off one of the grip panels on his 1911, and casted a clear resin grip panel, with the bill inside! so as long as he's carrying, he's got $100 on him.



the sheriff was impressed/humoured enough that he granted the permit.
 
Luckily for me, im in PA. I brought down my $19 and licence, and recieved it in about 20 minutes. The hardest part about the "test" was double negative questions.

"If granted this permit, would you not act in a manner that is not socially appropriate?

Its not the exact wording, but i remember it being similar. The "test" covered 1) Are you an addict. 2) Are you of sound mind.
Hard to get it wrong unless you just aren't paying attention.
 
It would be interesting to see if you could get the $500 limit in writing. You can be denied self defense by the Sheriff because you were too POOR?
What kind of elitist is he? It may not get you your CCW but it would make for good campaign fodder.
 
I don't think there is a contradiction re: defending life vs property. The point is that if you have valuables on you, that makes you a target which in turn puts your life in danger. If someone is stealing money or thousands of dollars in video/audio/computer equipment from your car, you can't shoot them for it. However, if you catch them in the act and they come after you and your life is in imminent danger, that's when you are defending yourself.

Not saying turning you down was justified, just wanted to clarify why it might be a bit easier to obtain permit if you have valuables on you. Get a C&R license for $30.00, and then you are hauling around "collectable firearms" which makes you a target which could justify the permit easily, IMHO.

Sheslinger
 
in oklahoma it is shall issue, so if your not a felon or mental patient. you take the course fire 50 rounds(3,5 and7yards. no score) pay your money and its yours.saddlebum
 
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