22/22mag
Member
Has anyone put a 7,62x39mm upper on a AR 15 Bushmaster ? Would this be better accuracy then an AK 47 and is there any real gain in performance ease of use ?
AR 15 7,62x39mm upper
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Commissar Gribb
Member
I would say the 7.62 x 39 round is going to perform poorly at long range reguardless of what action it's being fired out of.
rbernie
Contributing Member
And, with all due respect, depending on the definition of 'long range' you might just be wrong.
Yes, there are bunches of us folk that shoot M43 out of an AR platform. My 20" ER Shaw barrelled DPMS upper gives me solid MOA performance; not half inch groups, but it will reliably put five rounds into an inch at 100 yards all day long. With a 200 yard zero, I'm less than +3" within a from the muzzle to past 200 yards. With a more, ah, battlefield-oriented zero, I can hold COM and get solid hits from the muzzle to past 300 yards with no holdover or windage adjustments needed.
That works for me.
Reed1911
Member
The 7.62x39 cartridge is capable of very fine accuracy. All the B.S. about the cartridge being inaccurate is just that; complete B.S. The only reason it ever really got a bad rep. is due to the firearms chambered for it. I have a 15" T/C barrel that will clover 5 rounds all day.
MuzzleBlast
Member
How is reliability? I have read before that reliablitity was a problem with the 7.62x39/AR15 combination.
LC '92
Member
I had a DPMS upper for a while in 7.62X39 and here are my comments.
The best magazine was the horrible looking affair that USA Magazines sells. It is an AR-15 magazine shell with an AK-47 magazine attached to the bottom. It looks s-o-o cheesy but works so well! The DPMS factory mag worked OK but was palstic and the walls tended to swell out when fully loaded and dragged going in the magazine well.
Mine would not dependably fire the cheapy Wolf and Golden Bear ammo. Cheap ammo was one of the reasons I bought this upper and it was a disappointment that it wouldn't light the hard primers of the cheap stuff.
It preformed perfectly with my brass cased handloads and a little 123 grian V-Max that I bought from Midway. My groups with a 2.5X Colt AR-15 scope and AA-2200 and the above V-Max averaged just a hair ove 1 MOA.
The best magazine was the horrible looking affair that USA Magazines sells. It is an AR-15 magazine shell with an AK-47 magazine attached to the bottom. It looks s-o-o cheesy but works so well! The DPMS factory mag worked OK but was palstic and the walls tended to swell out when fully loaded and dragged going in the magazine well.
Mine would not dependably fire the cheapy Wolf and Golden Bear ammo. Cheap ammo was one of the reasons I bought this upper and it was a disappointment that it wouldn't light the hard primers of the cheap stuff.
It preformed perfectly with my brass cased handloads and a little 123 grian V-Max that I bought from Midway. My groups with a 2.5X Colt AR-15 scope and AA-2200 and the above V-Max averaged just a hair ove 1 MOA.
rbernie
Contributing Member
Depends on what you shoot. My Shaw barrel will NOT digest steel-cased ammo; I can only presume that the chamber is on the tight side of spec.
The biggest issue that I've had (other than hi-cap magazine availability) is short-stroking due to the gas system/pressure curves not quite being matched up. I can tune around this with different loads, but the long term solution is an adjustable gas block/gas tube.
DMK
Member
I built my own 7.62x39 AR. The upper has a free floated Colt 1/10 twist barrel and bolt with the other parts from various manufacturers. The lower is a DPMS with an RRA match trigger and 9mm buffer(it's heavier than a .223 carbine buffer). The mags are 20 round USA Franken mags.
It has run perfectly with steel cased S&B, Barnual and zinc cased Silver Bear. In fact it hasn't jammed or misfired once on me. Best accuracy so far was a repeatable 2" @ 100 yards with the Barnual HP, on a bench and scoped. That BTW, is much better that the same ammo brands in my SAR1 or any of my dozen or so SKS. I believe 7.62x39 can do better, but not with the Russian equivalent of Winchester Bargain Bulk Pack.
It has run perfectly with steel cased S&B, Barnual and zinc cased Silver Bear. In fact it hasn't jammed or misfired once on me. Best accuracy so far was a repeatable 2" @ 100 yards with the Barnual HP, on a bench and scoped. That BTW, is much better that the same ammo brands in my SAR1 or any of my dozen or so SKS. I believe 7.62x39 can do better, but not with the Russian equivalent of Winchester Bargain Bulk Pack.
MuzzleBlast said:
I think that the real problem comes down to available magazines. Original AK magazines wont fit into the magazine well of an AR15 lower, so one was left with some pretty poorly made choices during the magazine ban. I would hope that this has changed since the sunset.
Preacherman
Member
I have one of these magazines, that I was given some years ago, but I've never had an AR-15 chambered in this caliber, so I've never used it. If anyone needs it, please PM me, and if you'll pay for the shipping, I'll send it to you. Shouldn't be more than $5 to $10 via USPO.
EDITED TO ADD: The magazine is spoken for.
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The functional "problems" of the 7.62x39 in an AR can be attributed to several unrelated issues, and occasionally come together to really foul things up.
1) 7.62x39 AR mags: Aftermarket mags have shown to be highly unreliable. USGI 5.56 mags can only reliably hold 10-12 rounds of the 7.62 without feeding issues.
2) Ammo issues: Wolf ammo is widely available in this caliber and the coating used had a bad habit of jamming up the action and gas system in an AR.
3) Primer issues: The russian ammo found at attactive prices have very hard primers, unlike US ammo. The strikes from an AR are often not hard enough to light them off.
There are bound to be examples of 7.62x39 ARs that defy these normalities and run fine. These are exceptions.
1) 7.62x39 AR mags: Aftermarket mags have shown to be highly unreliable. USGI 5.56 mags can only reliably hold 10-12 rounds of the 7.62 without feeding issues.
2) Ammo issues: Wolf ammo is widely available in this caliber and the coating used had a bad habit of jamming up the action and gas system in an AR.
3) Primer issues: The russian ammo found at attactive prices have very hard primers, unlike US ammo. The strikes from an AR are often not hard enough to light them off.
There are bound to be examples of 7.62x39 ARs that defy these normalities and run fine. These are exceptions.
IIRC the 20rnd. Colt magazines for 7.62x39 were 5.56 20 rnd. mags with a different follower. It was several years ago that I experimented with a few mags laying around, but I recall this working.
I have been told that the AR in 7.62x39 tends to break bolts, but I have no personal experience other than putting a few rounds through an other person's rifle.
I have been told that the AR in 7.62x39 tends to break bolts, but I have no personal experience other than putting a few rounds through an other person's rifle.
rbernie
Contributing Member
If the follower is different, it's different underneath - they are identical from the top.
Commissar Gribb
Member
oh! and I dont doubt that!
My egyptian AK is quite accurate within the flat part of the x39's trajectory.
Colt is not currently making rifles in this caliber that I am aware of. However, there are plenty of sub-standard parts available.
For Example
For Example
rbernie
Contributing Member
Wow - that's a pretty strong statement. For example, I don't know that I'd call DPMS's offerings sub-standard....
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