Are 1911s more finiky than regular semis

[wbwanzer]

I keep going back and forth between getting an inexpensive (read, less than $950) 1911 in 9mm, or getting an XDm in 9mm. It will not be used for self defense or carrying. It will be used for target shooting. I'm also just getting into Steel Challenges. Now if I enjoy doing the steel challenges, it is possible that I may get into IDPA or one of the other organizations that are competitive shooting. So with that in mind, are 1911s more finiky to deal with (ammo sensitive, more prone to jams, harder to clean) or are they no different than any other semi-auto?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[CWL]

No. Contrary to what some claim, M1911 pistols are rugged and accurate pistols.
They've been used in wars for longer than any other semi-auto pistol. That should tell you something about the design and cartridge.

The real problem is that there are so many different manufacturers with different levels of quality, AND people like to modify them without fully understanding what they are doing.

If you want to spend ~$900. Then consider a Dan Wesson Pointman 7, or Springfield Loaded. Both have very good reputations and come out-of-box with plenty of quality parts and factory upgrades.

 

[Cougfan2]

+1 on the DW. Springers are also good.

1911's got a reputation for being finicky primarily from some of the old military guns that weren't maintained very well and from the days before ramped barrels that sometimes wouldn't reliably feed ammo other than roundnose hardball. Any of the current day better quality 1911's today should give you no problems and there are a bunch to choose from in the $900 range.

 

[Jim Watson]

A 1911 IS a "regular semi", it's all the others that are latecomer gimmicks.

Yes, the 1911 as currently manufactured by a large number of copiers and fakers can be a little finicky. There are just too many different outfits who think they know better than John Browning or can make them cheaper; and are burdened with funky ammunition. But if you get a good one, you will be rewarded by the easiest centerfire pistol to get hits with.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

The real problem is that there are so many different manufacturers with different levels of quality, AND people like to modify them without fully understanding what they are doing.

Right on!!

The M1911 was designed for ball cartridges, only -- there were no soft point or hollow point pistol bullets in those days. However, the design is so good that anything that approximates the outline of a ball cartridge -- that is, the bullet is full diameter at the same point the ogive begins on a ball cartridge -- will feed beautifully.

In fact, before ammo makers understood how to make reliable bullet styles, the various 9mm autos were far less reliable than the M1911. But everyone wants to forget that.

 

[ROBBY.1911]

taurus just introduced their 1911 in 9 mm. for $600 your search is over. it comes with all the bells and whistles, too. no need to thank me.

 

[Eric F]

If you want to spend ~$900. Then consider a Dan Wesson Pointman 7, or Springfield Loaded. Both have very good reputations and come out-of-box with plenty of quality parts and factory upgrades

oh gee whiz folks an STI spartan is every bit as good for almost half the price.........give them a chance.

 

[KegCommando]

I don't have any first hand knowledge, but based on posts here, why is it then that so many mfg's say that won't even talk to you about issues with your pistol until you have fired 500-1000 rounds thru it?

I find it disturbing whenever I see someone's post with an issue with a new pistol, and CS tells them they have to spend hundreds of bucks more before the person can send it in.

 

[wbwanzer]

I'll say 'Thank you' Robbie.1911 anyway. But I was already on to the PT1911 in 9mm. Problem is, nobody really knows if it's out yet. I've been told on various forums that it is. On the other hand, when I called Taurus a few weeks ago about the 9mm release, I was told 'around the end of the year'. So who know.
Then on top of that, I live in the People's Republic of Maryland. So even when the PT1911 in 9 does hit the streets, I have to wait for the Maryland State Police to update their Roster of approved handguns to include it before I can purchase one. I heard that they update every six months.

So the PT1911 is on my radar but it could be a long wait if I decide to go that way.

 

[wbwanzer]

EricF - I've seen the Spartan but I believe it's in .45 only, if I remember correctly. I'm looking for a 9.

 

[wbwanzer]

So far it looks like you all are heavily favoring the 1911 platform.

 

[Mags]

Get a Kimber

 

[Hanafuda]

If it's for centerfire target shooting "on a budget", your 9mm alternative to a 1911 (and the 1911 would be great) should probably be a CZ75b. The internal slide rails on the CZ makes for greater inherent accuracy, it's an all-steel gun so it has heft and stability, and you get a single action trigger. And the price is nice.

I wouldn't consider the XDm the best choice as a target gun, though it's a great pistol for practical purposes.

 

[sohcgt2]

As with all machines, the closer the tolerances used in manufacture the less tolerant the machine becomes of environmental debris. This is why many service pistols are so very reliable and why competition only firearms have a reputation for being finiky. As a rule all commercially available non-custom firearms will function reliably for your described use.

 

[CWL]

I don't have any first hand knowledge, but based on posts here, why is it then that so many mfg's say that won't even talk to you about issues with your pistol until you have fired 500-1000 rounds thru it?

I find it disturbing whenever I see someone's post with an issue with a new pistol, and CS tells them they have to spend hundreds of bucks more before the person can send it in.

Have you ever purchased a new car? Does it have a break-in period? Do you complain about the gas you have to spend?

Mechanical devices need to be 'broken in' so that all the nuances of each individual part learns to work together. This involves micro abrasion of moving parts and contact points.

Most things work when new, but if you are planning to use a firearm for self defense, wouldn't you like to make sure that it will work every time you need to press the trigger? This involves test firings of many bullets -and only you can set the price your life is worth.

 

[stonyman65]

1911s in general, are not finicky with ammo. The so called "problem" with 1911s are mostly magazine related. As long as the gun is properly fit, and you are using good magazines and ammo (not "guns how specials") you are fine.

That being said, smaller (officer model and compact/sub compact) and alternate caliber 1911s could be kind of finicky because that was not how the 1911 was designed, and many of the magazines and parts are proprietary designs - the 9mm models in particular.

For me, as a general rule, if you are using 1911s, use them in .45 and do not use one smaller than a commander model or commander with an officer size frame.

but thats just me.

 

[KegCommando]

Have you ever purchased a new car? Does it have a break-in period? Do you complain about the gas you have to spend?

Not the same thing.

I've never heard of someone buying a new car, later when something doesn't function that the owner knows is not normal, take it the dealer, and the dealer tells them he won't look at it until he drives 3000 more miles.

 

[JCisHe]

I recently purchased a quality 1911 and I absolutely love it. Not any different than any other weapon I have shot except its more comfortable, has a better trigger, great safety features, fits in my hand perfectly, time tested, and I shot well with it the very first shot. Other than that, it's as good as any other weapon I have haha.

 

[Rinspeed]

For just a little more than $950 take a look at the STI Trojan.

 

[Walkalong]

Mine are not finicky at all. Some are though. Every Tom Dick and Harry company is making them, and some of them not very well.

 

[PO2Hammer]

Are 1911s more finiky than regular semis

In my experience, yes, especially in 9mm. OTOH, it's easy to fix and it's the most studied pistol ever, so there are plenty of people to help you.

There is no better gun for target shooting or competition. I've had a 9mm and two .38 Supers. The 9mm was incredibly accurate, but so frustratingly unreliable, I had to return it.

A Colt .38 Super was very reliable, but not too good in the accuracy department.

My Les Baer .38 is 'just right'. Reliable (after a break in period) and super accurate.

My Glock 17L has seen more rounds than all of them combined, and has never skipped a beat. It's just not quite up to the 50 yard accuracy level as the Baer .38.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

As with all machines, the closer the tolerances used in manufacture the less tolerant the machine becomes of environmental debris.

Just a nitpick here. You mean "clearances," not "tolerances." Loose "clearances" means there's plenty of room between part A and part B. Loose "tolerances" means you can wind up with two large parts, or two small parts, and the gun won't work.

 

[rbernie]

I've never heard of someone buying a new car, later when something doesn't function that the owner knows is not normal, take it the dealer, and the dealer tells them he won't look at it until he drives 3000 more miles.

I've heard that line from my car dealer over several automatic transmission issues.

Having said that, many pistols are being shipped without the benefit of the hand fitting and small parts polishing that used to be the norm a half century ago. Some designs are simply more tolerant of that sort of, um, manufacturing steamlining than others - the 1911 is not, in several specific areas.

Also - many factors have changed the economics of things such that it's cheaper to cut out a few QA/QA steps and accept the minor increase in customer returned goods (CRG). Sig, for example, seems to have done the math very critically and determined that a specific amount of CRG is quite OK, given the cost savings they must have enjoyed from cutting out QA/QC steps during manufacture of my last couple of P226s....

A 1911 costs more to make properly than many other more modern designs. In return, the 1911 provides benefits that some find appealing. But trying to make a 1911 that is cost competitive with a modern stamped-steel-and-polymer design will almost always result in a 1911 that, across it's manufacturing run, will suffer from an increased incidence of failure.

Does that mean that the 1911 is bad? No. It simply means that folk need to understand the economics of them, and either pay more money to get a reasonable example or pay less money and be willing to roll the dice that the specific example that they bought may have issues.

Lastly, it should be reemphasized (as has been pointed out above) that many 1911 reliability issues are caused by tinkerin' or using out-of-spec magazines. For some reason, folk seem to accept a $30 Sig/HK magazine as reasonable, but then have an expectation that a $12 1911 magazine from some unknown manufacturer should work equally as flawlessly. Sadly, when the $12 1911 magazine introduces reliability issues, the tendency is to blame the gun as a whole.

 

[420Stainless]

I've always heard they are, but have never personally experienced it. Over the years I've owned 4 and never had a problem with any of them. No feeding problems with hollowpoint, truncated, or lightweight bullets with any of them.

Edited to add: After posting I realized that I did have a dual feeding problem one time back in the 80's that was directly related to a $5 gunshow magazine which I tossed into the trash can at the range. Cheap lesson learned.

 

[Guillermo]

In my experience almost all problems are magazine related. There are millions of garbage mags built for the 1911 out there.

Dan Wesson makes a great gun. Use good mags and you should have no problems