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Argument with victim's Brother

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Yo Mama, Jul 28, 2011.

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  1. Yo Mama

    Yo Mama Member

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    I was speaking with someone whose Brother was shot by a citizen being mugged. The citizen tried to shoot the mugger, and missed hitting his Brother's arm making him paralyzed.

    I tried to forward my belief that this citizen as horrible as it is should be blamed and not the gun. He replied that he blamed lax gun laws. It was like hitting my head on the wall to explain that plenty of laws exist to make what happened an offense punishable by law. His response was that this would not give his Brother his arm back.
     
  2. chhodge69

    chhodge69 Member

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    please forgive me but in this case Gun Control could have helped.

    He wouldn't have missed.
     
  3. CAR-AR

    CAR-AR Member

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    I'm sure a lawsuit won't get the brother's arm back.
     
  4. Mike1234567

    Mike1234567 member

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    It's a far too emotional issue for that individual for anyone to try and force him to see logically. Don't even try.
     
  5. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    It was the mugger who paralyzed the brother's arm, plain and simple. America has totally abandoned the idea of blaming criminals for anything.
     
  6. DoubleTapDrew

    DoubleTapDrew Member

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    That's a rare occurance and there is probably nothing you can do to change that person's mind. It's unfortunate and thankfully rare. You are probably more likely to be shot/paralyzed/killed by police involved in a shootout. Should they be disarmed?
     
  7. USAF_Vet

    USAF_Vet Member

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    this is a case of a certified self defense shooting gone awry. Rule #4 was violated, know what is behind your intended target.

    Although, I can only blame the shooter/ mugging victim if and only if lethal force was not required. Innocent bystanders get shot, and that sucks. But I guess the brother would have rather seen a complete stranger get killed than see his brother injured. No sarcasm there, because if it were me, I'd rather someone I didn't know get mugged and possibly killed than see my brother injured.

    Ultimaetly though, the blame does lie with the criminla who instigated the entire situation.
     
  8. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    Police should only be disarmed in states where the citizens are required to be disarmed. But that's probably off topic.
     
  9. Ala Dan

    Ala Dan Member in memoriam

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    Accidents do happen, all of the time~! So sorry this guy suffered from an ill
    aimed shot; but that can be the nature of self defense business~! :( ;)
     
  10. USAF_Vet

    USAF_Vet Member

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    Kinda makes me wonder more about the situation. Was lethal force neccessary? How much training did the mugging victim have? What state did this occur, and what CCW requirements do they have?

    As much as it is the muggers fault, a lot of people will ask what could have been done to prevent this.
     
  11. Justin

    Justin Moderator Staff Member

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    You're highly unlikely to win this person as a convert. Better to focus on forms of activism that are more likely to get results.
     
  12. Deltaboy

    Deltaboy Member

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    Just walk away Yo and pray for all of them. IMO it is the muggers fault. But in this personal case you will not win and just lose a friend.
     
  13. JustinJ

    JustinJ Member

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    There are costs to liberty. We are free to own cars but thousands upon thousands are killed and maimed by them each year. If this person's brother lost his arm in a car accident would they advocate outlawing cars?

    It's highly unlikely you will convert this person but this is exactly why laws shouldn't be made based upon emotional responses. Every time i hear about some parent lobbying with some opportunistic politician to get a law passed because of something bad that happend to their child i cringe. A "conservative" congressman from my area is currently trying to get a law passed to create a federal data base of undiagnosed childrens' diseases bc some parent came to him for help all while he calls for lower taxes.
     
  14. george29

    george29 Member

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    Most people don't believe how hard a hit is to achieve in real circumstances.
     
  15. Mike1234567

    Mike1234567 member

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    Ooh... then we'd be just like merry old England.
     
  16. MachIVshooter

    MachIVshooter Member

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    This. People get maimed and killed everywhere in the world, every single day. Doesn't really matter if it was a stray bullet, a car accident or the gratuitous piano falling from a hoist 10 stories up. #!@* happens, nothin' you can do about it. There is no way to guarantee you won't get injured, not even by staying in your fortified home 24/7. Lightning, earthquakes floods. It is an extremely lucky person who makes it through their entire life without ever being in a gravely dangerous situation. A greater percentage manage to get through those perilous events unscathed or with only minor injuries, but so many are less fortunate and wind up with chronic pain for life, debilitating handicaps, etc.

    In this case, there just happens to be human behavior/error to blame.

    Any of our lives can be changed in an instant by a stupid decision (our own or someone elses), or just by chance. If you ask me, though, we as a species wouldn't appreciate life if those dangers didn't exist

    That said, even drawing these parallels or using similar philosophies, you'll never change this guy's mind. Don't waste your breath.
     
  17. scaatylobo

    scaatylobo Member

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    Putting myself in that mans shoes,I see that if I were not already very 2 nd amendment educated than I could go to the dark side and blame the gun.

    Standard in our society is to blame an object for the actions of the shooter,and in this case it was the ACTIONS of the prep that are to blame.

    But he will not see the forest for the trees,so dont bother.
     
  18. DAP90

    DAP90 Member

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    It’s all well and good to sit in front of your computer and say oh well, people get injured every day. While that may be true it makes it no less painful for those involved.

    I don’t blame lax gun laws. I do think the mugger is responsible for creating the situation and I really hope he’s in jail, but it is not ok for us to miss and hit innocent people.

    If it were my family member that got hit I would want to know that the shooter had no other choice but to fire. He had better have been seconds from death. If this was just because he didn’t want to give up the $50 in his wallet then I would be… angry.

    Would any of you trade your arm so somebody else didn’t have to get mugged?
     
  19. DoubleTapDrew

    DoubleTapDrew Member

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    We don't have enough details of the incident to answer that.
    It could be anything from "I lost my arm because he didn't want to give up the $20 bill he had in his wallet"
    to
    "I watched some poor guy get killed today by a mugger for the $20 he had in his wallet...and the victim was armed but didn't do anything"
     
  20. Yo Mama

    Yo Mama Member

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    So I'm realizing this now.
     
  21. jonmerritt

    jonmerritt Member.

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    Na, the victim should have let himself be mugged, robbed, stabbed, raped or what ever else the criminal wanted to do. Remember, we gota protect those criminals.
    Even if the criminal decided not to mug the guy, putting the victim in a situation to defend himself, it would still be someone elses fault, not the criminals. May be ho should have been somewhere else so he didn't get shot in the arm.
    This sounds like a lot of BS!
     
  22. Japman

    Japman Member

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    Why even bring the subject up, and why even push the issue.

    People like give us a bad name--you're no better than the "anti" that constantly pushes the issue.
     
  23. Yo Mama

    Yo Mama Member

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    It just gets hard when you believe to your core in the 2nd and what it means to freedom.
     
  24. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    It's better than becoming a nation full of victims because only criminals can fire guns.
     
  25. DAP90

    DAP90 Member

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    What I am mainly objecting to here is the “oh well” attitude. This guy lost the use of his arm. His life is irrevocably changed.

    If it were my family, that is not worth the contents of a wallet or the idea that you don’t want to be a victim.

    Congrats on the promotion by the way.
     
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