ATF Agents shot
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Lupinus
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my mommy told me if I couldnt say anything nice not to say anything at all so I wont
But what firearms related charge one has to wonder
But what firearms related charge one has to wonder
JohnBT
Member
Man's got a right to protect his drugs, right? 
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www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/dekalb/stories/2006/12/15/1215metatf.html
ajc.com > Metro > DeKalb/Rockdale
Two ATF agents released from hospital
By MAE GENTRY, MIKE MORRIS
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 12/15/06
Two agents with the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms were shot early Friday while serving a warrant at a DeKalb County apartment complex, police said.
One agent was struck in the knee and the other in the lower abdomen. Both men were treated at a local hospital and released.
The shooting occurred before dawn at an apartment complex near Panola Road in Lithonia, DeKalb police dispatchers said. ATF spokesman Marc Jackson said the agents, whose names have not been released, were serving a federal search warrant for “firearms-related offenses.â€
“They knocked and announced their presence,†Jackson said. After they entered the apartment, he said, “they were met with gunfire from within the residence.â€
Jackson could not say whether agents returned fire. After the shooting, other agents talked the suspects out of the apartment.
Jeffrey Pearce, ATF assistant special agent in charge, said two men and a woman were taken to the DeKalb County Jail on state charges and that federal charges were pending. The suspects were not wounded, he said.
Monte Edward, 22, who came to the apartment complex after the shooting, said his cousin lived in the unit raided by authorities and that he had once lived there.
Edward said he received a phone call from a neighbor saying, “Someone’s kicking in your door.†He said the neighbor screamed and told him, “Somebody’s shooting.â€
Edward said his cousin, 23-year-old Chardriguez Durden, was in the apartment with a woman and another man.
Durden, of Stone Mountain, has been charged with six counts of aggravated assault on a police officer and violation of the Georgia Controlled Substances Act, according to a news release from DeKalb police. Paul Thompson Jr., 19, of Covington, has been charged with violation of the Georgia Controlled Substances Act, the release said.
Durden’s father, Charles Durden, 47, of Snellville, came to the scene as federal agents were removing bags from the apartment. It was unclear what was in the bags.
“I just don’t get it,†the father said. “You come, kick in somebody’s door at 4 o’clock in the morning and what do you expect? This area has had a lo of burglaries and home invasions.â€
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www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/dekalb/stories/2006/12/15/1215metatf.html
ajc.com > Metro > DeKalb/Rockdale
Two ATF agents released from hospital
By MAE GENTRY, MIKE MORRIS
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 12/15/06
Two agents with the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms were shot early Friday while serving a warrant at a DeKalb County apartment complex, police said.
One agent was struck in the knee and the other in the lower abdomen. Both men were treated at a local hospital and released.
The shooting occurred before dawn at an apartment complex near Panola Road in Lithonia, DeKalb police dispatchers said. ATF spokesman Marc Jackson said the agents, whose names have not been released, were serving a federal search warrant for “firearms-related offenses.â€
“They knocked and announced their presence,†Jackson said. After they entered the apartment, he said, “they were met with gunfire from within the residence.â€
Jackson could not say whether agents returned fire. After the shooting, other agents talked the suspects out of the apartment.
Jeffrey Pearce, ATF assistant special agent in charge, said two men and a woman were taken to the DeKalb County Jail on state charges and that federal charges were pending. The suspects were not wounded, he said.
Monte Edward, 22, who came to the apartment complex after the shooting, said his cousin lived in the unit raided by authorities and that he had once lived there.
Edward said he received a phone call from a neighbor saying, “Someone’s kicking in your door.†He said the neighbor screamed and told him, “Somebody’s shooting.â€
Edward said his cousin, 23-year-old Chardriguez Durden, was in the apartment with a woman and another man.
Durden, of Stone Mountain, has been charged with six counts of aggravated assault on a police officer and violation of the Georgia Controlled Substances Act, according to a news release from DeKalb police. Paul Thompson Jr., 19, of Covington, has been charged with violation of the Georgia Controlled Substances Act, the release said.
Durden’s father, Charles Durden, 47, of Snellville, came to the scene as federal agents were removing bags from the apartment. It was unclear what was in the bags.
“I just don’t get it,†the father said. “You come, kick in somebody’s door at 4 o’clock in the morning and what do you expect? This area has had a lo of burglaries and home invasions.â€
Brad Johnson
Member
Then it should have been the DEA do the raid. Controlled substances are outside the jurisdicion of the BATFE.
Brad
MICHAEL T
Member
One agent was struck in the knee and the other in the lower abdomen. Both men were treated at a local hospital and released.
What were they shot with a BB gun Seems like very minor wounds.
What were they shot with a BB gun Seems like very minor wounds.
Glockfan.45
member
+1
Bergerboy
Member
THey had prior drug charges, but this was not one of them.
They claim they knocked and then "entered" at 4 in the morning.....to me, that infers a quick "knock knock" and down the door goes.
I'd like to see the charges on the warrant, but at this point I can't say I blame the guys for shooting.
They claim they knocked and then "entered" at 4 in the morning.....to me, that infers a quick "knock knock" and down the door goes.
I'd like to see the charges on the warrant, but at this point I can't say I blame the guys for shooting.
JohnBT
Member
Man's got a right to protect his drugs, right? - me, with the Roll Eyes smiley
Then it should have been the DEA do the raid. Controlled substances are outside the jurisdicion of the BATFE. - you
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Huh? The warrant was for guns. They had guns. Guns and drugs as it turned out. So, what are you talking about? You defending these guys? Maybe you know them?
Let's bash the cops, let's bash the government, let's bash, bash, bash. :banghead:
The three clowns in the apartment are lucky they didn't end up dead.
John
Then it should have been the DEA do the raid. Controlled substances are outside the jurisdicion of the BATFE. - you
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Huh? The warrant was for guns. They had guns. Guns and drugs as it turned out. So, what are you talking about? You defending these guys? Maybe you know them?
Let's bash the cops, let's bash the government, let's bash, bash, bash. :banghead:
The three clowns in the apartment are lucky they didn't end up dead.
John
RevolvingCylinder
Member
- Joined
- Nov 6, 2006
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- 782
I really don't think they got the attention they received by simply having a shotgun cut a bit too short under a bed. Sounds like they were protecting a cache of drugs. I'm curious as to what substances were involved and the specific arms offenses.
wacki
Member
sheesh. Am I missing something? I'm mostly a libertarian which means I'm against the war on drugs and most forms of liberty restrictions. But whats up with the animosity?
pcosmar
member
Though there is little information available, ie. the reason for the warrant,what was or was not found, etc.
The interesting thing to me is, the ATF agents Knocked and walked, and got shot. Then other Officers talked to the subjects and they surrendered, and were arrested.
Maybe they should have tried talking first.
The interesting thing to me is, the ATF agents Knocked and walked, and got shot. Then other Officers talked to the subjects and they surrendered, and were arrested.
Maybe they should have tried talking first.
yhtomit
Member
No animosity here ...
But I have the same question. Were the wounds just lucky shots (for the targets, that is)? Of the various body parts I'd like to keep wound-free (y'know -- *all* of them), my knees are right up there on the list.
Glad for their sake that the ATF guys weren't badly hurt (at least, no more badly than is implied by the article), but I think that the described wounds and the described treatment / aftermath sure give me the same question as the poster who asked facetiously about BB guns.
Now, as to whether there should be an ATF, and whether the raid described was part of an overarching good, well, that's another question. Perhaps if there was greater liberty, those guys would not have been in the bodily danger they were -- hard to know.
timothy
But I have the same question. Were the wounds just lucky shots (for the targets, that is)? Of the various body parts I'd like to keep wound-free (y'know -- *all* of them), my knees are right up there on the list.
Glad for their sake that the ATF guys weren't badly hurt (at least, no more badly than is implied by the article), but I think that the described wounds and the described treatment / aftermath sure give me the same question as the poster who asked facetiously about BB guns.
Now, as to whether there should be an ATF, and whether the raid described was part of an overarching good, well, that's another question. Perhaps if there was greater liberty, those guys would not have been in the bodily danger they were -- hard to know.
timothy
dojpros1998
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- 32
While reasonable minds may differ on the propriety of the federal govt's regulation of firearms and narcotics, it is an incorrect statement of the present state of the law to say that "controlled substances are outside of the jurisdiction of the BATFE". Perhaps in recognition of the fact that firearms are at present "tool of the trade" in the presentlly illegal importation, manufacture and distribution of controlled substances, BATFE has had the authority to investigate and present Title 21 cases (Title 21 of the United States Code pertains to controllled substances) for some time. Just as DEA has the authoriity to investigate Title 18( the section of the Code dealing with firearms) for some time as well. The FBI being the FBI has had both Title 21 and 18 authority for many, many years.
Prior felony drug charges and weapons on site will certainly attract the attention of BATFE.
If these are small fry drug dealers they won't attract the interest of the mighty DEA.
What is interesting to me is that no mention of local law enforcement involvment is indicated.
If these are small fry drug dealers they won't attract the interest of the mighty DEA.
What is interesting to me is that no mention of local law enforcement involvment is indicated.
The easiest one would be 18USC924(c), discharge of a firearm during a crime of violence, namely attempted murder or attempted murder. Either the GA statute and the federal attempted murder charge (18USC1113) could be used as the underlying crime of violence. 10 years mandatory minimum.
The underlying statute would also be charged, and as I said 18USC1113, attempt to commit murder would be the likely charge. The AUSA could instead choose to charge 18USC111, Assaulting employees of the federal government, which would carry a penalty enhancement for the use of a deadly weapon.
Since he's a fugitive 18USC922(n), reciept of a firearm while under indictment for a felony would be a possible charge. Also, since it was ATF trying to get this fugitive it's a good bet he was a previously convicted felon, which means 18USC922(g)(1), possession of a firearm by a previously convicted felon is a possible charge.
There are more possibilities, but these jump out as some of the most likely charges.
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Guns aren't something that can be flushed down the toity...
A "no-knock" or... I guess we'll just have to coin a new term... How about a "quick-knock"? Regardless... if you're not in it to prevent evidence from being destroyed, you must have another reason, right? In this case, the only reason for taking them down as described would have been to avoid a Miami-style shooting war out in public somewhere. Commendable reason, IMO. Too bad it just didn't work this time. I find it odd, though, that suspects that willing to kill gave up so easily. How much more is there to the story?
thexrayboy
Member
Just another example of the potential for problems with the beloved middle of the night warrant service....it's all too easily confused with the oh so similar middle of the night home invasion burglary. Really, these guys could have served this warrant in the day time with no need for the drama of a kick in the door hurry up before they flush/swallow/destroy the evidence. Firearms are an item that have lots of pluses. One of the minuses, in this situation however is they are extremely durable. Hard to dispose of a gun to prevent it from being found once the police are already at your house. We as citizens need to force our elected officials to visit this problem and look for a solution. We have ceded far far far too much power to law enforcement. That abuse of power is now creating these shooting situations on a weekly, sometimes daily basis.
Manedwolf
member
Unless it's a Lorcin.
redsaber75
Member
In that case it should be flushed
soutex50
Member
Huh? The warrant was for guns. They had guns. Guns and drugs as it turned out. So, what are you talking about? You defending these guys? Maybe you know them?
Let's bash the cops, let's bash the government, let's bash, bash, bash.
The three clowns in the apartment are lucky they didn't end up dead.
John
+ 1
it seems a large portion of members here are ready to criticize or even applaud public servants getting hurt doing their job, and it is truly sad...
here is just a little tidbit of info without all the facts (BTW WRITTEN BY THE MEDIA) and all the armchair commandos are ready to question the actions of the agents and even imply that in some way they (drug dealers) could be justified.
Is it for this that I served in our great Military and continue to defend our Forefathers' ideologies in our government? Pls tell me i'm wrong
Let's bash the cops, let's bash the government, let's bash, bash, bash.
The three clowns in the apartment are lucky they didn't end up dead.
John
+ 1
it seems a large portion of members here are ready to criticize or even applaud public servants getting hurt doing their job, and it is truly sad...
here is just a little tidbit of info without all the facts (BTW WRITTEN BY THE MEDIA) and all the armchair commandos are ready to question the actions of the agents and even imply that in some way they (drug dealers) could be justified.
Is it for this that I served in our great Military and continue to defend our Forefathers' ideologies in our government? Pls tell me i'm wrong
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GTSteve03
Member
The Right to Keep and Bear Arms Shall Not Be Infringed...
unless you're a felon, then owning a gun isn't allowed.
It's OK to strip them of their rights? If they're violent offenders, why aren't they still in prison? Oh right, too much space being taken up by those dangerous drug users...
Hmmm... It's the ATFE, so presumably the whole idea was that they were pretty sure that these people were criminals, and had firearms or explosives in the house. Is there a great reason justifying sending two agents to potentially force entry, at 4am, into a residence containing what ATFE believed to be more than two armed felons? Why would anyone think that this was a good plan?
soutex50
Member
If they had sent four would it have made a difference? Probably four agents shot, three dead dealers and everyone labeling them jack booted thugs.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.......:banghead:
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.......:banghead:
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