AWB II and Va Tech - Get Ready

[David N]

TELL THE TRUTH

I'm convinced the only thing we can do after tragedies like the VA Tech is to keep telling the other side of the gun issue. Please write letters to your local newspaper. Please ask for time on your local stations and cable systems. Please join BOTH the NRA and the GOA.

I still like the following for amazing facts you won't hear from the liberal media:

www.gunowners.org

BTW, Titan6, you really scared me with the title to this thread. VT stands for Vermont, the state with the most constitutional gun laws in the country.

 

[Titan6]

This tragedy has already politicisied in every way possible by both sides. The media has made it a circus. If it comes out different in the wash than it has everywhere else this has happened than I for one will be happily surprised and write on the THR chalk board 500 times that I was wrong.

If you asked me three days ago I would have said the chance of AWBII getting passed was two in five. Today I say three in five.

This is beside the point. My point is what are prudent contingency measures to take today in case things do not go as hoped?

 

[alucard0822]

I have been buisy writing to news agencys, congress critters, and the NRA since I got home after work yesterday. If the situation arises I will not dishonor my family that has fought and died for over 100 years in the military to ensure and protect the rights we have at present, including the bill of rights. I do not want to be put in that situation by my "representatives" that I must choose between being a law abiding disarmed victim, or to make a stand and possibly give my life to defend my rights. I encourage everyone to help me and at this stage to help our cause to legally be able to protect ourselves and our families from harm, and to be able to do it with effective weapons that give us the best hope for a sucessful defense. And to counter those speaking out now to take those rights away. There is not much that we can do to stop tragedies from happening, but there are tools that we can use to stop them from continuing.

I have not used form letters for the most part, but limited them to 1 page for letters or e-mails, cited all sources and incorporate the following:

the VT campus leadership has recently defeated a bill that would have extended proven effective Virginia CC to the college, and was defeated in the interest of "safety"

Therefore the shooter was in violation of a total campus gun ban at the time of the shooting proving its ineffectiveness

As a citizen of Maryland my fundemental right to an effective self defense has been violated

As tragic as the 33 deaths were and as a result would logicly move people to action there are thousands of murders, robberies and attacks on law abiding unarmed citizens that have become so common they are not deemed newsworthy.

Crime by it's very definition is perpetrated by people that are in violation of the law, and show the ineffectiveness of the police and laws to protect people and deter crime.

Gun control in general and denying citizens the means to an effective self defense ensures that large scale attacks and killings will continue, as they have in England, Australia, and Canada. These countries passed strict gun control measures in hopes of deterring crime, law abiding citizens have been almost entirely disarmed, yet criminals continue to use guns in crime.

Many people have concerns of not only the large number of police on scene after the first two shootings but the ineffectiveness to stop the rest. It has been upheld in the supreme court that police have no legal obligation to protect citizens in danger, nut only to uphold the law.

I will support those that seek to uphold my fundemental rights to an effective self defense and restore those rights, and oppose those who seek to endanger myself and my family by infringing on those rights and violating my constitutional rights to not only keep, but also to bear arms.

now back to the letters

 

[TexasP226]

What are the chances (in %) that:

1. No new gun laws will be enacted.

2. A bill similar to HR 1022 will be passed and no more.

3. All semiautomatic and double action handguns and revolvers will be banned along with any semiautomatic rifle, possibly including lever action rifles leaving us with single action revolvers or single shot handguns and black powder and bolt action hunting rifles limited to, say, 5 rounds.

4. A total ban on new and used gun sales.

5. "Mr. and Mrs. America, turn them all in."

 

[Titan6]

That is a well written letter. There are a couple of typos in it but it is otherwise strong.

I think in this particular case we should also go the extra mile and visit congressional offices in the home district. Giving that aide the rational look in the eye will be a much more memorable experince than a letter. If a delegation of concerned parents visit; even better.

 

[Titan6]

Texas P226-

100% on all counts. The only thing in question is the timeline. Hopefully not in my lifetime.

 

[RIDE]

What are the chances (in %) that:

1. No new gun laws will be enacted.

2. A bill similar to HR 1022 will be passed and no more.

3. All semiautomatic and double action handguns and revolvers will be banned along with any semiautomatic rifle, possibly including lever action rifles leaving us with single action revolvers or single shot handguns and black powder and bolt action hunting rifles limited to, say, 5 rounds.

4. A total ban on new and used gun sales.

5. "Mr. and Mrs. America, turn them all in."

IMO... (if we are strictly talking VERY NEAR future, as in next 3 to 6 months)

1) .00001%

2) 80%

3) 10%

4) .00001%

5) .00001%

 

[tulsamal]

I don't think this crime will lead to further national legislation. Not unless it is just the first one of a series....

My main reason for saying that is that the guy just used two regular handguns. Even most fence sitters will be able to see he could have done the same thing just as well with 10 round magazines.

Now if every single aspect of the case was the same except he used an AK..... then we would probably be in for some real trouble.

Finally, don't underestimate the composition of Congress right now. We have more Democrats but that doesn't tell it all. We have some Democrats who aren't going to vote for gun control, period. My Representative (Boren) is A rated by the NRA and a good example. And I'm not sure we are worse off for having "less Republicans" if we are going to count the old F rated ones that lost. Those Republicans would have voted against us anyway. Perhaps even more than some of the middle of the road Democrats.

Take a deep breath. Turn off the TV. Explain things rationally to those who ask you. Bring up the armed airline pilot program and push the idea of a couple of anonymously armed staff members in every school building. The bad guy won't know who they are until he starts shooting and then gets shot himself. Take the damn "gun free zone" signs down from in front of schools. Change state laws to allow CCW holders to carry on school property. From 4k to University. Why did we ever think it was a bad idea for legal gun carriers to walk through a school?! Courthouses and bars are just about the only places that should be off limits. (Don't even get me started on the Post Office!!)

Gregg

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Whether this brings more gun control or not depends entirely on how well each of us do at educating the thousands of people who are going to be sadly misinformed on guns based on their reading of the news coverage of this event.

The real story here is that in Viriginia, concealed carry on campus is legal; but Virginia Tech took the specific steps to prohibit it - even after they had an escaped convict/murderer loose on the campus last August and VT students with CHLs protested.

 

[Titan6]

If logic and facts led the way we never would have had the gun control on the campus that we did have. If people examined statistics honestly we would not have the crazy gun laws that we do have in CA, NJ, NY wherever.....

If you want to take the chance that people are rational, logical and capable of reason while being hit with emotional sensationalism on all sides I wish you luck. These are long odds at best. As a novice study of human nature I can tell you that people generally disappoint. This is what got us the Patriot Act, a bill that was passed through congress without even being read by the people voting on it and effectively repealed half the bill of rights. I don't see anyone working all that hard to repeal it either.

In any case I will fight the fight but I am making back up plans and acting proactively based upon what I perceive to be a high likelihood of unfavorable results. If others wish to prepare I encourage them to do so. If they do not wish to prepare than that so be it.

 

[Lobotomy Boy]

Whether this brings more gun control or not depends entirely on how well each of us do at educating the thousands of people who are going to be sadly misinformed on guns based on their reading of the news coverage of this event.

I've already been working on that. I had lunch with a co-worker who is a knee-jerk anti, but I've been working on him for a couple of years and he's starting to get a little sense in his head. I said that allowing law-abiding citizens who met legal requirements and passed a background check to carry guns on campus would have saved the vast majority of the wounded and killed. The shooter would likely have shot no more than one or two people before he fell under a hail of return fire, had a half-dozen or so of the students in that room been legally armed.

His retort was that he worried that bystanders would have been killed by stray bullets. I said that anyone who meets the legal requirements to carry a gun will have been trained in both procedures and shooting skills, minimizing this risk. Even if one or two people were hit by stray fire, that would have still been a far better outcome than having 59 people killed or injured.

Given the nature of the incident, and the nature of the man with whom I was having this conversation, I was surprised by the fact that he didn't really argue with these points. Rather, he just pondered them and didn't say much, other than, "I'm glad people who carry guns get that sort of training." Perhaps he's coming around, but I still can't get him to commit to going to the range.

 

[Chad]

In any case I will fight the fight but I am making back up plans and acting proactively based upon what I perceive to be a high likelihood of unfavorable results. If others wish to prepare I encourage them to do so. If they do not wish to prepare than that so be it.

One thing I didn't mention before...
The reason I'm not rushing out and buying all the things that might get banned, and all the ammo that might disappear is that I don't need to.

 

[EVIL5LITER]

I don't quite see how you guys think this is going to work out bad for the Anti's.

The Democrats are in control. This sort of tragedy is their bread and butter.

They are going to exploit this to the fullest extent just as Bush and company exploited 9/11 to invade Iraq and push through the Patriot act.

It's politicians, not citizens. While this may change the way the public thinks, it isn't going to change the way the media or the politicians think.

 

[SoCalShooter]

I actually think that this will back fire on the anti's. People don't even know the full extent of what happened. Some parents haven't even been notified yet and they are already making anti gun speeches.

I think people are tired of things like this getting politicized.

I agree, in fact I think they are going to literaly and figuratively shoot themselves in the foot, they are grand standing on a tragedy and no one appreciates that.

 

[Titan6]

Grand Standing is taking place and will continue to take place on both sides.

People will be more galvanized on the issue.

Congress will feel that they have to take some kind of action so that they can say that they have done something.

Something will be done.

The thing that they do will likely not be something that we want or will allow people to be safer.

I could be wrong but; I do not think I am.

 

[Titan6]

A little update. Midway is now out of Glock high capacity magazines. They still have some ten rounders left.

Funny thing about the ten rounders, they now cost $26. I have been buying them at gun shows practially new for the last year or so for $5-7.

Silly of me to assume that no one else had the same idea. I am sure it will all just blow over and that the new bill that Feinstein just introduced yesterday will never be passed even though it only targets high cap magazines. So just calm down, and don't give it another thought except to work real hard to make sure that law does not get passed. I am sure you will all be able to buy the magazines later as soon as they get a new shipment in. Sorry for all the trouble... In fact here is what it says now:

You are Browsing in: Magazine

There are no products in this category.

When you encounter a category with no products, it is usually because:
The products in the category are currently unavailable for sale.
They are new and haven't been received yet.
They have all been discontinued.
We are researching a potential problem with the products.
We are sorry for any inconvenience.

Edit: Good news. Sportmens Guide still has them, and for cheaper than the ten rounders are on Midway.

 

[Redneck with a 40]

I sure am glad that I have....1) enough components to load 3000 rounds of 40 S&W ammo.

2) At least 1000 rounds of ammo for every caliber I own.

3) I currently own all of the guns I want and need.

4) I will be ordering a (3) pack of 20 round mags for my XD-40 shortly.

I began stockpiling 6 months ago with a suspicion that something like this event might happen, obviously it was a good call.