B.p. revolver fan getting first b.p. rifle, have a few questions

[Dithsoer]

Although I've been shooting percussion revolvers for many years, I have little experience with muzzleloading longarms. I'm interested in getting a small-caliber b.p. rifle, something like a .32 or .36. My main criteria is accuracy with round balls and a percussion lock. Are the smaller-caliber rifles as accurate as the.50's and larger? Are there any conicals available in these calibers? Also, if I did get a flint lock, how many shots can I expect between flint changes?
Pedersoli is the only manufacturer that I could find that produces small caliber muzzle loaders. Does anyone else make anything this small? I'm really looking for more of a target gun than a hunting arm.

 

[Timthinker]

Dithsoer, when I wanted an accurate BP rifle some years ago, I bought a modern muzzleloader. It was a Knight rifle. If you want good accuracy, then I humbly suggest a Knight or Thompson Center inline rifle.

Why do I suggest a good inline rifle? Accuracy. In the mid-1990s, I used my Knight rifle to outshoot a friend armed with a Ruger Mini-14. The targets were located 100 yards away. I doubt I could have won that match with a traditional BP rifle. These inlines are designed to shoot sabot or conical rounds with good accuracy. Round balls, due to their ballistic configuration, lack the longer range accuracy provide by conical or sabot designs.

No doubt my views on this subject my strike some here as heresy. So be it. When I shoot a firearm, I demand accuracy. This is the reason behind my recommendation-and my rant. I hope my honest opinion is useful even if it is not what you sought. Good luck with whatever you purchase.


Timthinker

 

[Bad Flynch]

All other things being equal, the smaller the caliber, the more accurate the rifle is. However, the 32s have a reputation for fouling badly and losing accuracy rapidly, so I suggest a .36 as a minimum.

A really nice, traditinal caplock will put you in good stead accuracy wise and you can go to traditional muzzleloading shoots; they won't even let you in the door with an inline. Depending on just how much money you want to spend, you can get a Pedersoli or you can go to www.trackofthewolf.com and see what they have. The Lyman is fine if you don't mind 50 caliber.

.36s are fine for squirrels and rabbits, .40s are good for larger vermin and for target work, .45s and up are good for hunting and the .45s are still used for target work a lot.

 

[Omnivore]

In-lines are fine if you find one you like. There is however no physical reason why a good sidelock rifle can't shoot just as well. Musket caps are less powerful than 209 primers, and #11 percussion caps are less powerful than musket caps, but that's a reliability issue rather than one of accuracy. If I really shoot a lot, on a given day I might have one or two misfires using #11 caps, but then I don't do any cleaning of the nipple 'till I get home. I could also beef up the mainspring without any trouble, just by adding a washer to the end of the coil.

Good sights and a good trigger help also, but do not affect the rifle's inherant accuracy-- just the ability of the shooter to use it well. If you're a decent shooter, and you end up shooting massive groups, something's probably loose, or your loads are way out of the zone your rifle likes.

With my Lyman Deerstalker I could keep up with most people shooting a standard Mini-14. I know because I have both, and I can get 2 to 3" groups with either at 100 using the irons. Truth be known, the Military specs for the M-14 (crica 1950s) required a five-shot group no more than about 6 inches at 100 yards. That's a modern gas-operated rifle. With a little tweaking and careful load selection, most any current manufacture muzzleloader should do better than that unless it's defective in some way.

Cabela's has their Blue Ridge rifles (I think from Pedersolli) in both flint and percussion, several bore sizes from small to large, and they've gotten pretty good reviews (and they're oh so pretty). You can go from this link and find the reviews from there. Some of the commenters know very little, or they're doing the review without having fired the rifle, but there are at least a couple of them who really shoot and they know their stuff:
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/t...index&indexId=cat601141&rid=&_requestid=79812

Cabela's also have a "Kentucky Rifle" that is a better bargain, but it only comes in .50.

The TC Hawken is a good first front-feeder, but again, no small bores that I know. Green Mountain barrels can sell you a barrel in just about any bore size, for just about any rifle, however.

How many shots before fixing a flint? Depends on the flint (and probably the rifle too) but I'm not a flinter (yet) so others will have to comment on that. See the stickys for this section and there you'll find a lot of good info.

Both the Knights and the TC in-lines have good reputations.

 

[Pancho]

I've got a TC cherokee which is styled like a plains rifle but smaller in overall size and it is .32 cal. It is a tack driver and a great squirrel gun. I also have the Pedersoli Blue Ridge in 50 cal. flint. The Pedersoli is beautiful and a great shooter but truthfully I've not shot flintlocks enough to be good. I flinch to much when the pan goes off. If I were in the market I'd buy the Pedersoli Blue Ridge percussion in .36 or .40 cal. I also would buy the carbine version. Cabela's does not list the carbine but Pedersoli makes it and it is drop-dead gorgeous.

 

[Dithsoer]

I should have mentioned it in my opening post but I really want a traditional rifle, say between $400 and $700 dollars. Shoot, if I wanted a modern in-line, I'd just get out one of my center-fire rifles. Scopes, 209 primers, thumb hole synthetic syocks, smokless pistol powders, it's just too close to a modern rifle to me. With no intention of offense. If that's how you like to burn your b.p., that's great, at least you're shooting.
I guess what I'd really like is a b.p. target gun but everyone I've seen is over a thousand dollars. I'd love to have one of those long-barreled Gibson reproductions but they cost around $1500 now. Just a few years ago one could get one for around a grand. Anyone ever hear of the Pedersoli Tryon (I think that's what it's called)? For a good target gun I'd be fine with a larger caliber.
You know, there is one modern inline that has caught my eye. I think it's the Knight Disc gun (?). It sort of has a modified falling block or falling hammer type action or something similiar to that. Of course with that I'd probably get the best accuracy with pistol bullets and sabots. It looks like a pretty nice b.p. gun, but it just doesn't seem the same, you know?

 

[arcticap]

Traditions offers the Crockett rifle in .32 and the Shenandoah in .36. Locating one of these at a decent price would provide an alternative to the Pedersoli/Cabela's rifle.
The conicals that are available for these rifles are the TC Maxi style conicals in each caliber. And there's .36 sabots available to shoot with about .31 bullets too I believe.
Both calibers are accurate but somewhat more susceptable to the wind at long range. The .32 balls are a little more tedious to handle, but the Crockett rifle is very popular, accurate and a good value.
The choice of caliber boils down to the distance that you want to shoot and how much powder and "bang effect" that you desire to make your shooting enjoyable.
For $700, you might be able to have a rifle built for you, or you can buy a semi-finished one for less money.

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/e...leloaders:+Classic+Muzzleloaders+(Side+Locks)

http://www.sittingfoxmuzzleloaders.com/intro.html

 

[scrat]

Dithsoer. Check out blackpowder 101 under black powder essentials. Good information on muzzleloaders

 

[Cosmoline]

Anyone ever hear of the Pedersoli Tryon (I think that's what it's called)? For a good target gun I'd be fine with a larger caliber.

A little late on this thread but I just picked one of these up from GB. They have a great rep as an excellent roundball gun and have taken trophies at all levels. They're on the heavy side but still light compared with my Kodiak double fifty!

 

[Loyalist Dave]

when I wanted an accurate BP rifle some years ago, I bought a modern muzzleloader. ...., In the mid-1990s, I used my Knight rifle to outshoot a friend armed with a Ruger Mini-14. The targets were located 100 yards away. I doubt I could have won that match with a traditional BP rifle....

Well, first off, defeating a mini-14 isn't a tough thing to do. Second, you forgot to mention that to get that accuracy in an in-line, one has to use a scope, for all of the out-of-the-box inlines that come with iron sights have sights that are too coarse for accurate work. I'd put my iron sighted flintlock shooting round ball at 100 yards up against any iron sighted in-line at the same range. I'd also do it with a mini-14 using iron sights, and probably would win.