>Berger bullets<
- Thread starter Arc-Lite
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I tried several times to get the Berger 80 VLD to shoot well for me. In a variety of barrels too. Kreigers, Harts, Liljas, etc... I could never get really good results. However... I was only testing with Varget as it is the powder I use and all my components need to work with it or I ditch them. With that said, I have had GREAT results with JLK VLD 80s. They shoot like a dream in all my rifles at or about 10 to 18 thou into the lands. The bummer is that OK Weber is no longer selling them, and rumor is that Jimmy Knox is going to retire from the business. Lucky for me I bought about 5K of them. And only using them at 600yds, these should last me many seasons.
Zak Smith
Member
Several friends of mine have switched over to the 168gr Berger VLD 7mm because the 162 AMAXs were blowing up.
Jon Coppenbarger
Member
I kind of was not going to post but will cause you asked a specific question.
I shoot mine 10-15 thousand into the lands.
I have not tried the 80vld's but use the 75vld's.
I have shot Sierra's bullets for several years and still will for short courses and practice. This year after testing I have gone to 73 bergers for 200 and 300 and the 75vld's for 600 yards.
They are proving very good for me but the only draw back I see so far is having to change my wind reading to adjust for the rounds. It caused a few 9's by putting on wind when I did not need it.
In the only two matches I have fired with them they surprized me. When the guys that I shoot with were putting on 6 minutes I was putting on 4. For any thing under 1 minute I have to learn to leave it alone and just shoot them.
I hope they work out as I only ordered 1k of the 73's and have around 700 of the 75vld's that I got. Just put in a order for another 1k of the 73's and 500 more of the 75vld's. That should get me threw Perry as they will only get used shooting xtc.
I use N140 for my Sierra's and N540 for the Bergers
Also I use LC cases for 200 and 300 and Winchester for 600 yards.
Primers are 7 1/2's for 200 and 300 and Br4's for 600.
I believe I may switch over to 7 1/2's for everything but not right now.
Sorry no load info as your rifle and mine are most likely going to be different.
A friend used my Sierra's which are not a heavy load for me at a 600 any-any last week and he was having problems with them, He had to switch to my 77's for the last 40 shots. He did shoot a pair of 198's one with the 80's and one with the 77's. The only 3 guys shooting the Bergers had no problem with
the wind and one shot a 588 with a 6mm rifle and I shot a 587 with the ar15. The other guy would of been right there also but cross fired one round.
They shoot but you have to watch them.
Not alot of folks use them for several reasons.
#1 cost
#2 being able to find them
#3 keeping up with the loading of them for your barrel wear
I shoot mine 10-15 thousand into the lands.
I have not tried the 80vld's but use the 75vld's.
I have shot Sierra's bullets for several years and still will for short courses and practice. This year after testing I have gone to 73 bergers for 200 and 300 and the 75vld's for 600 yards.
They are proving very good for me but the only draw back I see so far is having to change my wind reading to adjust for the rounds. It caused a few 9's by putting on wind when I did not need it.
In the only two matches I have fired with them they surprized me. When the guys that I shoot with were putting on 6 minutes I was putting on 4. For any thing under 1 minute I have to learn to leave it alone and just shoot them.
I hope they work out as I only ordered 1k of the 73's and have around 700 of the 75vld's that I got. Just put in a order for another 1k of the 73's and 500 more of the 75vld's. That should get me threw Perry as they will only get used shooting xtc.
I use N140 for my Sierra's and N540 for the Bergers
Also I use LC cases for 200 and 300 and Winchester for 600 yards.
Primers are 7 1/2's for 200 and 300 and Br4's for 600.
I believe I may switch over to 7 1/2's for everything but not right now.
Sorry no load info as your rifle and mine are most likely going to be different.
A friend used my Sierra's which are not a heavy load for me at a 600 any-any last week and he was having problems with them, He had to switch to my 77's for the last 40 shots. He did shoot a pair of 198's one with the 80's and one with the 77's. The only 3 guys shooting the Bergers had no problem with
the wind and one shot a 588 with a 6mm rifle and I shot a 587 with the ar15. The other guy would of been right there also but cross fired one round.
They shoot but you have to watch them.
Not alot of folks use them for several reasons.
#1 cost
#2 being able to find them
#3 keeping up with the loading of them for your barrel wear
Just bought a batch of older Berger 168 VLD's.
Older, as in before Walt sold the business. I'm going to load them in my 700 PSS over IMR4895 and see how they do past 600 yards. Although, as Zak reminded me, the Lapua Scenars are definitely worth investigating, too. As a pre-retirement gift, I just ordered a new Remington 40-XB in 7.62 NATO, and it should arrive between 3-6 months. I can't wait to try it out, and work up the right handload for it.
This struck me as funny, though:
Isn't that kinda throwing the baby out with the bath water? No VihtaVuori for you! (to the sound of the Soup Nazi voice)
Older, as in before Walt sold the business. I'm going to load them in my 700 PSS over IMR4895 and see how they do past 600 yards. Although, as Zak reminded me, the Lapua Scenars are definitely worth investigating, too. As a pre-retirement gift, I just ordered a new Remington 40-XB in 7.62 NATO, and it should arrive between 3-6 months. I can't wait to try it out, and work up the right handload for it.
This struck me as funny, though:
Isn't that kinda throwing the baby out with the bath water? No VihtaVuori for you! (to the sound of the Soup Nazi voice)
Quote:
Isn't that kinda throwing the baby out with the bath water? No VihtaVuori for you! (to the sound of the Soup Nazi voice)
Not really. My method may not seem logical to all, but it has worked for me. I have accomplished every goal I have set out to make with my ammo made in this fashion.
Isn't that kinda throwing the baby out with the bath water? No VihtaVuori for you! (to the sound of the Soup Nazi voice)
Not really. My method may not seem logical to all, but it has worked for me. I have accomplished every goal I have set out to make with my ammo made in this fashion.
Jon Coppenbarger
Member
hipwr223 is one of the very top shooters in highpower in the states and I respect his opinions very highly.
I try different things in the quest to get to that level someday. It may never happen but with folks like him helping on these boards I might find a level I am happy with.
John thank you
Jon
I try different things in the quest to get to that level someday. It may never happen but with folks like him helping on these boards I might find a level I am happy with.
John thank you
Jon
Hey, not disputing his shooting prowess...
It was my personal observation from over 25 years of reloading experience, that settling on just one powder for all calibers tends to ignore some potentially excellent choices.
On a suggestion, I tried H4831SC for my 1000-yard 6.5-06. I'd been using IMR4350. "Wow!" is an understatement.
When I left Highpower for F-Class, I was still using my M14NM. I had considered Varget, it was getting rave reviews at the time.
It was my personal observation from over 25 years of reloading experience, that settling on just one powder for all calibers tends to ignore some potentially excellent choices.
On a suggestion, I tried H4831SC for my 1000-yard 6.5-06. I'd been using IMR4350. "Wow!" is an understatement.
When I left Highpower for F-Class, I was still using my M14NM. I had considered Varget, it was getting rave reviews at the time.
I am still interested in trying to get the most of the Berger's...but think a back up plan minght be a good idea .. any experiences with the Hornady A-Max ? These will be fired threw a custom 6mm Remington...with a stock 1 in 9 twist.....so I am looking for a quality high coefficient bullet in the 90-105 gr. range, this 95gr. bullet in the Berger runs at .524, and the 105 gr. Hornady A-Max runs at an even .500 if not these two bullets, and other ideas? My thanks and appreciatin for your directions.
Quintin Likely
Member
Lapua makes some killer 6mm bullets. Looking on their website, the 105 gr. 6mm Scenar has a .530 BC.
Jon,
I am flattered by the compliments, but I am not at the top. I am close, but I am not at the same level consistent enough like Shawn M, Lee Land, Bob Modica, Nick Till, etc... Those guys seem to always be ON. I still get hot and cold, but I am always trying.
I am flattered by the compliments, but I am not at the top. I am close, but I am not at the same level consistent enough like Shawn M, Lee Land, Bob Modica, Nick Till, etc... Those guys seem to always be ON. I still get hot and cold, but I am always trying.
Jon Coppenbarger
Member
John
You know where I get my load data from, It is from the first name on your list. He left CO and works for David now in Canadian TX.
Trust me I know exactly what you are talking about. If I am on and he has a slightly off day I am close but it was nice to shoot against him every weekend for the last several years and have learned allot from our talks we have had. It helps to get reasons for the things folks do.
We bet on most every match we shot and trust me he won a good part of the time.
Just small friendly things to try and get me working harder. It usually was on the rapids but the last time was across the course and he got me in off hand and in sitting and I got him at 300 and 600. And he got me by 1 point in the total. It was a typical day as I can not match his off hand and he does not drop enough points to catch by the end of the day.
I am taking my off hand from what he does for around 90% of it or more now and I am working more on my mental part of off hand so maybe I can get closer to what you guys are doing. It just has to be mental as I hate dropping 13 to 16 points in off hand and then less than that the rest of the match. I had one last year I dropped 18 in off hand and 3 in the last 60 shots and that hurts. But I am working on it.
I understand what you are saying about that list but trust me in my opinion and many others you are right there also.
Thank you for your input.
Jon
You know where I get my load data from, It is from the first name on your list. He left CO and works for David now in Canadian TX.
Trust me I know exactly what you are talking about. If I am on and he has a slightly off day I am close but it was nice to shoot against him every weekend for the last several years and have learned allot from our talks we have had. It helps to get reasons for the things folks do.
We bet on most every match we shot and trust me he won a good part of the time.
Just small friendly things to try and get me working harder. It usually was on the rapids but the last time was across the course and he got me in off hand and in sitting and I got him at 300 and 600. And he got me by 1 point in the total. It was a typical day as I can not match his off hand and he does not drop enough points to catch by the end of the day.
I am taking my off hand from what he does for around 90% of it or more now and I am working more on my mental part of off hand so maybe I can get closer to what you guys are doing. It just has to be mental as I hate dropping 13 to 16 points in off hand and then less than that the rest of the match. I had one last year I dropped 18 in off hand and 3 in the last 60 shots and that hurts. But I am working on it.
I understand what you are saying about that list but trust me in my opinion and many others you are right there also.
Thank you for your input.
Jon
Steve Smith
Moderator Emeritus
Arc-Lite, I have not shot the A-Max but I have heard that some have problems with bullets blowing up on the way to the target. I think the 80 Sierra works very well, but when I get my reloading gear back and get to a more HP friendly place I will test some Bergers as well as shooting up my 90 JLKs and test the two against each other.
Zak Smith
Member
re: AMAXs blowing up.
Here's the details. Subject is a friend of mine. 7Rem Mag 28" Pac-Nor bbl built for the ITRC. He was pushing 162gr AMAXs at about 3050fps. During the match when the barrel warmed up, the bullets weren't making it to the targets. Back home, he checked them in the shooting tube at Cherry Creek (Denver) to confirm they were fragging themselves within 100 yards after 10 or so rounds.
A "***?" call to Hornady resulted and their response was, "You're not supposed to shoot that bullet so fast!" - Too bad they didn't mention that anywhere. He called Berger, talked to Walt, to assured him that the 168gr VLD's would have no problem at those spin rates.
-z
Here's the details. Subject is a friend of mine. 7Rem Mag 28" Pac-Nor bbl built for the ITRC. He was pushing 162gr AMAXs at about 3050fps. During the match when the barrel warmed up, the bullets weren't making it to the targets. Back home, he checked them in the shooting tube at Cherry Creek (Denver) to confirm they were fragging themselves within 100 yards after 10 or so rounds.
A "***?" call to Hornady resulted and their response was, "You're not supposed to shoot that bullet so fast!" - Too bad they didn't mention that anywhere. He called Berger, talked to Walt, to assured him that the 168gr VLD's would have no problem at those spin rates.
-z
I have decided to do this right, and get a stoney point gauge and work these Berger bullets into this 6mm set up....ordered one today.... and will let you know, how it turns out. Did find out, that the A-Max bullets are good till about 3000 fps.. then go to gas.... saw this happen a few times, with a friends 22-250 and sx rounds....crazy sight !!!! from what I hear...the V-Max....are good to go to the higher ends of the fps scale.
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