Bersa Firestorm or Walther P-22 ??

[grndslm]

I'm going crazy, guys!! I think I want the Firestorm, but is it really worth it over the Walther P-22 ?!?!?

Here are my options:

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#1) $396 for a Bersa Firestorm, which is used, yet it has a threaded barrel and adapter for a suppressor... coming from a dealer with the box.

#2) $375 for a Bersa Firestorm, which is brand new in box... coming from a dealer.

#3) $330 for a Bersa Firestorm, which has the box and only had one or two hundred rounds shot thru it... coming from a random individual. I might even have to pay an extra $20 to use my credit card thru PayPal. I'm sure my credit card company will reimburse me if the deal falls thru, but I'm not so sure about PayPal. I doubt this guy is a problem, but there's always that peace of mind thing I like.

#4) $320 for a Walther P-22, which is brand NIB... coming from my local dealer with a "lifetime warranty" from them, as well as Walther (S&W?).

#5) $360 for a Walther P-22, which is brand NIB... coming from the same local dealer with their own "lifetime warranty... yet this one comes with a threaded barrel and silencer adapter.

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What would you guys do if these were your only options... and why??

And could the extra quarter-inch for the silencer adapter actually improve accuracy?? Or affect my shooting in any other way than looks? I'd be able to take the adapter off with no problems too, I'm assuming?

And how much would it cost to get a threaded barrel and adapter for a Firestorm anyway?? Are they common, or would it have to be custom made?

Anybody know what Firestorm's warranty service is like? ... or wouldn't it be Bersa's warranty, rather?? Anybody think I'd need to use it as often as the Walther/S&W warranty (or my local pawn shop's warranty?)?

 

[Publius1688]

I'd go with the Walther, but whatever you do, go with #2 or #4. My feeling, after owning a Walther and shooting a Bersa, is that these guys have low tolerances for crappy ammo----Who knows what the random dude was shooting through the Bersa? You can do a lot of damage to a 22LR auto in a short period of time...... There are some weapons I'll buy used, but a small bore auto isn't one of them.

 

[DeepSouth]

I had a Walther P22 and had more problems out of it than you could possibily imagine. It was a true "jam-o-matic" I would not recommend one to anyone.

As a result I would go with Bersa Firestorm, a new one. I try not to buy Auto's used simply because many were sold/traded because they are unreliable.

 

[grndslm]

OK... so used a used 22 semi is out of the question now. Good thinking. How much extra to add threaded barrel and silencer adapter to a Firestorm, tho??

I had a Walther P22 and had more problems out of it than you could possibily imagine. It was a true "jam-o-matic" I would not recommend one to anyone.

I hear most of the P22 problems were from the older ones, and that Walther changed the design. The magazine was the problem, and now it's been fixed.

Either way, my local pawn shop is gonna give me a lifetime warranty, where I might actually get some use out of, because they're not going outta business. The Bersa or Firestorm warranty is something I'm very unsure of, now and in the future.

And nice nick, DeepSouth!!

 

[grndslm]

Ignoring price... if the question were just... "Bersa Firestorm 22 w/ lifetime warranty, but gotta pay for shipping VERSUS Walther P-22 w/ lifetime warranty at my hopefully always local dealer??"

Then what would you guys say?

 

[Publius1688]

Get the Walther, make sure the serial # confirms recent manufacture (problems with the old ones), and shoot 40 grain 22LR only out of it, preferably CCI mini mags or Winchester X, in the red box. You'll have fun.

 

[grndslm]

But why get the Walther over the Firestorm?!?

I'm not a huge fan of polymer grips for some reason. I feel like there should be some weight in the handle. I've heard that the Bersa/Firestorm is extremely durable, and I've also heard that the Walther isn't as accurate as the Bersa, etc.

What benefits does the Walther have over the Firestorm?

Any advice on "lifetime warranty" issues would help too. Basically comes down to me trusting the continued prosperity of Firestorm and/or Dad's Super Pawn. If I pick the Walther from Dad's, and they go outta business in 3 years, I'll be screwed. If I pick the Firestorm and Firestorm goes outta business, I don't think that Bersa is gonna honor the Firestorm warranty, even tho they're the same company really. Very tricky stuff.

 

[KevininPa]

Firestorm

When I was looking for a smaller semi-auto .22 plinker, I chose the Firestorm of the two. Back then (4 yrs or so), the Bersa had a steel slide where the Walther had a zinc slide that was giving owners problems (cracking and such). The Firestorm was also cheaper then, though you paid more for an extra mag. I've shot both and found the accuracy to be about the same. They are not tack-drivers but not bad at all. I don't know about current Walthers, they probably took care of their issues by now. Especially since they seem to have a whole line around that style. I have a lot of rounds through my FS-22 and it's still going strong.

 

[Cactus Jack Arizona]

The Walther P-22 is a great little 22LR pistol, as long as you stay away from the "bargain" or "Bulk" ammo. It seriously is very finicky on what you shoot through it. I've found that CCI Mini-Mags or CCI Stingers work really well through it. I've also observed the Winchester Super-X Power Point work well, although it is somewhat dirtier than the CCI.

 

[grndslm]

If you guys had to trust your life with a Firestorm 22 or a Walther P-22 *and* you could only use bulk ammo... I'm assuming the Firestorm is the way to go then, eh?

If the Firestorm fired 1 outta 20 times with bulk ammo, compared to 1 outta 2 for the Walther... I think that would be my ultimate deciding factor.

 

[j-easy]

I have no experience with the Bersa, I've got a P22 bought last year it works good, I think I have had issues with shooting subsonic ammo but it shoots the Federal bulk packs fine. and I think all non-california ones should come with a threaded barrel? I got that on mine and its the 5"in model

 

[PX15]

FWIW:


I have a Firestorm FS22..

It is an excellent little plinker, amazingly accurate w/screw adj rear sights.. Firestorm pistols come with a Lifetime Warranty from Bersa/Firestorm.

The FS22 is "Walther PP" in size and feel and in a pinch could be carried as a concealed weapon.. Capacity 10+1, and while my FS22 feeds anything, I prefer "CCI Stinger" hollowpoints.

Walther P22's come with a one year warranty from the factory, that service being provided by S&W, the importers.

Don't have a clue as to how good your local dealers "lifetime" warrenty might, or might not be.

Walther P22's have a reputation for "iffyness"... Firestorms are overall (historically) imo more reliable.

I would say as a dedicated "plinker" the Walther (assuming it works right) is a better choice, but OVERALL for multiple use the Firestorm FS22 would be my choice.

No offense to those who disagree.

Best Wishes,

Jesse

 

[Publius1688]

I wanted to come back to this thread and add a point:
Whatever you do, don't trust your life to the P22 or the Bersa.
Frankly, they are just toys. They're fun to shoot, cheap, and cool looking, but toys nonetheless.
Make sure you've got a 9mm, or a .40, or a .45 in the gunsafe before laying down any $ on a .22LR pistol.
Whew. Glad I got that off my chest!

 

[grndslm]

I do not honestly plan to use a gun but as a last resort in my home. I bought a 9mm for self-defense, but I realistically can't practice with it because of ammo prices, but mostly shortage.

I can only afford one gun, which means I can only afford one caliber... 22LR, plus it's the only available ammo everywhere.

In a "sheet hitting the fan" scenario, I think a gun like the Firestorm 22LR with Mini-Mags or other CCI brand stuff would be all I'd need after having practiced with it. Imagine if the stock market completely tanked, I'd have about 3,000 rounds sitting on my shelf, only costing me ~$100. I'll be ready for war alright.

Perhaps after 5,000 rounds I'll get a 1911, but I think the Firestorm will do the job for now.

 

[grndslm]

BTW... How does the DA/SA trigger work for both of these guns? DA first shot and then SA every shot afterward??

I was hoping it was DA always and SA when the hammer was cocked, like revolvers. I do not understand how a semi-auto can shoot successive SA rounds if it's only doing half its job.

 

[bad_aim_billy]

The P22 is either on the first shot (I carry it Double) and then single-action on every successive shot.

 

[PX15]

FWIW:

If the question had been what is a great 22cal. pistol I would have said any of the Ruger "Standard" 22cal pistols..

I think in any comparison between one of the Rugers and the Walther P22 the winner would be, hands down, the Ruger..

But when a potential for conceal carry, or situations of that nature is considered I think the Firestorm FS22 is mighty hard to beat.

In fact I was so impressed with the performance and reliability of the FS22 that one time I deliberately did not clean it until it got so crudded up that the slide wouldn't close completely.. It took over 900 rds of cheap Wally World Bonus Pack Remingtons to do it. I just wanted to see how long it would take to burp..

I disassembled it, gave it a good cleaning, loaded her up and it was perfect all over again.. Great little pistol even if Bersa/Firestorm is mighty proud of their extra magazines (they are pricey) should you need to buy one..

Best Wishes,

Jesse

And I'm not anti-Walther pistols as I've owned a PP/P1/P5/P99/P99c and loved 'em all, but from all I've read on various firearm forums the P22 is simply not up to Walther standards by any measure.

No offense to those who disagree, just personal opinion.

Best Wishes,

Jesse

 

[grndslm]

PX15:

I'm with you. I'm looking for all-around usage and versatility in only one .22 cal pistol to own. And I think the Firestorm 22 is the one for me.

I was gonna buy the 22A, the U22 Neos Inox, a Ruger, a Browning Buck Mark, etc.... the list continues on and on. But they all have some downfalls, where the Firestorm doesn't seem to have any other than, "Can you find it?"

I *can* find the Walther, but there's no fun in owning a gun that everybody else has... similar to owning a Ruger. I'd get a Browning over a Ruger just to help the underdog. But in my case, I think the Firestorm is the all-around gun I've been looking for. I will have to pay a few extra $$ to transfer it here, but what the hey... it's VERY rare that I hear a complaint about a Thunder or Firestorm.

Back to the DA/SA trigger. How can a semi-auto be DA for the first shot and SA for shots 2 to 10?? If it's not DA for shots 2 to 10, then how does it keep loading the next round? Same for the Neos and a few other guns I read... I just don't understand the concept of a semi-auto with SA trigger. I'm very confused about this.

Maybe I just need a revolver.

 

[PX15]

grndslm:

The first round is double-action because the hammer is down and you have to pull the trigger hard enough to both cock, and fire the pistol. The heavier double-action trigger pull offers you extra safety when you are carrying the firearm in that the pistol is not cocked.

Once you fire the first round with the heavier double-action trigger pull, the recoil created by the firing of the first round will both eject the spent empty brass and RE-COCK the pistol. Automatically, no action required on the shooters part for this to happen.

Now on the 2nd and succeeding rounds the hammer WILL be cocked automatically by the expanding gas and recoil of the previous round and therefore every round requires a lighter trigger pull because the hammer is already cocked and you don't have the long, heavy trigger pull required to cock the hammer yourself. (As in the first round fired).

I'm probably not doing a very good job of describing this, but I'm 66 years old and have been carrying a concealed weapon, legally, for over 40 years. I prefer a DA first shot for the extra protection from an accidental discharge that can occur from having a light first round trigger pull.

With the FS22, and I guess any firearm with an exposed hammer, you CAN cock the hammer with your thumb and have a first round SINGLE-action shot.

So if you are out casually plinking you CAN cock the hammer and all 11 rounds will be fired from the very light single-action mode.

For a personal protection role a first round DA shot is IMO, IMO, prudent especially for any person not in law enforcement, or who does not practice on a regular basis with his/her firearm.

Hope this helps, and perhaps someone else will come along to explain the DA/SA business better than I have.

Best Wishes, and good shooting, because the FS22 is a very good firearm.

Jesse

 

[grndslm]

I understand it, I was just expecting differently from reading about DA revolvers.

I was looking for something that shoots DA always and only SA when cocked, but it makes sense that this wouldn't exist in a semi-auto.

Oh well, I think I'll still get the FS22, but my very last decision to make is which color to get, because I just realized the duo-tone version has red dots instead of white. You can help me figure that out here: http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=463535

Thanks for the heads up, PX15!

 

[Claude Clay]

#1 cause its threaded and its NOT a Walther jam-a-junk p22.
look at how many Walther's are for sale used--there is a reason people trade them.
if you don't drop a gun, or something on it, i am at a loss to understand how shooting ammo through it can be harmful. a 40 glock, perhaps; but a 22lr.....
a hands on examination plus reputable gun stores have a return/exchange period.
despite the relativelly smal $ values here we all want value for our money yet aggrivation is not what we want just to save a few dollsrs.

just keep the left grip panel screw tight on the Bersa and enjoy.

----> all bets are off if you stumble upon a Sig Trailside in the $400 range

 

[searcher451]

Trust no gun that is made of pot metal.

The P22 is giving Walther a bad name. It's a Umarex gun; Umarex is the parent company of Walther, specializing in air guns. The P22, while cute (and some folks absolutely love them, make no mistake), is essentially a toy on steroids. But it shouldn't be taken seriously, IMO, and it doesn't qualify as a real Walther.

 

[grndslm]

if you don't drop a gun, or something on it, i am at a loss to understand how shooting ammo through it can be harmful. a 40 glock, perhaps; but a 22lr.....

From my understanding, it's acceptable to dry fire a centerfire gun, such as a .40, 9mm, etc.... but dry firing a .22 will cause damage to the gun.

I believe that's why people are against used .22s versus a new one that's only $40 more. A used .40 cal should be no problem.

 

[BlackHand1917]

I like my P-22, but it only seems to like CCI mini-mags. I don't have the Firestorm, but I have a Bersa Thunder .380 that's just the cat's meow - best "cheap" gun on the planet. I would take a chance on the Firestorm.

 

[Rex B]

... but dry firing a .22 will cause damage to the gun.

Not always. Most modern .22s are made to be dryfired. All they had to do was stop the firing pin just short of contact with the breech. The manual will tell you.

My Ruger 10/22 & Single Six say dry-fire is OK.