best bolt action military rifle of the 20th century

[tark]

Well, this ought to start a real dogfight.Which rifle is the best military bolt action rifle of the last century? Here are the ground rules:

Must have actually proved itself in real combat. Sorry, Schmidt Reuben fans, your rifles don't qualify.

Looks and pretty workmanship mean nothing, and how nice of a sporter it can be turned into also means nothing.

How rugged was it, how simple to use was it, how cheaply and easily could it be manufactured, how powerful was it and how accurate was it?? These things mean everything.

Only as-issued rifles count.

I'll start the fight with my choice: The Japanese type 99 Arisaka. I am talking the earlier guns, not the substitute standard guns late in the war. Here are my reasons:

It was simple and easy to make. It was accurate enough to do the job. It was rugged beyond belief and had few parts. The entire bolt /firing mechanism/ safety only had five parts, all of which could be replaced in seconds in the field. It was easy to load quickly. If you have ever tried to load a Lee-Enfield quickly you will soon learn the what the opposite of the word "easy" is.

And the type 99 had one enormous advantage over every other bolt action military rifle of the period.; its chrome lined bore. That alone gives it a huge headstart.

What say you?

 

[Bart B.]

Springfield M1903 and its variants.

If commercial rifles issued to the military then used in combat qualify, then the Winchester Model 70.

 

[eastbank]

if you ever see the british soldiers shooting the lee enfields in the mad minute and how effective they are you will know. as far as quick loading the enfield rifles, i have seen pictures of british soldiers carrying extra 10 round magizines. eastbank.

 

[stoky]

They say (whoever "they" are ) that the '03 was the best target rifle, the Mauser was the best hunting rifle and the Enfield was the best combat rifle.
Where the Arisaka fits, I can't say, especially if the outcome was factored in.

 

[DukeConnor]

if you ever see the british soldiers shooting the lee enfields in the mad minute and how effective they are you will know. as far as quick loading the enfield rifles, i have seen pictures of british soldiers carrying extra 10 round magizines. eastbank.

I have a 03. I love the rifle. Great history. Very accurate.

I have shot a smle. I feel the enfield is superior for a combat rifle. Really great rifle to shoot fast and accurate.

I think the Ariska comment in the OP is just to get the comments going. I never shot one but held one. Not sure what the generation was, but, it was a pos. I would have rather carried a Louisville Slugger.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Kar 98k. Cupped buttplate variant.

I have a 1903A3 and my Brno made 98k is far slicker, just as hard hitting and more accurate (better groups at 100 yards).

Mauser is the most copied for a reason.

 

[LoonWulf]

I for one will second the Arisaka if we ignore the sights. Ive got a couple, besides the issued short stocks they handled pretty well, were durable, simple, smooth enough, and accurate. Even the substitute standards were surprisingly good guns considering the conditions they were built in.

Taking sights into account i prefer the 03a3 or smle over all the other guns.

 

[AndyP]

Mauser K-98. Most other bolt actions are variants of it. We had to pay Mauser for the patents to build our rifles up till WW1.

 

[qwert65]

The MS 1903 in 6.5x54
The big thing it would fail in is cost

 

[barnbwt]

C'mon, they're military bolt rifles, guys; a pretty simple machine at the end of the day, with a pretty simple job where iron-sight shooting is concerned.

A list of those that were objectively *bad* would be more interesting to me, since the remainder are largely interchangeable, excepting a few (relative) standout features like the SMLE bolt speed, the cutting edge Enfield sights, the modern furniture layout of the MAS 36, the high quality optical sights of the German Mausers. None of which are really significant enough to eclipse each other. Highly accurate or extremely well made guns (K31, Madsen M47, and Swedish Mauser) were not combat arms, and honestly the most common rifles encountered were largely late 19th century designs or essentially identical (all the Mausers, all the Mannlichers, Mosins, even the Schmidt-Rubins)

The Japanese rifles were very nice, especially pre-war, but were essentially mooted given the tactics & weaponry of the American war machine in the Pacific (bombs, carriers, flamethrowers, artillery, and guys with Garands, Brownings, & Thompsons in large quantity weren't going to be shown up by some conscripts with well made hunting rifles )

I guess the 1903 Mannlicher-Shoenauer barely qualifies, and I've always liked its near-Krag smoothness of operation (at least where Mannlicher clips are not concerned)

TCB

 

[Kendal Black]

The Enfield P14 and US M1917. I am not voting twice here; the rifles are nearly the same. The design was supposed to be an improvement on the Lee Enfield; I think it succeeded. It failed to become the standard in the UK and the US because the Lee Enfield and the Springfield were tough acts to follow. It served both nations well as secondary standard and proved itself incredibly robust and also highly accurate.

The weapon was plagued with parts interchangeability issues among the different makers. (There was a war on.) It was a heavy and somewhat ungraceful rifle. Some Eddystone-made rifles cracked when they were rebarreled; various explanations for this phenomenon have been offered.

Because it arrived when the armies concerned already had excellent bolt action rifles standardized, the P14/M1917 never fully got its chance to shine, but it earned several fully honorable footnotes in history:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pattern_1914_Enfield
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1917_Enfield

 

[bannockburn]

I think the best bolt action military rifle of the 20th century would be the British No.1 Mk.III/No.4 Mk.I rifle.

 

[AeroDillo]

Second the 1917/P14 Enfield. Probably as purely-bred a fighting bolt rifle as ever fielded.

 

[Robert]

No1 MkIII

 

[mjsdwash]

im not sure the K98 counts does it? 20 century production, but really not a 20'th century design. Unless shortening barrels counts. !917 enfields are kinda awesome. Im going to say the K31 though.

 

[MCMXI]

The Accuracy International AW and AWM rifles followed by the Lee-Enfield No.4 Mk.2.

 

[entropy]

No. 1 MKIII* And I say that as a Mosin collector. Of all the ones listed so far, the No.1 MKIII* is the one I'd prefer to take into combat.
While the AI rifles are top shelf, they weren't a standard issue rifle, and though tark didn't specify that, I believe that was the intent- off the shelf, as issued standard bolt rifle, not specialized sniper rifles.

 

[cdb1]

The Arisaka and Weatherby MarkV are supposedly the strongest actions ever built.

I've never handled, much less shot an Arisaka so any comment I made would be based on secondhand knowledge. Never owned a K98 but have shot a few and handled many. When I was a kid(in the 60's) we had two deer rifles. A 1903A3 and a SMLE, both military surplus with zero modifications. The 30-06 was in the family before I arrived, don't know where it came from. I remember going to an Army-Navy Surplus store with my mother to purchase the SMLE as a Fathers Day gift for my Dad. It cost $19.00. I think the K98 was the best of the three I have experience with. This may seem arbitrary but cock on closing is a negative to me with the .303. The two piece firing pin is a negative to me with the Springfield. I recently stripped and cleaned a 1903 for a friend and noticed the firing pin. Since I have no interest in milsurps I wasn't aware of this. In my book the German Mauser was the best.

 

[TrickyDick]

Finn M39. Just because.

 

[RPRNY]

I agree with General Patton.

But since his statement doesn't qualify, the Mauser. The best bolt action, ever. Period.

 

[Crowman]

Best battle rifle: SMLE No. 1 Mk III

Smoothest bolt action: 30-40 Krag.

Got one of each. Very similar cartridge performance.

 

[Tinpig]

I have a 1918 Remington M1917, a 1929 Springfield M1903, a 1937 CZ vz. 24 Mauser, a 1943 Remington M1903A3, and a 1953 Enfield No4MK2. I shoot them all regularly, they're all excellent, proven rifles and I have trouble choosing which one to take to the range. If I needed to grab one as the zombies were descending...I'd most likely get eaten standing in front of my gun cabinet going "eenie, meenie, minie, mo...."

 

[CornCod]

Mauser first, with Lee-Enfield a close second. The Springfield and Arisaka were very good rifles, but so much influenced by the Mauser that they almost don't count.

 

[barnbwt]

Exactly. And the Mauser wasn't even a 20th century design.

The question is sort of like asking the best cavalry saber design of the 20th century; there are some good ones, but the issue had been largely settled/mooted by even 1900 so you're past the end of meaningful development for the most part.

I guess the Mosin was pretty successful, seeing as it sucessfully occupied an entire industry of busywork for about twenty straight years post-war --Russia was making more new Mosins than new Russians!

TCB

 

[eastbank]

the lee enfield may not be the best, but its way ahead of the second one. good sturdy sights, enough power, 10 round magizine(stripper clips or quick magizine change), replaceable bolt heads (head space fixed in one minute in the field), replacement butt stocks for lenth and over all very easy to mantain in battle field conditions. you might thing i like enfields and you would be right. eastbank.