Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Best Brush Gun

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by ds92, Nov 22, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. ds92

    ds92 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    218
    Location:
    CT
    Hi everybody,
    I have been confounded in my recent quest to find a good brush gun. I live in the northeast, most of my hunting will be done in brush with probably the longest shot at 200 yards. Iron sights are a must, and the gun will probably perform double (or triple) duty on coyotes and deer later on as well as target shooting. The cheaper the better but I'm willing to spend more money if thats what it takes. i dont have any specific calibers in mind but i liked the looks of 25-06 ballistics. Any suggestions? i mean ANY. i'm literally stumped. i've never had a period of time like this where i wasnt lusting after one gun or another!

    ANY advice is appreciated!
     
  2. gvnwst

    gvnwst Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    2,614
    Location:
    Somewhere.........
    A light rifle in .243, savage, maybe a CZ.... (i actually don't know if CZ makes a .243) Better bullets are avaliable for target shooting, it is way good enough for deer, out to 500yd, and it is still a good varmint cartridge.
     
  3. Shawnee

    Shawnee member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2006
    Messages:
    3,306
    Location:
    Along "That Dark and Bloody River"
    Remington Model Seven in .243.

    :cool:
     
  4. JImbothefiveth

    JImbothefiveth Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2008
    Messages:
    2,711
    Location:
    Oklahio
    You're hunting deer and coyotes, and want to target shoot, right?

    It depends on what kind of target shooting, but I think an SKS may be just the thing. 7.62x39 plinker ammo is cheap, it has about the ballistics of the 30-30 round if you use proper(but more expensive) stuff, and the SKS is inexpensive and, from what I hear, reliable.

    Have you considered a 12 gauge? You can shoot clays, and with a change of barrels, you can shoot longer range slugs.
     
  5. paintballdude902

    paintballdude902 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Messages:
    2,872
    marlin guide gun is what id go for i like the .444 ones (idk if its a guide gun of just i lever i think guide gun but you cant go wrong the the .45-70 either)
     
  6. Chuck Dye

    Chuck Dye Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    938
    Location:
    Oregon-The wet side.
    In the literature and most of the forums I have read, a "brush gun" is, generally speaking, chambered to throw heavier, slower bullets that are expected (but not particularly proven) to be deflected less by brush than lighter, faster bullets. Flat shooting rounds like the .25-06 need not apply for the description. "Brush guns" are also written and spoken of as having shorter barrels so as to ease your passage through brush, again contradictory to .25-06 class rounds that come into their own with 24 and 26 inch barrels.

    Perhaps you could refine your search parameters a bit.
     
  7. moosehunt

    moosehunt Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    Messages:
    893
    If you are after a true brush gun, then .25-06 isn't where you ought to be heading. To bust brush, you want a big bullet, and speed isn't really your friend, like .45, or even bigger is better. I'm not a .45-70 fan, but it would be a good brush caliber. Anthing bigger puts you into major expense and/or wildcat country. I'd suggest either a lever action or a pump. Every step you take down from the .45 takes away from your brush desire. Course a .45-70 isn't generally thought of as a coyote cartridge either. A nice compromise might be a 760 or 7600 in .35 Whelen. You'd have to go used, but they have been produced in the past. A .24 or .25 caliber is not going to do real well in the brush--nor a .26 or .27 or .28, even a .30 is weak in brush. A pretty tuff item you're asking for--a brush gun also good for coyotes and target shooting! Kind of like asking for a sports car that will also sufice for a pickup.
     
  8. paintballdude902

    paintballdude902 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Messages:
    2,872
    also an m44, m38 or 91/59 mosin would be a decent choise cheap and plentiful
     
  9. trstafford

    trstafford Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2006
    Messages:
    295
    Location:
    (Olathe) Kansas City, KS
  10. thirdeagle

    thirdeagle Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    Messages:
    103
    Location:
    Omaha
    I've got an old Ted Williams .30-30 that I use as my "brush gun." But then again, I use it for just about everything.
     
  11. RonE

    RonE Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2007
    Messages:
    696
    Location:
    Rockport, Texas
    Keep in mind that a brush gun in any caliber will not shoot through brush and continue in a stright path, the bullet, heavy and slow or light/medium and fast will be deflected if it hits anything much larger than a broom straw. I would for brush hunting, that is moving through the brush choose something light weight, short and something that you won't mind a few scratches on. For deer hunting, .30 cal rifles offer the greatest selection of bullet weights.
     
  12. Maelstrom

    Maelstrom Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2008
    Messages:
    722
    Location:
    HERE
    When you say "brush gun" I'm thinking of a short, handy rifle in a large caliber such as .444 which resists being easily deflected by light foliage.

    A varmint gun for coyote is something else entirely.

    The .270 or .308 might be a good middle-of-the road choice.
     
  13. Cucumber

    Cucumber Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2008
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Republic, WA
    Chuck Dye and moosehunt are spot-on; the lighter, faster, flatter shooting rounds are the LAST thing you want in short-range, heavy brush. Even in purchasing the hard-to-find round-nose bullets in the .243, their relative light weight (100g) and velocity (~ 2800-2900 fps) make it one of the last "brush" guns you would want. If the brush is as dense as you say, I would find it extraordinary that you'd get the opportunity for a 200 yd shot? Mr. Dye also makes another good point about the shorter barrel; when negotiating heavy brush and thickets, you'll appreciate the 18-20" barrel as opposed to a 22-26". I Elk hunt in Western Washington near Mt. Saint Helens, and four years ago was ecstatic about taking my then brand new 300 Remington Ultra Mag (in a Browning A-bolt) over there. I still love the rifle, but I couldn't believe the difference in the 26" barrel snagging on branches and brush while carrying it on my shoulder via the sling.

    I'm a bit nostalgic and rely on my Dad's old model 94 30-30 when chasing Whitetails in our creek bottom (and yes, most of my time is spent chasing them, not stalking :)) ; plenty of oompff inside 150yds and accurate enough to make a killing shot. There are several other heavier calibers out there that would also be great. A friend of mine picked up a beautiful 45 long colt and swears by it for shooting anything in brush in the 100yd range.

    Good luck in your research, and stay away from 243, 6mm, 25-06, 270, etc. They have their place, but it's not in the brush.
     
  14. Mike U.

    Mike U. Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2007
    Messages:
    690
    Location:
    Oz, right next door to The Lollipop Guild HQ
    DAMN! That CZ Carbine is one handsome piece of wood-n-iron!
    That Turkish Walnut is some of the fanciest I've seen in a while. Beautiful!
     
  15. Chuck Dye

    Chuck Dye Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    938
    Location:
    Oregon-The wet side.
    um, er...

    Long ago and far away, when I was the worst kind of buff (read all the rags, had zilch for experience,) I read an article in one of the gun rags in which the author set up arrays of dowels (¼"?) at various positions in the flight path of a variety of bullets from the varmint end to the "brush gun" end of the spectrum. As I recall, ALL showed such deflection as to demonstrate that there is no such thing, ballistically, as a "brush gun." Go with what you already have or buy the rifle you want for convenience (or any other reason :))

    Hunting down the article is left to the student as an exercise.
     
  16. Shawnee

    Shawnee member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2006
    Messages:
    3,306
    Location:
    Along "That Dark and Bloody River"
    Reality: Caliber has nothing to do with whether a rifle is a good "brush gun".

    Nada. Nil. Zero. Zip. Nothing. No Way Jose. Nope. Not AT ALL.

    While "Chuck Dye" is correct that a .25/06 (and some other calibers) "doesn't come into its' own without a long barrel" - calibers like the .25/06 fired from 19" barrels will still slay deer all day long at 200yds. and certainly at 50yds. For that matter, the .22 Hornet is every single bit as good a "brush gun" caliber as a .45/70 - because as long as it is sufficient to dispatch the quarry - caliber simply does not matter. Period.

    Reality: A good firearm for "brush" is: short, light, and unscoped (so it can be easily carried in one hand). Period.

    Reality: there are very, very few rifles that make even decent "brush guns". If you really want a "good brush gun" you need a handgun.

    An Tha's a Fac, Jac !;)

    :cool:
     
  17. Caimlas

    Caimlas Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,690
    Location:
    SD
    +1 vote for the CZ 527 Carbine! I'd love one of those (in fact, it's #3 on my list after a CZ75 and 1911).

    Personally, I'd pick something in either 7.62x39 or .30-30. IMO, you're basically looking for an intermediate cartridge on a carbine platform that you wouldn't mind getting beaten up (due to the whole 'brush' thing). This leaves you with several options:

    * .30-30 lever action. I'd go for a Marlin (can be had for about $250 if you look around) - no significantly appreciable difference between them and a Winchester, IMO.
    * SKS, preferably not the Yugo which has a 22" barrel and heavier milled receiver. Think (unfortunately): Chinese. Bonus points if you can find a paratrooper model.
    * the above mentioned CZ 527 (I intend to et one of these myself sooner than later... *drool*)
    * Ruger makes a similar weapon to the CZ 527, but their site is currently down and I can't check. I think it's only available in larger calibers, though.
    * You could probably even go for an AK, if you wish - just be sure to use a 5rd magazine (though that might depend on your state laws - NFI what those are, you'd have to check).

    Might be others out there, but that's what I'm aware of.

    My personal opinion is that you'd be hard pressed to find a nicer shooting, cleaner fitting (to itself and to you) rifle than a CZ for less than twice as much. a .30-30 lever can come a close second - very natural ergonomics for hasty shooting.

    Whatever you do, don't scope what you get unless it's a scout scope or red dot.

    As for the person who says stay away from the .270 (I presume winchester)... I've got to disagree. That's a good intermediate cartridge and will do the job (you're talking about a 130-150gr bullet, which is enough to push through twigs and still hit target @ 200yds, more or less). I think it's a bit too powerful, to be honest. It's more push than you need, and in a short, light rifle, it's going to be very unpleasant to shoot (ask me how I know) and throw out a massive fireball.
     
  18. goon

    goon Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2003
    Messages:
    7,251
    FWIW, shooting through brush with anything is a bad idea.
    People think that the .35 Remington or .45-70 can reliably penetrate brush but the truth is that even if your bullet does make it through it will probably start tumbling right after that and lose accuracy. It might deviate from where you wanted to go or it might hit your deer sideways and result in an injured animal.
    It's a much better idea to get close and shoot through "holes" in the brush.
    So if you want a .25'06, I'd say get a fairly light one with a relatively short barrel. Put a low power scope on it and place your shots where you want them.
    Another option I'm fond of is the old 30-30.
    The CZ-527 in 7.62x39 his a handy little rifle too but I don't know how big the deer get in CT. Hunting them with that round in your area may be pushing the upper limits of what the cartridge should be use for. You'll have to make that call.
     
  19. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2007
    Messages:
    10,091
    Location:
    Georgia
    The idea of using a large slow bullet to get through brush is an old myth that will not die. Any bullet that hits twigs and limbs will deflect and possibly break up before hitting the target. A good argument can be made that the larger diameter bullets with more lead exposed are easier to deflect than smaller pointed bullets.

    I hunt in some of the tightest cover anywhere and believe the best approach is to avoid brush. Most any caliber will do, but I want a rifle that is literally a tackdriver at 50 yards so I can shoot through tiny openings in the brush. If it will not hit a dime at 50 yards every time I am not interested. I use a low powered scope to allow me to take advantage of the limited light in the deep woods right at dawn and dusk. I occasionally get shots at up to 200 yards but zero at 50 and know where my bullet will hit at the longer ranges. With cartridges such as the .308 and 30-06 I am still less than 4 inches low and know I can make shots at 200 if necessary. Most people sight in to be slightly high at 100 so they will be only slightly low at longer ranges. If I felt I was likely to get longer shots I would too. I am far more likely to get a shot at 15 yards than 150.
     
  20. LemmyCaution

    LemmyCaution Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    890
    I'd go for the Savage 10FCM. 20" barrel, .308win, excellent iron sights, light weight, synthetic stock, forward optics mount for a red dot or scout scope, if desired.
     
  21. woof

    woof Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,571
    Location:
    central Ohio
    You would take a shot at 200 yds with iron sights?
     
  22. natescout

    natescout Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2008
    Messages:
    265
    Location:
    prescott, AZ
    how about a marlin lever gun in .308 ,with the lever revolution ammo it could be the perfect brush gun ?
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2008
  23. RKellogg

    RKellogg Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2006
    Messages:
    272
    Location:
    New York
    natescout You beat me to it . I was going to say 308 in a BLR .
     
  24. JustsayMo

    JustsayMo Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Messages:
    1,446
    Location:
    the Evergreen State
    One advantage to to big slow bullets, especially when hunting in thick cover (not shooting through thick cover) is the two big holes it leaves in critters. If tracking is required and so far I have not had to track anything since I converted from skinny fast bullets and that includes a Black Bear and an Elk. The Bear took one through the shoulder smashed bones and exited the opposite side. A nice straight wound channel roughly twice the size of the bullet diameter (.459"). The bullet used was a hard-cast Beartooth Pile Driver jr and it was jogging along at a mere 1400 fps or so out of my Guide Gun.

    Neither the bear or the Elk left the scene and those that witnessed the shots described the performance as "devastating."

    On game in heavy brush exit wounds are good. I've seen both bears and Elk absorb hits from 30-06 and 300 win mag and take off like they weren't hit. My BIL lost a Bear last year because we just couldn't find enough blood despite a close range 30-06 hit.
     
  25. paintballdude902

    paintballdude902 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Messages:
    2,872
    i like to go with big calibers because it leaves room for error you hit a deer in the vitals with a .22 it will die but you it it with a .45-70 it leaves room for error with the large amount of energy it delivers

    this error is important to think about in brush since you may not get a clean shot

    mo

    i lost a bear i hit in the shoulder with a 150gr .30-30 at 30 yards last weekend and it was the second hit i put into it the first one was at 15ft!!!
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page