Dragonboy
Member
I'm sure this has been beaten to death,:banghead: but what's a good rifle caliber to use as a survival round? preferably something that's capable of taking down an animal up to the size of a mature elk.
best caliber for a survival gun?
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ChristopherG
Member
When you suspect that a topic has been done to death, the best way to find out is to Search. I like to use the 'thread title' search, with a term like 'survival', limited to the 'rifle' forum.
http://www.thehighroad.org/search.php?searchid=4295617
By suggesting searching, I'm not implying that you shouldn't ask questions; just suggesting a way to do some background reading so they're more focused.
There are a boatload of rifle calibers that meet your only stated criterion. I could suggest one (30-06), but my suggestion would be more potentially helpful if you told us something like: surviving what? Where? And for how long?
http://www.thehighroad.org/search.php?searchid=4295617
By suggesting searching, I'm not implying that you shouldn't ask questions; just suggesting a way to do some background reading so they're more focused.
There are a boatload of rifle calibers that meet your only stated criterion. I could suggest one (30-06), but my suggestion would be more potentially helpful if you told us something like: surviving what? Where? And for how long?
mr.trooper
Member
anything that powerful will vaporize an animal smaller than a white tail, and even the white tail will loose meat.
There is no one caliber that can do everything.
There is no one caliber that can do everything.
rangerruck
Member
22lr is the decided king of the survival rounds. You will have to get close, you will have to put it in their neck. it will kill all small stuff plenty easy. you can carry about 1 zillion rounds....
Schleprok62
Member
Only a zillion??? I thought it was a GAzillion?!?!
I agree that there's no "universal caliber... The .22LR is a great round for small stuff but would take more than a couple of well placed shots to drop an adult elk, I would think. I was thinking in the .243/6mm range... small enough you won't vaporize a wabbit... but big enough to get good critical penetration in large game.
But again, I agree there is no one caliber to rule them all...
Joe Demko
Member
Where do you plan on being lost for so long that harvesting an elk will be key to your survival? If you are like most Americans, you are capable of going a good while without food and not starving to death.
Priorities when surviving are to stay warm/dry, adequately hydrated, and be conspicuous so the search and rescue people can find you. You ought to be able to carry enough stuff in a fanny pack to last that long.
You ever shot an elk? You know how much work is involved in getting from the "shot it" stage to the "eating it" stage? Especially when compared to something like a rabbit, squirrel, groundhog, or the like?
Priorities when surviving are to stay warm/dry, adequately hydrated, and be conspicuous so the search and rescue people can find you. You ought to be able to carry enough stuff in a fanny pack to last that long.
You ever shot an elk? You know how much work is involved in getting from the "shot it" stage to the "eating it" stage? Especially when compared to something like a rabbit, squirrel, groundhog, or the like?
ReadyontheRight
Member
.22 long rifle.
It's easier than any other cartridge to carry and store lots of rounds for continued survival.
It's easier than any other cartridge to carry and store lots of rounds for continued survival.
Dragonboy
Member
quite seriously, what happens if you shoot a bunny with a .308?
Dragonboy
Member
in response to the "what are you surviving"..........Zombies? Wackos? extended periods in the wilderness? I guess I'm looking for the ideal gun if everything goes south, but is there one? I guess not.....
rdoggsilva
Member
I would go with the 22lr, for all the reasons just stated.
The Tourist
member
I can only tell you what I did.
I bought a lever action stainless Marlin Guide Gun in 45-70. Components are everywhere, and slow speed slugs are easy to cast and size.
That cartridge has been killing everything since 1873, so I figured it must be a good choice.
I bought a lever action stainless Marlin Guide Gun in 45-70. Components are everywhere, and slow speed slugs are easy to cast and size.
That cartridge has been killing everything since 1873, so I figured it must be a good choice.
thatguy123
Member
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- Jul 26, 2007
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- 36
It will cease to exist on the sub-atomic level, unless it's a zombie bunny that tips the scales at 90lbs.
JackCrow
Member
Another vote for .22LR.
IMHO in most "survival" situations, should you actually need to hunt, you will be better off (and be more successful) going after small game.
IMHO in most "survival" situations, should you actually need to hunt, you will be better off (and be more successful) going after small game.
86thecat
Member
For bunnies 30-06 mil fmj will just punch a hole through and will be minute of bunny at reasonable range. There are reduced loads that can be used all the way down to grouse but may not shoot to point of aim of full power ammo. Might be worth carrying a few in the survival kit if you want a medium rifle.
I'm not a 45-70 guy but are those cartridges straight walled enough to load shot loads for close in small game?
I'm not a 45-70 guy but are those cartridges straight walled enough to load shot loads for close in small game?
ThomasT
Member
Okay this a story i don't tell. Once when walking through the woods i jumped a cottentail rabbit. I was carrying a 336 in 30-30 with 170 gr soft points.
Without thinking i swung on the rabbit and fired. I got a solid body hit. I blew the rabbit to pieces. The rabbit was a female and pregnant. There were baby rabbits laying on top of briar leaves. The rabbit was blown to bits and totaly inedible. A 308 will be far worse i suppose. Or maybe it couldn't be any worse.
I have been bothered by that kill for the last 20 years.
For a survival gun i don't think you will find it in one caliber. If your in an area that has a lot of large game a powerful center fire makes a lot of sense.
A 22 or 22 mag makes a lot of sense for everywhere else. A shotgun with a variaty of loads is a good choice also. The bottom line is that there will never be a one gun answer.
Without thinking i swung on the rabbit and fired. I got a solid body hit. I blew the rabbit to pieces. The rabbit was a female and pregnant. There were baby rabbits laying on top of briar leaves. The rabbit was blown to bits and totaly inedible. A 308 will be far worse i suppose. Or maybe it couldn't be any worse.
I have been bothered by that kill for the last 20 years.
For a survival gun i don't think you will find it in one caliber. If your in an area that has a lot of large game a powerful center fire makes a lot of sense.
A 22 or 22 mag makes a lot of sense for everywhere else. A shotgun with a variaty of loads is a good choice also. The bottom line is that there will never be a one gun answer.
Don't Tread On Me
Member
I disagree with the .22LR unless you live in a rural area.
For those in suburbia or an urban area ...every squirrel, rabbit and whatever else is going to be hunted out of existence in a real hurry. Birds that land nearby are your only hope. Not much at that. Just look at various times in European history during wars. Cats, dogs, rats ...then even humans are consumed.
Urban/Suburban survivalist cannot live off the land, nor will they be able to make it to rural lands. Someone owns those lands and they won't let you hunt them. That is a romantic notion. Even rural survival will be difficult. The whole mountain man image comes to mind. Sure, everyone is going to go hiking out there and take down that buck, bring it to the cabin and make it through the winter. If you have to hunt to eat, then that means whatever you are trying to survive is extremely severe and hunting isn't going to save you. Even the most hard core hunters today do not hunt like people did 150 years ago. They have every convenience. ATV's, driving out to those lands...if you haven't noticed, America is highly developed. There's a lot of "out in the middle of nowhere" still left, but it's also not very accessible either without a vehicle. Like I said, if you have to hunt for food, you probably won't have gas either to drive to where the game is.
The urban/suburban survivalist has only two sources by which to survive, and further discussion of that is not "High Road" ...
For those in suburbia or an urban area ...every squirrel, rabbit and whatever else is going to be hunted out of existence in a real hurry. Birds that land nearby are your only hope. Not much at that. Just look at various times in European history during wars. Cats, dogs, rats ...then even humans are consumed.
Urban/Suburban survivalist cannot live off the land, nor will they be able to make it to rural lands. Someone owns those lands and they won't let you hunt them. That is a romantic notion. Even rural survival will be difficult. The whole mountain man image comes to mind. Sure, everyone is going to go hiking out there and take down that buck, bring it to the cabin and make it through the winter
. If you have to hunt to eat, then that means whatever you are trying to survive is extremely severe and hunting isn't going to save you. Even the most hard core hunters today do not hunt like people did 150 years ago. They have every convenience. ATV's, driving out to those lands...if you haven't noticed, America is highly developed. There's a lot of "out in the middle of nowhere" still left, but it's also not very accessible either without a vehicle. Like I said, if you have to hunt for food, you probably won't have gas either to drive to where the game is.The urban/suburban survivalist has only two sources by which to survive, and further discussion of that is not "High Road" ...
RonE
Member
Survive what and survive where? When everything goes south? Mexico and Latin America will be crowded for a change.
I agree with the .22 long rifle for the choice of one gun. I would choose a single shot or clip fed bolt action rifle.
I agree with the .22 long rifle for the choice of one gun. I would choose a single shot or clip fed bolt action rifle.
ReadyontheRight
Member
No. There certainly is not "one". This question is silly. Unless, of course what you really mean is "WHAT ONE GUN SHOULD I BUY?". In which case the answer is, of course "buy a good .22 and then go from there. Ain't no 'one gun'".
For survival where you are either hunkering down in your home or escaping in a vehicle - You are not ever limited to just ONE caliber.
If it's "post-event-survival", I would want a potpourri of calibers and weapons platforms with me... .22 pistol, .22 carbine, .223 carbine, .308 carbine/rifle, 12ga shotgun, 30-30 carbine, 30-06 rifle, 9mm pistol, .45ACP pistol, .38/.357 pistol. Probably more. And I would pick up and trade as I went along.
Peel back through the weight of ammo if you do not have a vehicle and you have some need to travel. The .22 is king if you have to hump it...but I would still also carry the .45 sidearm with a few magazines and the .223 carbine with as much ammo as I could carry.
If it's "pre-event-survival" (i.e. flying an airplane) and you are toting a survival weapon while traveling and you have limited capacity for cargo...the .22 with a lot of ammo is a great choice, but I would probably also bring a good .223 or .308 rifle and a 1911 if I thought there was a possibility I was entering dangerous territory.
thebear101
Member
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The new charger ruger 22 with by pod and the tear drop clip (50 rounds), real mean looking
Humm another survival thread....
While I do enjoy these posts about what is needed to survive, that romanticized scenario of taking to the wild is pretty much just a fantasy, unless you all ready live there and I mean waaaay out there. If society comes to a sudden end we are going to be stuck right where we are, which will probably be our home pretty much. (So stock up on those can goods.)
If you are in a city like most of us.....well we are just SOL I'm afraid. The food will be gone in days, any edible game in the surrounding area, rabbits, pigeons, dogs, cats (ick
) will be gone in a couple weeks if that....and then.... well....... It gets ugly.
Any how back to the fantasy. I say .22lr, for a couple very practical reasons.
First, you can take a wide variety of game with a .22 anything from quail size bird to a deer. Besides, there are a lot more birds and bunnies than deer so a .22 would be MUCH more useful for hunting then a large cal. rifle.
Second, you can stock up (for less then 200 dollars) and carry literally thousands of rounds of .22. The carry part is important; cars are no more.
If you are careful 6 bricks of .22 ammo would last you a few YEARS.
That is kind of amazing when you think about it!
While I do enjoy these posts about what is needed to survive, that romanticized scenario of taking to the wild is pretty much just a fantasy, unless you all ready live there and I mean waaaay out there. If society comes to a sudden end we are going to be stuck right where we are, which will probably be our home pretty much. (So stock up on those can goods.
)If you are in a city like most of us.....well we are just SOL I'm afraid. The food will be gone in days, any edible game in the surrounding area, rabbits, pigeons, dogs, cats (ick
) will be gone in a couple weeks if that....and then.... well....... It gets ugly.Any how back to the fantasy.
I say .22lr, for a couple very practical reasons. First, you can take a wide variety of game with a .22 anything from quail size bird to a deer. Besides, there are a lot more birds and bunnies than deer so a .22 would be MUCH more useful for hunting then a large cal. rifle.
Second, you can stock up (for less then 200 dollars) and carry literally thousands of rounds of .22. The carry part is important; cars are no more.
If you are careful 6 bricks of .22 ammo would last you a few YEARS.
That is kind of amazing when you think about it!
Dragonboy
Member
that was my question.....what's a .22 goning to do to a deer? a human? a bear?????
Hey, branstorm I shoulda had earlier.........I'll take my bow.
Hey, branstorm I shoulda had earlier.........I'll take my bow.
ZeSpectre
Member
Wire noose traps for getting food
.357 Magnum rifle and pistol set for self defense
No it's not the best "do everything" answer but with a little skill that combination would carry you through almost any situation.
.357 Magnum rifle and pistol set for self defense
No it's not the best "do everything" answer but with a little skill that combination would carry you through almost any situation.
woad_yurt
Member
Speaking for myself, I would run like the wind from any .22 rifle that was aimed at me. A competent shooter with .22LR semi-auto rifle will probably drive off another human or two.
A .22 won't destroy your small game meat, either. As for larger-sized game, unless you had the perfect hit, you'd probably have to follow it for a while until it fell. Then, you'd have to process the thing and get it back to your dwelling, not an easy task.
They hunted everything with arrows for untold thousands of years and I think a .22 rifle trumps an arrow any day. And, like someone said above, .22LR ammo is very portable. You could probably feed your self for years with all of the ammo you could carry.
They do have single shot .22LR/.410 combo rifles around which may be perfect if you didn't expect any human aggressors. If you expect to have to defend yourself, however, a single shot is nowheres near as effective as a semi-auto. I'd use a tube-fed job as they usually hold more rounds than your standard .22 detachable magazine.
Ditto regarding wire snares.
For pure urban riot survival, however, I'd go with an SKS or something similar.
The above was all hypothetical, btw, as I don't foresee any complete, back-to-the-stone-age breakdown of society coming any time soon.
A .22 won't destroy your small game meat, either. As for larger-sized game, unless you had the perfect hit, you'd probably have to follow it for a while until it fell. Then, you'd have to process the thing and get it back to your dwelling, not an easy task.
They hunted everything with arrows for untold thousands of years and I think a .22 rifle trumps an arrow any day. And, like someone said above, .22LR ammo is very portable. You could probably feed your self for years with all of the ammo you could carry.
They do have single shot .22LR/.410 combo rifles around which may be perfect if you didn't expect any human aggressors. If you expect to have to defend yourself, however, a single shot is nowheres near as effective as a semi-auto. I'd use a tube-fed job as they usually hold more rounds than your standard .22 detachable magazine.
Ditto regarding wire snares.
For pure urban riot survival, however, I'd go with an SKS or something similar.
The above was all hypothetical, btw, as I don't foresee any complete, back-to-the-stone-age breakdown of society coming any time soon.
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