Bill to Ban Assault Weapons, High-Capacity Magazines Hours After House Dems Pass Gun Control Bill

[BreechFace]

If and when the filibuster rule is removed...THEN it will be panic time.

What does it take to remove the filibuster rule, simple majority?

If simple majority, there really is no point to a filibuster rule, as the party in power can remove at their discretion, other than future consequences of not have filibuster when political winds change and that party in power is out of power and needs the filibuster.

In other words what is to prevent the Dems to remove the filibuster rule, pass legislation on key liberal policies then in turn before political winds change, reinstate the filibuster before mid-terms?

 

[Old Dog]

No one's panicking yet, but we should not wait until panic time to act.

Trying to predict who in Congress will oppose this bill is fruitless. No matter what, we'll always end up surprised. But the margins now are too narrow for us to even be thinking about having to use the filibuster or which Dems will not support the bill.

This is simply a test by one party, hoisting a flag to test which way the wind is blowing. But we already know.

 

[Sistema1927]

The enemies of freedom are emboldened and not about to let the crisis of an "armed insurrection" go to waste. Never mind that they have manufactured this crisis out of whole cloth while they hole up behind fences and the National Guard. "We the People" is now "We will tell the people what is good for them".

 

[Riomouse911]

the problem I have found with friends of the left is they dont care about the facts or even if you are willing to debate compromises. they want the full 9 yrds and on top of that use the "think of the children, you nazi biggot" (yes I have someone use that when debating with them about gun control.

I had that slur thrown at me once, too. I responded that the Nazi party were fervent gun control advocates who disarmed their populace when they took power. How did that work out for our Jewish friends again?
The arguer stopped, sputtered and quit.
Sometimes facts do hurt.

My Congressman is one of the few R from Ca who don’t toe the gun control line, that’s why he gets my votes.

Join a pro gun group!!

Stay safe.

 

[herrwalther]

Before we all panic, we should remember that the filibuster in the Senate is still there. It still takes 60 votes to even move a bill out of committee.

48 Democrats in the Senate and 2 Independents that toe the D party line. Meaning they only need 10 Republicans to vote in favor of Feinstein's ban. And there are enough RINOs in the Senate to do that. We cannot rely on the "safety" of the Senate to stop gun control madness at this point.

 

[gyp_c2]

I think they are going to try and avoid going to committee...
Straight to a vote?

 

[illinoisburt]

Reading through the list of exempted firearms I am struck by just how many there do not meet the definitions which were outlined. The language is clear it is the ban new sales of a class of semi-automatic firearms fed from detachable magazines. Most of the listed exemptions are for bolt, lever, and slide action rifles and shotguns. I understand that may be to build support by pointing out all the guns people are granted permission to keep but still begs the question of why they are listed in the first place.

 

[Lennyjoe]

So it appears that the grandfather clause remained from the last bill.


States Code, is amended—
(1) by inserting after subsection (u) the following:
‘‘(v)(1) It shall be unlawful for a person to import, sell, manufacture, transfer, or possess, in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce, a semiautomatic assault weapon.
‘‘(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to the possession, sale, or transfer of any semiautomatic assault weapon oth- erwise lawfully possessed under Federal law on the date of enactment of the Assault Weapons Ban of 2021.

 

[BreechFace]

I hate reading legal briefs, since this is going to be a big topic, figured I would at least get a reference to pages of where things can be found in this bill.

Anyone that wants to peruse the bill key points are:

Defining "semiautomatic assault weapon" (starting on page 2, line 21)

A. Rifle with detachable magazine (page 2, lines 24 through page 3, line 12)

-This reads like California's Assault Weapons labels based on features​

B. Rifle with fixed magazine (page 3, lines 13-17)

-notable exemption tubular magazine operating only with 22 caliber rimfire ammunition (so 17hmr would be out of the question?)​

C. Items "accelerating rate of fire" (page 3, lines 18-22)
D. Semi-auto Pistols with detachable magazine (page 3, line 23 through page 4, line 13)

-This reads similar to "1a" above on labels based on features​

E. Semi-auto Pistols with fixed magazine (page 4, lines 14-16)

-Capacity of fixed magazine must be 10 cartridges or under​

F. Semi-auto Shotguns (page 4, line 17 through page 5, line 8)

-Labels all based on features such as 1a and 1d above​

G. Shotgun with revolving cylinder (page
H. List of delineated rifles, including copies, duplicates, variants or altered facsimiles (page 5, line 6 through page 10, line 4)
I. List of delineated pistols, including copies, duplicates, variants or altered facsimiles (page 10, line 5 through page
J. List of delineated shotguns, including copies, duplicates, variants or altered facsimiles (page 12, line 15 through page 13, line 8)
K. Belt-fed semi-autos (page 13, lines 9-10)

-Label's all belt fed semi-autos​

L. Parts associated with firearms listed above "a, b, c, d, e, f, g" that can be assembled
M. Frame or receiver of a rifle or shotgun in "a, b, c, f, g, h, j, k"
​

Defining the following terms (relevant to defining "semiautomatic assault weapons" based on features):

-"Large capacity ammunition feeding device" (page 13, line 17 through page 44, line 3)

-includes magazine, belt, drum, feed strip
-further defined as of having the ability of more than 10 rounds
-exludes tubular magazine for 22 caliber rimfire only​

-"Barrel shroud" (page 14, line 7-17)
-"Detachable magazine" (page 14, line 18-20)
-"Fixed magazine" (page 14, line 21-23)
-"Folding, Telescoping or Detachable Stock" (page 14, line 24 through page 15, line 3)
-"Forward Grip" (page 15, lines 4-5)
-"Grenade Launcher" (page 15, lines 6-8)
-"Permanently inoperable" (page 15, lines 9-12)
-"Pistol Grip" (page 15, lines 13-15)
-"Threaded Barrel" (page 16-19)
-"Qualified law enforcement officer" (page 15, lines 20-21)
-"Grandfathered semiautomatic assault weapon" (page 15, line 22 through page 16, line 2)
-"Belt-fed semiautomatic firearm" (page 16, lines 3-11)
​

Restrictions on "Assault Weapons" and "Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Devices" (amending Section 922 of title 18, USC)

A. Statement it is unlawful to import, sell manufacture, transfer, or possess, in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce, a "semiautomatic assault weapon" (page 16, lines 18-21)

1. Shall not apply statements below:

1a. Possession, sale or transfer of any "semiautomatic assault weapon otherwise lawfully possessed under Federal law on the date of enactment of the "Assault Weapons Ban of 2021" (page 16, lines 22-25)
1b. Manual operated by bolt, pump, lever or slide action (page 17, lines 3-4)
1c. Firearms rendered permanently inoperable (page 17, line 5)
1d. Antique firearms, as defined in section 921 of this title (page 17, lines 7-8)
1e. Person groups not subject to restrictions (page 17, line 10 through page 22, line 19)​

B. Secure Storage or Safety Device Requirement for grandfathered semiautomatic assault weapons

1. Accessible to a prohibited induvidual (page 22, line 21 through page 23, line 14)​

C. Serialization, Identification and Dating "semiautomatic assault weapons" manufactured after the date of enactment of "Assault Weapons Ban of 2021" (page 23, lines 15-24)
D. Serialization, Identification and Dating of "large capacity ammunition feeding devices" (page 24, lines 1-11)
E. Seizure and Forefeiture of large capacity ammunition feeding devices (page 24, line 12 through page 25, line 7)

1. Above is amending verbiage into Section 924 of title 18 of USC​

F. Amending Section 922 of Title 18 of USC, specifically "Appendix A - Firearms Exempted by the Assault Weapons Ban of 2017"

1. Adds a list of firearm exemptions
​

Background checks for Transfers of Grandfathered Semiautomatic Assault Weapons (page 121, line 14 through page 124, line 13)

A. 90 days after the date of enactment of the Assault Weapons Ban of 2021, it will be unlawful for any person not licensed under this chapter to transfer a grandfathered semiautomatic assault weapon (page 122, lines 7-20)
B. The above does not apply to a "temporary transfer of possession" (page 122, line 21 through page 123 line 13)

1. Reasons for temporary transfer of possession such as participating in target shooting in a licensed target facility or established range

1a. Requirements needing to be met:

-Grandfathered semiautomatic assault weapon is, at all times, kept within the premises of the target facility or range (page 123, lines 1-3)
-Transferee is not known to be prohibited from possessing or receiving a grandfathered semiautomatic assault weapon (page 123, lines 4-6)​

2. Term "transfer" is defined (page 123, lines 7-13)
​

Buy-Back Programs for Semiautomatic assault weapons (page 124, line 14 through page 125, line 3)

Severability Clause (page 125, lines 4-11)

A. States that if any provision, amendment or application of such provision or amendment to any person or circumstance is held to be unconsitutional, the remainder of the "Assault Weapons Ban of 2021" will remain in effect.

​

​

 

[Lennyjoe]

d) SEIZURE AND FORFEITURE OF LARGE CAPACITY
13 AMMUNITION FEEDING DEVICES.—Subsection (d) of sec-
14 tion 924 of title 18, United States Code, is amended—
15 (1) in paragraph (1)—
16 (A) by inserting ‘‘or large capacity ammu-
17 nition feeding device’’ after ‘‘firearm or ammu-
18 nition’’ each time it appears;
19 (B) by inserting ‘‘or large capacity ammu-
20 nition feeding device’’ after ‘‘firearms or ammu-
21 nition’’ each time it appears; and
22 (C) by striking ‘‘or (k)’’ and inserting

18 USC 924, Subsection (d). https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/924

 

[Dudedog]

Other than the whole thing makes me some of the things that stand out on first glace

‘‘(37) The term ‘large capacity ammunition feeding 18 device’—

‘‘(A) means a magazine, belt, drum, feed strip, or similar device, including any such device joined or coupled with another in any manner, that has an overall capacity of, or that can be readily restored, changed, or converted to accept, more than 10 rounds of ammunition; and

changed or converted......

‘‘(45) The term ‘pistol grip’ means a grip, a thumb- hole stock or Thordsen-type grip or stock, or any other characteristic that can function as a grip

So it appears the Thordsen stocks that were ok in CA (and possibly other places that ban a normal AR15 pistol grip are now on the list of evil things

Sniper Bolt Action


‘‘Blaser R8 Professional ‘‘Blaser R84 Bolt-Action Rifle ‘‘Blaser R93 Bolt Action Rifle ‘‘BRNO 537 Sporter Bolt-Action Rifle ‘‘BRNO ZKB 527 Fox Bolt-Action Rifle ‘‘BRNO ZKK 600, 601, 602 Bolt-Action Rifles ‘‘Brown Precision Company Bolt Action Sporter ‘‘Browning A-Bolt Gold Medallion ‘‘Browning A-Bolt Left Hand 1‘‘Browning A-Bolt Micro Medallion ‘‘Browning A-Bolt Rifle ‘‘Browning A-Bolt Short Action ‘‘Browning A-Bolt Stainless Stalker

…(lots of bolt action rifles listed here)

A new category(?) "Sniper Bolt Action"
No doubt then next thing on a coming ban list

Still reading all 125 pages and of course then you have to find the section being changed someplace else to try to figure out what it really does

 

[swg1]

Facts mean nothing to the representatives and senators from my region. Writing them means I get to add to my stack of condescending "mother-knows-best " replies from them. Best to try and inform those about me and hope they learn votes have consequences.

 

[Harriw]

Wow... Looks like they learned some lessons from previous bills. Based on the "in" and "out" list, it looks like they're still trying to ban "things that look scary!!!!," but are getting better at wording things to make it harder to get around. A few things that stand out to me:

Looking through the "in" and "out" list....

A "Ruger Mini 14" is still NOT an "assault weapon (appears on the exempt list)"..... but ‘‘(xix) Sturm, Ruger & Co. Mini-14 Tac6 tical Rifle M–14/20CF" is (specifically listed in the "assault weapon" list).​

A Ruger PC9 and a Marlin Model 9 Camp carbine are NOT "assault weapons"..... but a Beretta CX4 Storm and a Hi-Point Carbine are.​

(i) has the capacity to utilize a magazine that is not a fixed magazine;

Being from NY, we're quite used to being able to get around these laws by pinning the magazine on an AR, etc. The way this is written, I'm not sure that's still the case.

‘‘(L) Any combination of parts from which a firearm described in subparagraphs (A) through (K) can be assembled. ‘‘(M) The frame or receiver of a rifle or shot gun described in subparagraph (A), (B), (C), (F), 16 (G), (H), (J), or (K).

This sounds downright scary... Does this mean if you have a "NY compliant" MSR with no "scary" features, Thordsen stock, etc., and also have a 2nd MSR with a pinned magazine, you're in trouble because you have the parts in your possession to create an "assault weapon?"

That doesn't seem to matter though, as a Thordsen stock is specifically called out as no-good:

‘‘(45) The term ‘pistol grip’ means a grip, a thumb hole stock or Thordsen-type grip or stock, or any other characteristic that can function as a grip.

That's quite strange, as there's absolutely no difference between a Thordsen stock and traditional synthetic stock.

Finally... What does this mean for folks that have extra lowers lying around? Do you need to get yourself a parts kit and an upper to snap onto it before the effective date? Or can we continue buying and swapping out uppers as we please?

 

[GEM]

Do folks remember about what Robert said - discuss the bill and just don't complain. Such deleted.

 

[FROGO207]

This forum is as close to social media as I care to get. No Face Off, Tweet It, or Insane grammar for me. One to one in person or an email and snail mail to my representatives stating my position is what I will do for better or worse.

 

[DustyGmt]

The language is clear it is the ban new sales of a class of semi-automatic firearms fed from detachable magazines. Most of the listed exemptions are for bolt, lever, and slide action rifles and shotguns.

I feel like a demonstration is in order, like all the legislators in favor of banning a certain type of firearm should attend a demonstration that would highlight just how arbitrary and misinformed their thinking is. Somebody who is an unbiased expert should have an array of firearms to field an exercise to display just how lethal the guns on their "exempted list" can be and that the only reason EBR's are primarily used is because of the sensationalism surrounding them due to their own promotion. I would like them to see just how much hell can be raised by a determined man with gampy's ol pump action 12ga, or perhaps a levergun or even a bolt gun.

It's always amazed me how after a tragedy the gun becomes the story. It's so undignified and honestly it seems disrespectful to the deceased. It's a gun, of course it was really deadly. Bullets come out the front and it don't matter where it was bought or if it has a shoulder thing that goes up.....

 

[GEM]

That would lead to these guns being banned also. The precedent is clear in the Australian bans that expanded to many other types of rifles and shotguns. Also, the Mini-14s might escape but other countries are banning them, Canada and Norway, as they were used in rampages.

Think about this:

1. These guns are dangerous so ban them.
2. Wait, these other guns are just as dangerous.
3. Thus, let us have all these dangerous guns.
4. No, thanks for pointing out that we should ban all of them.

This sort of thinking let to the MSR euphemism. Don't ban my sporting toys! Won't work.

 

[gyp_c2]

I understand that may be to build support by pointing out all the guns people are granted permission to keep but still begs the question of why they are listed in the first place.

Future shopping list...
They are after ALL THE GUNS...

This sort of thinking let to the MSR euphemism. Don't ban my sporting toys! Won't work.

Exactly.

 

[JERRY]

death by a thousand cuts, one gun type at a time until..... and no friend of the 2nd amendment will filibuster this.

 

[BlueHeelerFl]

the problem I have found with friends of the left is they dont care about the facts or even if you are willing to debate compromises. they want the full 9 yrds and on top of that use the "think of the children, you nazi biggot" (yes I have someone use that when debating with them about gun control.

Let me try again since I'm not sure why my post was deleted since it related directly to the above post, so let me dumb down my response.

I agree that it's hard to have a debate when the other side will not listen at all

 

[tarosean]

A new category(?) "Sniper Bolt Action"
No doubt then next thing on a coming ban list

While I wouldn't put anything past them...

I do believe the "Sniper Bolt Action" is a continuation of the guns name from above and not a "new" category.

 

[illinoisburt]

While I wouldn't put anything past them...

I do believe the "Sniper Bolt Action" is a continuation of the guns name from above and not a "new" category.

I agree that appears to simply be part of the name of the Blackheart rifle.

What bothers me is the fact that the bill names and categorizes a bunch of guns which have no relation to the items it is intended to regulate. I believe this makes it more likely these items will be subject to future bans. If a tragic crime happens using one the rally cry is 'fix the law' rather than 'we need a ban' which is much easier sell to the public. Much like other seemingly well intended regulations expansion and creep are common.

 

[GEM]

Want to close this thread. Continue not following Robert's direction. Infractions will and are being given. Rants are a waste of our time. Deleted more of the same.

 

[Tommygunn]

That would lead to these guns being banned also. The precedent is clear in the Australian bans that expanded to many other types of rifles and shotguns. Also, the Mini-14s might escape but other countries are banning them, Canada and Norway, as they were used in rampages.

Think about this:

1. These guns are dangerous so ban them.
2. Wait, these other guns are just as dangerous.
3. Thus, let us have all these dangerous guns.
4. No, thanks for pointing out that we should ban all of them.

This sort of thinking let to the MSR euphemism. Don't ban my sporting toys! Won't work.

Sometimes the truth will not "set you free." As a tactic for dealing with the antigun agenda, I think I get what you're saying. Were I to point out my .44-40 Winchester 1873 repro will put a hole in a person twice the diameter of a 5.56mm. from a AR-15 I wind up seeing them ban lever rifles, not simply accepting the truth; many guns are plenty lethal.

The Civil War saw more human casualties than our more modern wars fought with modern guns, and those who survived being shot with a .54 caliber bp muzzle loader often sustained horrific disfiguring and handicapping wounds.

ANTIGUNNER: "BAN THEM TOO!!"

B-b-but the Founding Fathers intended the people to be as well armed as the military to dissuade tyrants!!!

ANTIGUNNER: "WHITE SUPREMACIST MILITIA TYPES ARE A THREAT TO DEMOCRACY!!!"

Which is why I donate $$$$$ to the NRA, and GOA, and other pro 2A organizations.

I am a♧◇♡♤■□●⊙☆☆&*#@@ lousy evangelist.

 

[Dudedog]

Everybody please remember we are trying to discuss the bill, and/or what we can do about. not have rants or get political.
The Mods figured as a group we wouldn't be able to behave but are giving us a chance, lets prove it was worth them giving us a chance please.

Infractions will and are being given

All we need to do is behave, please try, it appears to be hard for some people however, sigh.....

I do believe the "Sniper Bolt Action" is a continuation of the guns name from above and not a "new" category.

Correct, sorry I read it wrong, the ident or lack of threw me off.