Black Powder: Roll my own or pay hazmat?

[NMRevolverGuy]

Hello,

Thanks in large part to advice on this forum, I very recently acquired my first black powder revolver; a Uberti repro of the 1851 Navy. Now the issue is that there is simply no feasible place for me to buy black powder from in person. There is a dealer on the other side of the state, but for the cost of driving I may as well pay hazmat. I know I can use substitutes, and I plan to, but I am the way I am. I like my bourbon neat, my razors straight, and by gawd if I am going to go to the trouble of shooting bp, I want it to be the genuine holy black.
So, for all you experienced folks here, is it worth it to order online, in which case I must order at least 5 pounds and pay hazmat, or would it be worth the time to get set up to make my own black powder? The process itself seems fairly straight forward, but I do wonder as to the safety of home brewing the stuff. If it makes any difference, I already reload and cast at home, so this does seem like a logical step to me.

Thanks in advance for the advice!

 

[Skinny 1950]

I don't know where you live but if you could find other BP users in your area...they will no doubt have powder and know where to get it for you, good people who may also have more guns to sell to you cause the '51 tends to lead to more guns.

 

[NMRevolverGuy]

Funny, I was just sittin' here earlier, watching an excellent Hikock45 video on the topic of bp revolvers, thinking that his 1860 looked awful purdy sitting next to his 1851.... which was also sitting next to an 1873..

 

[4v50 Gary]

you can try to find other people in the area and do a group buy of 25 lbs. Some places offer free shipping and it reduces the hazmat fee as it is shared.

The trouble with making is is quality control. During the American Revolution, patriotic newspapers printed instructions on how to make it. The trouble was everyone's batch was different quality and thus yielded inconsistent results.

 

[rodwha]

I like to do as much for myself if I can. I cast my own, punch my own wads, make Gatofeo's #1 lube, and cut my patches. Making BP is interesting, but if something goes wrong it can not only effect you, but your neighbors too.

I've been told that it's not as dangerous as many would have you believe as long as you take certain precautions. But then plants where it is commercially made have exploded a few times and these guys, no doubt, handled it as well as can be I'd think as they knew the dangers.

I couldn't live with myself if I took my family's lives or those of my neighbors, nor if I disfigured them or even destroyed what was theirs.

On the other hand I've considered that I could make very small batches that couldn't do too much if things did go badly, but how much is that?

Watching Brushhippie's videos and hearin his reports that his powder is even more energetic than Swiss is intriguing to say the least, though I feel that's plenty of power, I'm just on the fence, but with the consequences were something to go wrong always keeping me from trying despite having the stump remover just sitting (tried nitrating paper cartridges).

I buy from Grafs and there is no minimum order. I bought from them initially as BassPro didn't have 3F Triple 7 in stock for months, and I got tired of wasting my time. I found that ordering 3 lbs at a time negated the HazMat fee and gave me a sure way of not wasting my time.

I'm not sure how their Olde Eynsford prices may compare to any local prices, but I couldn't find it locally anyway, and I didn't want any of the standard powders that give slower velocities as I have mine with the intentions of hunting and have set a standard that most powders cannot achieve.

If I had the space and built a building properly I'd likely try making powder if I had someone knowledgable helping me the first few times.

 

[J-Bar]

If "NM" stands for New Mexico, here is a list of cowboy action shooting clubs in your state:

http://www.sassnet.com/clubs/Clubs_list.php?state=New Mexico

Check with these guys, usually a couple of black powder shooters at each club. They can tell you where to buy or sell you a can or two.

If you are in another state, just click on the state in the list on the right of the page to find other clubs.

I've never tried making my own blackpowder, and will do so only when civilization falls.

 

[swathdiver]

You can buy as little as 3lbs (where it makes sense) from Grafs & Sons and have it delivered to your door. Anything 10lbs and over it then pays to buy from Powder Inc. and save a few bucks.
Still cheaper than the fake stuff bought locally and well worth it for the smell and smoke IMO!

 

[g.willikers]

A friend used to make BP, back in our misspent youths.
It all goes well until it doesn't.
And it only takes one mistake.
He kind of rearranged his basement one day.
If memory serves, the mix was slightly too dry on a low humidity day.
Be careful.

 

[NMRevolverGuy]

Thanks for the advice all. I hadn't seen Graffs website previously. Think I'll just order from them

 

[NMRevolverGuy]

Also, NM does indeed stand for New Mexico, and thanks for the list! I have a feeling I'm going to enjoy this black powder stuff, so may hafta check out the social side of it.

 

[Officers'Wife]

My advice and worth every penny you pay for is that if you have someone around that is experienced in the manufacture of high energy mixtures ask him or her to let you apprentice yourself for a while.

BP is like any other flammable mixture, follow the rules, keep your mind on what you are doing and research the possible sources of auto-ignition then make allowances for it BP manufacture is as safe as houses. Allow yourself to be distracted, even for a moment and you are risking life and limb.

The story is told of one of my uncle's friends that decided to make powder after a rather nasty incident with a soon to be ex-wife. He was in the process of opening a ball mill of charcoal with his mind on his problems and out of reflex lit a cigarette. Needless to say he learned a valuable lesson on atomized carbon and open flames. Not to mention he didn't need to shave anymore and Mona Lisa eyebrows are not a fashion statement for men.

 

[Noz]

Just a note. If you should happen to find Cowboy Action Shooting, 5 # is not too much. I have my years supply in and I have 18# on hand.

 

[rodwha]

There's a fellow who goes by the name of Fly who makes his for fireworks and personal use who lives in AZ if I'm not mistaken. If you know of who I speak of he may be one to guide you on making it.

As OW mentioned, become an apprentice if you can.

 

[dickydalton]

Go to Gunslinger's Gulch and you shall find the info you need.

 

[ofitg]

FWIW, homemade "screened" powder works just fine in a percussion revolver, and the only special equipment you need is a $40 rock tumbler from Harbor Freight.

More advanced home-brewers make compressed BP for use in cartridges (which have case capacity constraints), but that requires a couple hundred dollars' worth of extra equipment.

 

[Officers'Wife]

FWIW, homemade "screened" powder works just fine in a percussion revolver, and the only special equipment you need is a $40 rock tumbler from Harbor Freight.

More advanced home-brewers make compressed BP for use in cartridges (which have case capacity constraints), but that requires a couple hundred dollars' worth of extra equipment.

Rock tumbler? How pedestrian! My uncle would ball mill by attaching a container made of PVC pipe to the axle of a homemade wind turbine. He ball milled charcoal by attaching a similar container to the front axles of a tractor while he was working with it.

Couple hundred dollars? You only need a couple tons of force, a hydraulic jack and a suitable die would work easily for less than $50. Any scrounger worth the name can come up with an old (hydraulic) cylinder and pump for between $100 to $150.

While the OMB gene is a disgrace, money is money!

 

[ofitg]

Couple hundred dollars? You only need a couple tons of force, a hydraulic jack and a suitable die would work easily for less than $50. Any scrounger worth the name can come up with an old (hydraulic) cylinder and pump for between $100 to $150.

Commercial manufacturers compress BP at approximately 1200 psi, for various lengths of time. The final powder density depends on these two variables. Pressure and time.

If a person wants consistent repeatable results, he will probably need some type of force gauge in addition to the hydraulic press (and the math skills to calculate the psi on his particular puck size).

The best homemade setup I've read about was described by "Cal50" in post #43 of this thread -

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...er-for-use-in-cartrides/page3&highlight=gurus

Again, I would reiterate that un-compressed powder can give satisfactory (Goex-like) results in a percussion revolver.

 

[medic15al]

I order my Olde Eynsford in 5# lots from Powder Inc.. Prices are with haz-mat fee included and are very reasonable. I find the Olde Eynsforde to be highly energetic and very clean. Very similar to the Swiss 3FG I tried once. This is in the 45 Colt SAA clone and 1860 Army caliber clone.

 

[4v50 Gary]

NMRevolverGuy - are you near Raton, NM? We're organizing a powder buy for the Wah Hah Toy Ya Muzzle Loading Club.

 

[CANNONMAN]

Pressing BP post corning creates disks or pellets called pucks and they may be used as such or reground in desired F value. This is not a step for the beginner nor is it necessary. That said, you are correct! if you really just gotta have that last little bit of cred in your BP this is the path. BUT! Two guys are competing in something where the difference between 1st and 2nd is highly miniscule. 1st is better than 2nd even though it is a difference measured by someone not competing. Do you have to come in first? Of course not, Unless you notice that the difference between 1st and 2nd in prize money is huge! Then, make pucks and grind away and without doubt I will come with a financial offering to purchase the new mouse trap. There is a member that goes by, "Brushippy" [?] Anyway, he has a site and thread here you may wish to view to see a non-commercial aspect of what is being discussed here.

 

[NMRevolverGuy]

Thanks again for all the great info! I did order some old eynsford. Couple of pounds, and that should keep me busy for a little bit. I think that while I burn through that, I'm going to do some further research, and try to churn out a small batch of my own. I also will look up some of the clubs mentioned here. It seems this state has a very strong community in cowboy action shooting, so I think it's high time I get in on the fun.