Marko Kloos
Moderator Emeritus
You were the one doing the equating. You called for turning Mecca into a hog farm, for example. Backpedal now all you want, but your prior statements about Muslims and Islam did read pretty inclusive to me.
BREAKING NEWS -- Possible Terrorist Attack in London
- Thread starter David
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I'm a long way from London, at least a long way in British terms, some may consider it fairly near.
Difficult to keep a class of adult learners concentrating today. Difficult to concentrate myself.
It's bad, but it could have been worse. Pleased that it seems so far that the emergency services have demonstrated the value of their training. Apparently one of the buses blew up right outside the British Medical Association's HQ. Doctors there helped, but the pictures show the outside of a building spattered in blood.
Difficult to keep a class of adult learners concentrating today. Difficult to concentrate myself.
It's bad, but it could have been worse. Pleased that it seems so far that the emergency services have demonstrated the value of their training. Apparently one of the buses blew up right outside the British Medical Association's HQ. Doctors there helped, but the pictures show the outside of a building spattered in blood.
Typhoon
Member
Preacherman's quote was:
I liked SMLE's response:
The frightening thing is, how many more people have to die before the world community takes this seriously?
BLAM! That good enough? No? Then how about this? BLAM! Good? No? BLAM! Next... BLAM! Done yet? No? BLAM!
Sigh...My thoughts and prayers go to the British folks. We stand with you, and my contributions are forthcoming to the first relief fund I encounter.
God Bless -
I liked SMLE's response:
The frightening thing is, how many more people have to die before the world community takes this seriously?
BLAM! That good enough? No? Then how about this? BLAM! Good? No? BLAM! Next... BLAM! Done yet? No? BLAM!
Sigh...My thoughts and prayers go to the British folks. We stand with you, and my contributions are forthcoming to the first relief fund I encounter.
God Bless -
effect
This will have an effect as it was designed too.
What it will be is yet to be seen, but I think for us it will be something like inspection or out right banning of carry on packages on subways. Maybe even all other forms of public transportation.
For them, every time they do something we are that much closer to them. Even so much as a cell phone call, weakens them, cuts there abilities.
I think it is a mistake to think there is any one big thing we can do to stop this sort of thing. It will take many changes to ever change these people. Unless we do some things differntly, and they change, this ???? will just go on and on
This will have an effect as it was designed too.
What it will be is yet to be seen, but I think for us it will be something like inspection or out right banning of carry on packages on subways. Maybe even all other forms of public transportation.
For them, every time they do something we are that much closer to them. Even so much as a cell phone call, weakens them, cuts there abilities.
I think it is a mistake to think there is any one big thing we can do to stop this sort of thing. It will take many changes to ever change these people. Unless we do some things differntly, and they change, this ???? will just go on and on
carebear
Member
You realize that if this actually was Al-Quaida and not a more or less local action, then this is (part of) their "next big thing" and they've had how long to prepare it for the G-8?
There's dozens of non-Islamic groups who were pulling this stuff off in the '70's. If it is Al-Quaida Inc., their reach appears to be getting shorter and in much easier grounds. Britain is comparatively easy to get gear into and they could have been planting sleepers for years.
This is a terrible act, and in some perverse way might be the beginning of waking the Euro's up to the fact this is a war on the West, not just the US.
It is however, pretty small potato's for the group that brought down the towers. I am feeling reinforced in my belief these guys may have shot their wad on 9/11, the rest is just the drawn-out failure militant Islam is so used to.
There's dozens of non-Islamic groups who were pulling this stuff off in the '70's. If it is Al-Quaida Inc., their reach appears to be getting shorter and in much easier grounds. Britain is comparatively easy to get gear into and they could have been planting sleepers for years.
This is a terrible act, and in some perverse way might be the beginning of waking the Euro's up to the fact this is a war on the West, not just the US.
It is however, pretty small potato's for the group that brought down the towers. I am feeling reinforced in my belief these guys may have shot their wad on 9/11, the rest is just the drawn-out failure militant Islam is so used to.
Don Gwinn
Moderator Emeritus
To the religion v religion caution. I don't care what religion anyone is, but I am still waiting for outrage from the Mosques over the 9/11 attacks.
Do people still say that? :banghead: I thought we were done with that one.
There has been condemnation on condemnation for the 9/11 hijackers emanating from mosques all over the world, especially in the U.S.A. Marko used to have a standard response he would copy and paste to people who said something like this, detailing some of these examples of "outrage from the mosques."
But none are so blind as them that refuse to see. You could have answered your question with Google in a fraction of a second. If you put in "Muslim condemnation 9/11" you get 127,000 results. On the first page at least, they all seem to be statements on various religous websites and forums from prominent Muslims denouncing the terrorists and terrorism.
Do people still say that? :banghead: I thought we were done with that one.
There has been condemnation on condemnation for the 9/11 hijackers emanating from mosques all over the world, especially in the U.S.A. Marko used to have a standard response he would copy and paste to people who said something like this, detailing some of these examples of "outrage from the mosques."
But none are so blind as them that refuse to see. You could have answered your question with Google in a fraction of a second. If you put in "Muslim condemnation 9/11" you get 127,000 results. On the first page at least, they all seem to be statements on various religous websites and forums from prominent Muslims denouncing the terrorists and terrorism.
Seminole
Member
Interesting reading on the Counterterrorism blog (http://counterterror.typepad.com/), where Steve Emerson pointed out that the attack coincides with the opening of the trial of Abu Hamza al-Masri, who is being tried for a number of things in Britain (including nine counts of solicitation to commit murder). Al-Masri's trial in Britain pre-empts U.S. attempts to extradite him on charges of establishing a terrorist-training camp in Oregon, involvement in hostage-taking in Yemen, and financing terrorism in Afghanistan. You can read about al-Masri's trial at http://news.corporate.findlaw.com/ap/o/51/07-05-2005/7f2b00098a14113a.html .
Vernal45
member
BBC and Fox news just reported that there is evidence suggesting that the bomb on the double decker bus was a homicide/suicide bomber.
This one makes me sick in a way that not even 9-11 did.
I was shocked, overwhelmed, angered by 9-11. It was an attack on my country.
But even though it happened in my country, I've never been to NYC.
But I've been to London.
I know what London looks like from street level. I know what London smells like in the different quarters. I know what London rush hour traffic sounds like.
I've been on those very trains. I've gotten on trains and off trains at Kings Cross station. I've got a "Mind the Gap" t-shirt in my closet right now.
And I've been on those trains and those stations with people that I love.......my wife, and one of our best friends who was living in Surrey at the time.
This one is very personal to me.
It's several hours later and I still feel physically sick over this one. I would, if I could, personally cut the bombers so deeply with my bowie knife that their instestines would spill onto their dirty, camel-humping feet.
Kill them all.
hillbilly
I was shocked, overwhelmed, angered by 9-11. It was an attack on my country.
But even though it happened in my country, I've never been to NYC.
But I've been to London.
I know what London looks like from street level. I know what London smells like in the different quarters. I know what London rush hour traffic sounds like.
I've been on those very trains. I've gotten on trains and off trains at Kings Cross station. I've got a "Mind the Gap" t-shirt in my closet right now.
And I've been on those trains and those stations with people that I love.......my wife, and one of our best friends who was living in Surrey at the time.
This one is very personal to me.
It's several hours later and I still feel physically sick over this one. I would, if I could, personally cut the bombers so deeply with my bowie knife that their instestines would spill onto their dirty, camel-humping feet.
Kill them all.
hillbilly
NineseveN
member
My thoughts and condolences for anyone in England right now. I wish I could say more, but what good are words at this moment?
Vernal45
member
What I dont understand, we have the technology, we have the strength to wipe these radical Islamic Terrorists off the face of the earth. The only thing we lack to do so is, balls. Seems the Terrorists have those.
We will not win this fighting it the way we are. There will be more attacks, here in the US, and abroad. That is a fact. Why, why cant we just.........never mind.
We will not win this fighting it the way we are. There will be more attacks, here in the US, and abroad. That is a fact. Why, why cant we just.........never mind.
Whew, we can all relax now.
"The United Nations Security Council is expected to pass a Special Resolution condemning the apparent terrorist attacks which occurred this morning in London. This according to an anonymous, high-ranking official at the organization."
Well folks, now that the UN is "expected" to denounce the "apparent" attacks, I , for one, feel a tremendous amount of relief.
After all, we all know that terrorists (especially those of the Islamic fundamentalist variety) are horrified at the prospect of prompting such a harsh response from the UN.
I think everything's gonna be OK........Right.
"The United Nations Security Council is expected to pass a Special Resolution condemning the apparent terrorist attacks which occurred this morning in London. This according to an anonymous, high-ranking official at the organization."
Well folks, now that the UN is "expected" to denounce the "apparent" attacks, I , for one, feel a tremendous amount of relief.
After all, we all know that terrorists (especially those of the Islamic fundamentalist variety) are horrified at the prospect of prompting such a harsh response from the UN.
I think everything's gonna be OK........Right.
Terrorism, no matter how hard you try, you just cant beat it.
Hillybilly, i know you are angry and such but the "camel-humping" comment and your "kill them all" attitude is unacceptable. You must remember that all races have there A-holes. It's just that in todays world, the muslim population is in the spot light.
Hillybilly, i know you are angry and such but the "camel-humping" comment and your "kill them all" attitude is unacceptable. You must remember that all races have there A-holes. It's just that in todays world, the muslim population is in the spot light.
NineseveN
member
With all due respect kal, I agree that racism or discriminatory sentiments are bad form, but you know, we didn't see African Americans bombing subways during the civil rights movement. We don't see illegal Mexican immigrants flying planes into buildings on their weay over the border, I don't see rampant uprising from japanese people running around cutting off heads because Hiroshima still glows in the dark during the summer months.
An a-hole is one thing, bombing subways, cutting peoples heads, flying planes into buidlings is not a-hole behavior. These terrorists are different from any threat we've ever faced. Even the Nazis had the decency to wear uniforms while they gassed the Jews. Pearl Harbor was a mlitary target. So say what you all will about comparisons, none apply here.
An a-hole is one thing, bombing subways, cutting peoples heads, flying planes into buidlings is not a-hole behavior. These terrorists are different from any threat we've ever faced. Even the Nazis had the decency to wear uniforms while they gassed the Jews. Pearl Harbor was a mlitary target. So say what you all will about comparisons, none apply here.
Omni04
Member
kal
i think when he said kill them all, he was referring to terrorists in general. I may be wrong however.
i think when he said kill them all, he was referring to terrorists in general. I may be wrong however.
Seminole
Member
On the topic of the reaction of mainstream Muslims, from http://www.isna.net/index.php?id=35&backPID=1&tt_news=220 :
Seminole
Member
Two unexploded bombs have been discovered, complete with timing devices.
http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/Investigation/story?id=918193
http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/Investigation/story?id=918193
chaim
Member
More on that theme:
http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-13382484,00.html
"MUSLIMS CONDEMN ATTACKS
Muslim groups across Britain condemned the terrorist bombings in London.
The Muslim Council of Britain said it "utterly condemns the perpetrators of what appears to be a series of co-ordinated attacks".
"These evil deeds makes victims of us all.
"The evil people who planned and carried out these series of explosions in London want to demoralise us as a nation and divide us as a people.
"All of us must unite in helping the police to capture these murderers..."
click the link for the rest of the article
Vernal45
member
By all means, please open your mosques, let them look around, question you. Please, help.
Flyboy
Member
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050707/ap_on_re_mi_ea/israel_britain_explosions_1
Heavy stuff. Looks like there may have been an (additional) ulterior motive here.
Kal---I will not retract any of my statements.
Every single member of every single fundamentalist, Wahhabist, sharia-worshipping organization and madrassah who belives that infidels need to be killed, who wants to return the world back to the year 800, are all, without exception, an bunch of camel-humping pig-dogs who need to be exterminated from the face of the earth.
Of course, if one is a Muslim who is NOT a fundamentalist, Wahhabist, sharia-worshipper, then one is not included in the category of camel-humping pig dogs, right?
But if one IS a fundamentalist, Wahhabist, sharia-worshipper who sees all unbelievers as infidels who need to be killed, then one is in the category of camel-humping pig-dogs.
Got it?
hillbilly
Every single member of every single fundamentalist, Wahhabist, sharia-worshipping organization and madrassah who belives that infidels need to be killed, who wants to return the world back to the year 800, are all, without exception, an bunch of camel-humping pig-dogs who need to be exterminated from the face of the earth.
Of course, if one is a Muslim who is NOT a fundamentalist, Wahhabist, sharia-worshipper, then one is not included in the category of camel-humping pig dogs, right?
But if one IS a fundamentalist, Wahhabist, sharia-worshipper who sees all unbelievers as infidels who need to be killed, then one is in the category of camel-humping pig-dogs.
Got it?
hillbilly
Kal--here's another example.
It's another story that would have been the lead all over the news today, if London had not been attacked
Ihab-al-Sherif was a Muslim. But he wasn't a fundamentalist, Wahabbist, sharia-worshipping Muslim.
Because he was a moderate Muslim who officially represented the government of Egypt, he was put into the orange jumpsuit and had his head sawn off with a big knife today in Iraq.
Of course, the folks who did the head sawing today have the exact same worldview, ideology, and values system as the folks who bombed London, who did 9-11, who murdered school kids in Beslan, who bombed Madrid, who have spread terror and death across the globe for the past thirty years.
And those are the folks who need to be taken out.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=aoTnrhBSQHiE
Zarqawi's Al-Qaeda Cell Says It Killed Egyptian Envoy (Update3)
July 7 (Bloomberg) -- An al-Qaeda-linked cell said today it had killed Egypt's envoy to Iraq, who was kidnapped five days ago in Baghdad. The Egyptian presidency confirmed the death of Ihab al- Sherif in a report carried by the official state news agency.
``We announce that the verdict of God almighty has been carried out on the ambassador of the infidels, the ambassador of Egypt,'' the al-Qaeda Organization in Iraq said. The group is headed by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi.
Al-Sherif, Egypt's first envoy to Iraq since the U.S. invasion of 2003, was seized in the capital's al-Mansour district. The 51-year-old diplomat was tried by an Islamic court and found guilty of apostasy, or being unfaithful to Islam, al- Zarqawi's cell said in a message yesterday.
``The ambassador of the infidels has confessed to information that showed that his regime is an infidel and which proved his ties to the Jews and the Crusaders,'' according to the message, which was signed by Abu Maysarah al-Iraqi, who identified himself as the group's media director.
The British Broadcasting Corp. said an accompanying video showed a blindfolded man who gave his name as Ihad al-Sherif, saying he had worked at Egyptian embassies in Iraq and Israel. No killing was shown, the BBC said.
Al-Sherif is the first head of a diplomatic mission to be kidnapped in Iraq. Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari last month urged Arab nations to send ambassadors to Iraq, and stressed the need for world leaders and lawmakers to visit the country.
In separate attacks July 5, Bahrain's Iraq envoy was wounded in an unsuccessful kidnapping attempt, and the Pakistani ambassador was fired upon, Agence France-Presse reported.
United Nations Secretary-General Kofi Annan ``condemns in the strongest terms'' the murder of al-Sherif, according to a statement released in New York. ``Such acts perpetrated by a few will not deter the commitment and resolve of the United Nations and the international community to help the Iraqi people in their transition towards a peaceful, democratic and prosperous Iraq,'' the statement said.
Egypt, the Arab League and Cairo's Al-Azhar Mosque condemned terrorist bombings in London today that killed at least 37 people, according to Egypt's official news service, Mena. A group calling itself the al-Qaeda Organization in Europe claimed responsibility for bombings.
Mohammed Sayed Tantawi, sheik of the mosque that's considered the highest seat of Sunni Muslim learning, said Islam rejects the killing of innocents, Mena reported.
Egyptian Foreign Minister Ahmed Aboul Gheit called the British Ambassador in Cairo by telephone to express Egypt's solidarity with Britain and condemn the terror attacks, MENA said, citing an unidentified foreign ministry spokesman.
It's another story that would have been the lead all over the news today, if London had not been attacked
Ihab-al-Sherif was a Muslim. But he wasn't a fundamentalist, Wahabbist, sharia-worshipping Muslim.
Because he was a moderate Muslim who officially represented the government of Egypt, he was put into the orange jumpsuit and had his head sawn off with a big knife today in Iraq.
Of course, the folks who did the head sawing today have the exact same worldview, ideology, and values system as the folks who bombed London, who did 9-11, who murdered school kids in Beslan, who bombed Madrid, who have spread terror and death across the globe for the past thirty years.
And those are the folks who need to be taken out.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=aoTnrhBSQHiE
Zarqawi's Al-Qaeda Cell Says It Killed Egyptian Envoy (Update3)
July 7 (Bloomberg) -- An al-Qaeda-linked cell said today it had killed Egypt's envoy to Iraq, who was kidnapped five days ago in Baghdad. The Egyptian presidency confirmed the death of Ihab al- Sherif in a report carried by the official state news agency.
``We announce that the verdict of God almighty has been carried out on the ambassador of the infidels, the ambassador of Egypt,'' the al-Qaeda Organization in Iraq said. The group is headed by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi.
Al-Sherif, Egypt's first envoy to Iraq since the U.S. invasion of 2003, was seized in the capital's al-Mansour district. The 51-year-old diplomat was tried by an Islamic court and found guilty of apostasy, or being unfaithful to Islam, al- Zarqawi's cell said in a message yesterday.
``The ambassador of the infidels has confessed to information that showed that his regime is an infidel and which proved his ties to the Jews and the Crusaders,'' according to the message, which was signed by Abu Maysarah al-Iraqi, who identified himself as the group's media director.
The British Broadcasting Corp. said an accompanying video showed a blindfolded man who gave his name as Ihad al-Sherif, saying he had worked at Egyptian embassies in Iraq and Israel. No killing was shown, the BBC said.
Al-Sherif is the first head of a diplomatic mission to be kidnapped in Iraq. Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari last month urged Arab nations to send ambassadors to Iraq, and stressed the need for world leaders and lawmakers to visit the country.
In separate attacks July 5, Bahrain's Iraq envoy was wounded in an unsuccessful kidnapping attempt, and the Pakistani ambassador was fired upon, Agence France-Presse reported.
United Nations Secretary-General Kofi Annan ``condemns in the strongest terms'' the murder of al-Sherif, according to a statement released in New York. ``Such acts perpetrated by a few will not deter the commitment and resolve of the United Nations and the international community to help the Iraqi people in their transition towards a peaceful, democratic and prosperous Iraq,'' the statement said.
Egypt, the Arab League and Cairo's Al-Azhar Mosque condemned terrorist bombings in London today that killed at least 37 people, according to Egypt's official news service, Mena. A group calling itself the al-Qaeda Organization in Europe claimed responsibility for bombings.
Mohammed Sayed Tantawi, sheik of the mosque that's considered the highest seat of Sunni Muslim learning, said Islam rejects the killing of innocents, Mena reported.
Egyptian Foreign Minister Ahmed Aboul Gheit called the British Ambassador in Cairo by telephone to express Egypt's solidarity with Britain and condemn the terror attacks, MENA said, citing an unidentified foreign ministry spokesman.
Monkeyleg
Member.
agricola, I have no doubt that you and your countrymen will stand against the terrorists, just as you did the Nazi's over sixty years ago. I wonder how New Yorkers or Chicagoans would have reacted to nightly bombing of their cities?
This should serve as a reminder to the majority of the population of the US who disapprove of the war on terror that such things don't just happen in Baghdad.
And, as for the "well, if we weren't in Iraq" crowd: the terrorists would have done this anyway. If not now, then a bit later.
This should serve as a reminder to the majority of the population of the US who disapprove of the war on terror that such things don't just happen in Baghdad.
And, as for the "well, if we weren't in Iraq" crowd: the terrorists would have done this anyway. If not now, then a bit later.
HillBilly, I never said to retract your statements.
Well since you put it like that, yes I GOT IT!
-----
You guys know what the problem is. The US seems to be "soft" on terrorists. If we were as brutal as they are, the terrorists might chill out a bit. Try nuking every mountain in Afghanistan and the entire muslim population will chill out. Try executing terrorists right in the middle of the street. Try mass executions, dumping pig remains on dead terrorists, spit all types of propaganda at them, etc. Try making our soldiers look RUTHLESS! Give them face cammo, dark sun glasses, anything to scare the living crap out of terrorists!
Got a little carried away there.
Well since you put it like that, yes I GOT IT!
-----
You guys know what the problem is. The US seems to be "soft" on terrorists. If we were as brutal as they are, the terrorists might chill out a bit. Try nuking every mountain in Afghanistan and the entire muslim population will chill out. Try executing terrorists right in the middle of the street. Try mass executions, dumping pig remains on dead terrorists, spit all types of propaganda at them, etc. Try making our soldiers look RUTHLESS! Give them face cammo, dark sun glasses, anything to scare the living crap out of terrorists!
Got a little carried away there.
Mongo the Mutterer
Member
Don Gwinn:
Did it Don, you are correct. Also ran it changing one word ... Muslim SUPPORT 9/11. 2,200,000 hits.
Do the math.
Did it Don, you are correct. Also ran it changing one word ... Muslim SUPPORT 9/11. 2,200,000 hits.
Do the math.
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