Bring Enough Gun!

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rbernie

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Went hog hunting on Thursday afternoon, and wound up with a bit more than I expected. :what:

I'm using the seeing 120lb to 200lb hogs on this one ranch that I hunt (~ 1600 acres, high-fenced with non-native deer thrown in if you can find 'em), so I took my 16" AR chambered in 7.62x39. I run handloads exclusively through this rifle; Sierra 125gr ProHunter bullets over AA1680 in Remington brass.

My normal drill is to arrive about midday, check in, drive the minivan to the back plot, and spend the first afternoon scouting around looking at stuff. The following AM is when I get serious, and if the gods smile on me by lunchtime on of the second day I'm skinning out and quartering a carcass or two. All hunting is done on foot.

The land that I hunt on this ranch is pretty well scrub so most shots are visibility-limited to around 50 yards; 200 yards would be a really long shot for this piece of ground and is possible only in a few places. I have a scoutified Marlin 336 in 35 Remington with me on this trip as well as the AR, but it seems like overkill for what I'm expecting to find and I decide leave it in the van in the role of backup gun.

So this past Thursday, I get there around 2PM and by 2:30 I'm in the field. There are TONS of plowed up areas where the hogs have just been tearing the ground up rooting - more hogs here than I can recall in the past, I think. Hmmm....

Almost immediately I'm beset by a 200lb hog; I hold my fire since I'm really not ready to be done yet! This hog is really quite aggressive and it's all I can do to disengage without firing. The trees on this ranch are really scrub - nothing climbable. I wind up trotting over half a mile just to get this boar off my back; it's like he's just begging to get shot. <sigh> I've never seen the hogs here act quite this aggressively; they usually prefer to run away instead of chasing me around. I also find that looking at an angry pig at arms-length distances through a scope (Sightron SII 2.5-8x) normally used for hunting between 50 and 150 yards can be very hard to do even if dialed down to 2.5x.

I decide to scout out a ravine on the far side of the property; the scrub below the ridge line on either side is usually a good spot to find deer or hogs bedding down for the day. I'm following some lightly-worn deer trails through the brush (not moving too slowly since I want to stir things up a bit, but not blundering about either) when I hear a bunch of snorting on the other side of an outcropping of rocks. I stop, step to the side of the trail, shoulder the AR, and do my best to pretend to be a tree. Up comes a pretty big hog (bigger than I've ever seen, anyway) snuffling along toward the crest of the ridge. He stops about 10 yards away, head to the ground in Condition White, just nosing around. I'm standing here, holding this shorty AR up to my shoulder, looking at the size of this hog, and feeling like Roy Scheider's character in Jaws - "We're gonna need a bigger boat". In my case, I'm really wishing that I could disengage and come back in the AM with the Marlin....

So here I stand for what seems like FOREVER, beaming little piggie thoughts to this hog to move along and let me get on with things, when he finally figures out that something smells out of the ordinary. Uh, that would be me. He looks up and stares at me for about thirty seconds and it seems as if he's ready to move along, but after a moment's indecision he evidently decides that he's not ready to back down. He grunts at me, and takes a slow step in my direction. I take one slow step back, and he follows. I can't keep walking backward too much, since the ground is very rocky and uneven. I also am not willing to turn my back on this guy. I take one final step back and click off the safety, and he stops and stands there. He turns to his right, broadside to me, as if to go the other way and I'm thinking that I'm almost clear. Ooops - no go. He grunts loudly and starts to turn back. Daggone it. I decide that there's no way out of this but forward, so I put the crosshairs just aft of his left shoulder and pull the trigger.

We're about 7 yards apart, and the first shot drops him on his left side. It hits solidly behind the left shoulder but evidently is deflected a bit by the ribs and winds up lodged in the hide just in front of the right shoulder. He struggles to get back up, and (presuming my rounds to be insufficient for a hog of this size) I fire two more shots. I have dim memories of this part - the adrenaline dump was more massive than anything that I've ever experienced in the past and I can only recall snippets of things. The second shot is a raking shot that ends up between the rear hams. He must have turned away at this point in the fracas; the third shot hits him as he falls again on his left side, entering at the base of his neck but not exiting. It looks like the last shot took the starch out of him - he lays there on his left side with his back toward me and I stand there waiting. I'm embarrassed to admit that I actually take the time to police up my brass while I wait this out before moving in - that Remington brass is EXPENSIVE, is all I can recall thinking...

After about three to four minutes, he starts gasping again and trying to get up. Crap - just my luck to run into the Black Knight of piggies. I circle around, keeping about seven to ten yards between us, and get to where I can see him more clearly. He's laying in front of me with his belly and his legs to me, but he's evidently shaking off whatever stun effect the third shot did to his spine. I suddenly realize that, at this close distance, the offset of the AR's sight plane from the barrel is causing my POI to be almost two inches off my POA. I must have missed the spine in my third shot, what with the sight offset and all of the movin' and thrashin' we were doing. He's heaving around and is almost to his feet again, so when he falls back down briefly and exposes his belly to me once again, I aim about a third of the way back between his front and rear legs, pick a spot about 2" above his centerline, and put a fourth shot right straight up his gut in the general direction of his spine. He grunts once, and lays back down for good. I stand there for a while, just staring at this pig and waiting for him to leap back up again. When it becomes clear that he's done for, I hike back out to the van and go drive back to the ranch house to get some help in getting him out.

I'm not good at estimating weight, but others on the ranch put this hog at around six feet long and around 500 lbs. We decide that we can't haul him out in one piece; he's just too big and we're too far from a clear trail or path. We take what meat we can (I wind up with about 100lbs of pork just from the boned-out hams and the backstrap) and leave the rest of the carcass where it lays for the other hogs to clean up.

I have never seen such gristle on an animal in my life - the padding around his ribcage was close to one inch thick. I also would not have believed, all things considered, how well the 7.62x39 softpoints did. Yes, I fired four shots. Yes, not a single round exited. But in all fairness, all rounds penetrated to the vitals, including the first shot that punched through both sides of the rib cage and the second shot that raked through his thoracic and abdominal cavities. The bullet from the first shot was recovered under the off-hide, and came back at 110.5gr in retained weight and .675" in expanded diameter. All in all, I'm impressed with the loading (given that it is what it is). But I'll not look to repeat this experience any time soon if I can avoid it....

Lessons?

  • Bring enough gun
  • 2.5x is still too much magnification for arms-length dueling with angry piggies
  • Bring enough gun
  • Having backup shots can be helpful
  • Bring enough gun

I had a couple of bad pictures taken with my cell phone's camera. I don't normally take pictures of the stuff I kill, but this one was worth noting. I also took a picture of the recovered bullet from the first shot. I'm reasonably convinced that this was a killing shot, but at the time it didn't seem prudent to take the the time to find out... Anyway - I had a good time and brought home some great meat and some interesting memories.


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If I lay down, I can hide behind this thing..

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This beast has a 50lb head..

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A job well done...
 
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Well described, sir! Must have been an "interesting" afternoon. I've also found the problem with variable scopes at close range . . . it's one reason why on a number of my "hog" guns, I've gone to a 1x4 or 1.5x5 variable, so that at the low end, it's no problem to get a decent sight picture at halitosis range, using both eyes.
 
Way to go, rbernie. By the picture, I would bet the hog is around 500 lbs. Big hogs can take a licking and do keep on ticking. I sure you also got the shakes after you realized he was finally down. I've had close calls and it has happened to me. Good shooting, good story, and good pics.
 
Rbernie,

Way to keep your cool and deliver the goods. I've known quite a few fellows in my life that woulda lost it and got themselves killed in that situation.

Regards,

Dave
 
Thanks, all, for the kind words. It *was* about as sporty as I'd care to get. The kids all think that it's 'REALLY COOL, DAD'. :)

I don't generally get buck fever, but I always get the shakes after I let loose the first shot - the adrenaline surge associated with being committed to a course of action, I guess. By the time I administered the coup de grace, the shakes were mostly gone. I was still pretty jumpy on the hike back to the van, though, and it took a solid couple of hours to feel 'right' again...

I had a 45ACP revolver in my right cargo pocket and one moonclip reload in the left cargo pocket, but it would have been no match for even a 7.62x39. So long as I had rounds in the AR, I was in pretty good shape. I carried a ten round magazine with eight in it and one in the pipe, just because I was concerned about getting cornered by a gaggle of pigs all by my lonesome. I've never before needed more than two shots on anything, and that second shot has only been needed once before. The idea of needing four rounds on a single critter would have sounded crazy to me just a week ago.

I suppose it could have gone badly, but there was no real thought of that at the time - just a split second of clarity as the hog began to turn back to me that said, 'This could get kinda bad if you don't take the initiative NOW'. So I did. That was probably a key moment. Everything else was pretty forgone, most likely...

PS: If you look at the pictures, you'll see that the bolt's back on the rifle but the mag's full. All I had to do was hit the bolt stop and I'd be ready to fire again. After this little adventure, I wasn't going back out there without a loaded rifle at hand, and I made sure that I recharged the magazine on the drive back from the ranch house... ;)
 
kill dem piggies!

Awesome post man. I am looking to do some pig hunting myself.

I am just curious about a couple of things...

Was this hunt on private land? If so how much did you have to pay?

I have seen alot of places advertising $500 a day hunts with a guide included.

(super expensive imo)

Anyone have any places in California where the pig hunting is decent? Preferably

on public land.
 
Whoa!

I got invited to hunt wild boar this year, where they USUALLY run about 200 lbs. And, believe it or not was seriously considering using an SKS. Semi-Auto with decent power (and a bayonet for backup:eek: ) However after reading your account, I think we'll be packing the old Model 8 Remington in .35 Remington...Or, I gotta finish my "Scout Rifle Project" in 8mm-06. Especially since we're limited to 5 rounds! Sounds like there's no such thing as "overkill" with pigs...
 
Was this hunt on private land? If so how much did you have to pay?
Ninety seven percent of Texas is private land, so around here you don't hunt if you don't do it on your land or somebody else's land. Texas also allows year-round hunting of non-native species, so there's quite an industry here that involves stocking land with exotics and selling 'guided hunt' packages. Some are better than others, most are too expensive for me.

Rather than do the guided hunt thing or get into a lease that would cost me $1500/year plus the labor to maintain it plus sharing it with fix other guys that I don't know, I hunt on a back lot of a 'Texas trophy exotic' ranch. They allow cheap folks like me to hunt without a guide on the back 'pasture'. It costs me only a per-head fee for whatever I kill; does and hogs and sheep (Mouflon and Corsicana and such) are $300, bucks go for $800. I like this setup; I only pay for my success, and I can arrange the schedule such that I go when I'm the only one on the back pasture. I get ooodles of acreage to myself and I don't have to worry about other hunters or such things. I'm getting to know the land pretty well, and have a fair idea of how to be successful on it.
 
Bring Enough Gun

Congratulations! I'm going to hunt hogs this fall here in Ohio...They range from 200lbs to upwards of 600:what: , so I'm going to use my 45-70 with a 550 grain spitzer bullet on top of 65gr of H777:evil: If that dont work, my sidekick Bill Ruger can have a talk with'em:banghead:
 
I got invited to hunt wild boar this year, where they USUALLY run about 200 lbs. And, believe it or not was seriously considering using an SKS. Semi-Auto with decent power (and a bayonet for backup ) However after reading your account, I think we'll be packing the old Model 8 Remington in .35 Remington...
The Rem 35 chambering will be good insurance. Having said that, I'd not hesitate to go out again with the 7.62x39, especially if you're sigificantly more familiar with the SKS than the Model 8, and even moreso if you'll be in the company of others. Just use good fodder in it - I can't stress enough how pleased I am with the Sierra 125gr performance - and keep your head. It seems as if most pigs that are hunted in the state of Texas are hunted with an AK or an SKS, so the round can't be ALL that marginal. I've certainly had excellent luck with it on sub-500lb hogs. :)

The one serious drawback to the use of 7.62x39 was (in this case) the lack of exit wounds - the shots hit vitals but didn't exit. I believe that 35 Remington would have been much more likely to punch thru the BNoP and leave a decent blood trail if needed.

My 30-30 will leave blood trails from both sides - entrace and exit - on 200lb boar. Based on that, I have in the past been known to discount tales told of how hard it was to find good blood trails on big boar. Well, this last hunt demonstrated to me that yes, once pigs get over a certain size they do become somewhat 'self-sealing'. Under those circumstances, bigger holes with more energy are certainly better, and the Rem 35 becomes preferred over the 7.62x39....
 
I used to have a hog farm. That picture of yours reminds me of a boar we had named Brutus. He was a large rascal. We turned him into bacon:D .
 
Just use good fodder in it - I can't stress enough how pleased I am with the Sierra 125gr performance
In addition to the well articulated account; the attested performance of those bullets is simply outstanding. Very close range and a very heavily built animal might take many bullet apart.

And on that line, a bigger bullet must similarly be up to the task.

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http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org
 
The only time a gun in the van is good for backup is when you are in the van with the gun. I like it when people talk aobut "trunk guns" for backup. I don't ride in the trunk and so I don't see the practicality of calling it a "backup gun."

rbernie, it sounds like you brought enough gun for hunting, just not for self defense. Of course, maybe you brought enough gun but simply didn't shoot enough times or brought the wrong gun for being capable of practical self defense at close range, as noted with the 2.5x mag issues on the scope and sighting. It isn't just the gun that is problematic. It sounds like you kept shooting at a hunter, wanting to preserve the hoped for kill as much as possible to harvest for the meat and so you didn't appear to shoot to stop or kill to save your life.

Pigs can be dangerous game. When pursuing dangerous game, a one gun or one tool option isn't a good thing. There are reasons why many predator hunters go in teams or groups, or carry multiple guns.

Yes, pigs are not considered predators, or carnivores, but those are more technical and not practical definitions. Pigs sometimes do kill prey and they are omnivores and so sometimes they eat their prey or scavenge. They may not be good predators, but predators none-the-less when they want. Keep in mind that one of the stereotypical classic predators, the cheetah, isn't a very good predator either. They have a huge failure rate of something like 80-90% (as per mammalogy years ago) and survive by hunting only through persistence of multiple attempts and sharing of food.

I'm embarrassed to admit that I actually take the time to police up my brass while I wait this out before moving in - that Remington brass is EXPENSIVE, is all I can recall thinking...

This sounds like one of those nightmare examples of you fighting like you train. When you practice at the range, no doubt you police your brass. I seem to recall the story of the dead CHP officers supposedly with spent brass in their pockets. That is how they shot at the range.
 
rbernie,

You've pointed out something I've been preaching on this sight for years. There is a HUGE difference between a hog and a BIG hog when it comes to reaction after being hit.

One question.

Whne you say that hog was being aggresive, did he chop his teeth and huff and squeal and lunge at you or did he grunt and whuff and trott towards you?
 
Whne you say that hog was being aggressive, did he chop his teeth and huff and squeal and lunge at you or did he grunt and whuff and trott towards you?
His behavior was the latter, although he wasn't trotting as much as taking very deliberate steps. I have no idea what any of that means in piggie body language, though.... :) He was not being overtly aggressive, but he was demonstrating that he wasn't going to leave me be and I wasn't going to let the situation degenerate from there...

Edited to add - after the first shot, everything went to Hellen Gone and there was lots of knashing of teeth and squealing and such, but that was as much me as the pig.

Jeez, at that range, why not a head shot?
Didn't occur to me - I did exactly what I've always done, and that's to go for a heart-lung shot. It appears to be a truism that you'll react under stress exactly as you react when NOT under stress. :eek:
 
In my experience, the first is usually a bluff, a few huffs and squeals and a seemingly committed lunge usually amounts to the hog sizing up you and the situation. The latter, head down grunt and trot towards you, means that they already know what they are capable of and believe you fit their size bracket.

Input from others to confirm or deny these behaviors would be handy. My experience has been at close range, with pistol, bow, and shotgun as well as observation of trapped hogs. I don’t figure myself as a behaviorist, just an observer of behavior.

~z
 
His behavior was the latter, although he wasn't trotting as much as taking very deliberate steps. I have no idea what any of that means in piggie body language, though....

rbernie,

I've got a friend here in Colorado who has a herd of hogs two farm pigs a couple of pot bellies a Euro boar a Texas feral hog and a Philippine bearded hog.

He trains the pot bellies and the farm pigs to do tricks for his traveling show and has the boars/Texas ferral as pets on his 20 acre "hog reserve".

I've had the opportunity to spend some time around these hog and watch them interact.

When a hog grunts and huffs and walks or trots towards you it generally means "I don't know what are you, but here I coming to have a look." :confused:
Once they recognize you as non threat they'll start chuffing it sounds like Uhh Uhh Uhh Uhh Uhh. That means "Hey dude how’s it hanging.":cool:

When they squeal and chop their teeth and spin with their tails in the air or lunge forward and retreat rapidly it means get the heck out of my way or I'm going to kick your butt!

Knowing these sounds and characteristics have helped me become a better hog hunter. For instance many times if a hog doesn't have your wind a hog will grunt when they hear you. I'll answer them with a non threatening Uhh Uhh Uhh Uhh. Often that will draw them out of cover with a curious look on their faces or calm them down enough that they'll stay put.

Also I've had aggressive hogs challenge me with a tooth pop and a squeal I'll aggresivly grunt back and make a threatening lunge forward which I've seen bring em out ready to fight on several occasions.

Congrats on your hog.he's a dandy!;)
 
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