Campers spend hours dodging hail of bullets

Status
Not open for further replies.

rainbowbob

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
2,559
Location
Seattle, WA
Here is another "moron with guns" story. It is always unfortunate when somebody as dumb as this gives gun owners a black eye.


Campers spend hours dodging hail of bullets
By John Branton

The Columbian

Campers on the north shore of Yale Reservoir hid behind cars to avoid incoming bullets and frantically called 911 last weekend after a Vancouver man — standing on the Clark County side of the lake — allegedly fired three guns toward them.

"We were just getting ready to go to bed when we heard the first shots," said Brad Burnett, a Vancouver, Wash., man who was at popular Beaver Bay Campground with friends and family members including children.

The shots began about 12:30 a.m. Saturday, Burnett said, and continued on and off through the night into the campground along Lewis River Road east of Cougar. He said the campground was nearly full; he estimated that at least 100 people were there.

"It was about 9:30 a.m. when it started getting really ugly," Burnett said. "We started hearing bullets whizzing over the trees over our heads and hitting the trees."

That's when campers started calling 911, according to a Clark County Sheriff's Office report.

Deputy James Payne said he rushed to the scene and was flagged down by campers.

"As I drove in, I was contacted by about 20 people who were frantic and told me someone had been shooting from across the lake and the rounds were hitting in the trees above their tents and on the ground in front of the campsites," Payne said in the report.

He added: "Some people stated that they climbed behind vehicles and under things to stay out of the line of fire."

Standing on the shore and looking toward where campers said the bullets were coming from, Payne said he heard more shots. He said he looked across the lake and saw someone standing on the Clark County shore near a blue-and-yellow tent.

Payne said he knew there was only one forest road to where the person was. He radioed for backup, waited until Deputy Dave Tendler arrived and they cautiously approached the person's area.

When the deputies arrived, they asked who'd been shooting and 25-year-old Jacob Michael Johnson stepped forward and said he had, the report said.

The report said Johnson said he'd been firing three guns, an AK-47 assault-style rifle, a .357 Magnum revolver and a .45-caliber semiautomatic pistol.

Johnson told the officers he'd been shooting at the water and at a small island directly between his campsite and the campground, the report said.

Told that his bullets were ricocheting off the water into the campground, Johnson said he didn't know bullets could do that, the report said.

Johnson, who had a bottle of beer in his hand, said he'd had three that morning. He submitted to a portable breath test that measured his alcohol level at 0.03, below the 0.08 DUI threshold, the report said.

Johnson was arrested and booked into the Clark County Jail on suspicion of five counts of misdemeanor reckless endangerment, the report said.

Reached by telephone Thursday evening, Johnson said "the whole shooting into the campground is just speculation."

He added, "It didn't happen. I wasn't shooting into the campground."

He declined to speak further.

Deputies seized the three guns and some ammunition as evidence.

Deputy Payne, a U.S. Army veteran and now a firearms instructor, said rifle bullets can travel well over a mile. He said they can ricochet off water and continue for great distances.

Using a laser device, Payne said he measured the distance between Johnson and the campground at 1,530 feet, less than the maximum range of the rifle and even the handguns.

Back at Beaver Bay, Payne spoke to campers who said they'd looked through binoculars during the fusillade and saw a man holding a gun.

"They could see the splashes in the water" as the bullets zipped over their heads, Payne said.

"They yelled across the water for them to stop shooting, to no avail," Payne said.

During the night as the bullets flew, camper Burnett said there was a light breeze and the moon was out at times.

"We go camping to relax and spend some time with family and friends," Burnett said. "But when you're dodging bullets, the tranquillity is ruined. I'm hoping it'll be a one-time occurrence, because Beaver Bay is a real nice campground."

Copyright © 2008 The Seattle Times Company

My questions:

Were the campers in real danger at that range (1530 ft)?

Should this guy (Johnson) have had his guns confiscated?

Should he get them back?

Should he lose his right to possess firearms?
 
Yes.

Yes.

Maybe.

He's Canadian. He doesn't have "rights".

<edit> Oops. Looks like that's Vancouver, WA. So much for my gratuitous slam against Canada. So should he be stripped of his rights? Tough call, IMO. His actions were pretty dumb. Is it the kind of dumb that's cured by education, or the kind that's permanent and untreatable?
 
Yes, the campers were in danger. It is up to the Prosecuting Attorney whether he is prosecuted or not.

Thanks for posting this example of Problem #2 and a failure of The Four Rules. Problem #2 is not something that I made up. Everytime you use a firearm there can be consequences that you do not like.

Just because you own a firearm does not mean you get to do whatever you wish. My rights, my rights, my rights. No, your duties, your duties, your duties.

The Four Rules will save you. Obey them.
 
My questions:

Were the campers in real danger at that range (1530 ft)?

Should this guy (Johnson) have had his guns confiscated?

Should he get them back?

Should he lose his right to possess firearms?

Yes, the campers were indeed, in real danger.

Yes. As stated, they were taken in for evidence until everything is settled.

Yes. He's only facing misdemeanor charges.

No. He's only facing misdemeanor charges.

Unfortunately, this guy sounds like someone who intended no harm, but is also very uninformed about firearms & ammunition; a hunter's education course would probably do him wonders.

Sam
 
he'd been firing three guns, an AK-47 assault-style rifle, a .357 Magnum revolver and a .45-caliber semiautomatic pistol.

Why does it seem like everyone who does stupid things with guns has to do it with an AK? Or maybe the menacing looks and pistol grip of the AK really are "evil" and make people do stupid things...
 
1,530 feet, less than the maximum range of the rifle and even the handguns.
That's only 500 yards. I don't know where he got his ballistics from but a 7.62x39 round will still put a hurtin' on ya at that range.

So to answer your questions:

Yes

Yes

Not until this gets sorted out

No,but he should be horsewhipped for being a buffoon.
 
I am very familiar with Yale and Beaver Bay beacuse I live about 20 minutes away from there. What failed to get mentioned was the fact that the highway from Cougar to Mount St. Helens runs parallel to the lake and the campground. If rounds were hitting the trees then they were also hitting the highway. This is a camping and boating area. Nobody should be shooting here at all.
 
My questions:

1. Were the campers in real danger at that range (1530 ft)?

2. Should this guy (Johnson) have had his guns confiscated?

3. Should he get them back?

4. Should he lose his right to possess firearms?
...


1. yes IMO

2. Yep, they were used in a "stupid" (*non-educated) use/crime.

3. That's not my call but, the drinking, the late hour shooting, shows that booze and guns, plus *, are a bad mix.

4. Yes & No? Only if he passes some kind of Gun safety (test) course with a passing grade..

Ignorance of gun safety rules and applications while using guns with booze, along with, not knowing where one's shots will travel, etc., etc., is no excuse.

Luck can be a wonderful asset, in this case, for the innocent as well as for the defendant in this matter..

Unfortunately this type of "uneducated gun use" and its possible, far-reaching, effects goes-on all the time by far too many and really hurts those that took courses of safety, gun use, etc., and adds to the, all-so-true phrase; "it only takes a few to ruin it for all.."

I really don't know what the answer is to solve this exact kind of problem other than what the law has done in this matter and whatever the Justice System decides to do with him or his confiscated weapons.



Ls
 
Remember, we're responsible for every round the leaves the barrels of our guns. Even if we don't mean to shower campers across the river with ricochets, its still irresponsible and a crime.
 
Is it the kind of dumb that's cured by education, or the kind that's permanent and untreatable?
Hard to say.
I could see someone not realizing water acts like a solid from the right angle and was posing a danger to others.
Maybe he thought he was safely shooting into the water, the bullets were going underwater and everything was fine.

Stories where someone is negligent usualy exagerate a little further, since the person was neglidgent thier credibility with safety is gone and theories of how much danger was posed are stated as fact.
Whether the other people were directly part of his backgrop or the story took a few liberties in assumption since bullets were going in thier general direction is hard to say.


Some people need education. Some people that shoot guns into the air putting others in danger think it is safe too.

Water is a bad target, shooting in the air is not safe.


An actual range not too far from me was closed down because some shooters decided to shoot clays in the air with rifles instead of shotguns. The rifle rounds were landing in people's property miles away, peppering rooftops, and even injured livestock.
That was some years ago, and it has never been reopened. I guess the morons thought shooting birdshot into the air was the same as shooting anything in the air. If one was okay so was the other.

I have even seen people on here defend shooting in the air, as some foolishly do in celebration. There is a number of foolish people out there.
I have been tempted to fire blanks before but decided against it because it would likely encourage some idiot with a pistol, rifle, or shotgun with large shot or slugs to do the same. They would not likely see the difference. Sometimes you must set a positive example for the lowest common denominator who won't know what thought was put into your actions.
(even birdhsot can be dangerous, especialy on a night like the 4th of July or New Years, since many will be looking into the sky, eyes pointed up to enjoy fireworks),



I wonder if anything would have been different here if someone else had been able to shoot back?
If a man is shooting in your direction constantly, you are unable to get his attention, and every shot is a gamble whether it hits you or your family, how long should you play the odds hiding under your car before you return fire?
Self defense against someone that does not even know they are attacking?
That would be an interesting case.
 
Last edited:
I have to ask why did the campers NOT leave the area if they felt they were in danger? Seems like they stayed in the area for >9 hours??? If I heard shots "wizzing" around I would not stay around very long if I felt I was in any real danger...

So in closing I think both sides in this case are morons.. The guy doing the shooting, and the people staying in the "down-range" area for many hours.
 
Why does it seem like everyone who does stupid things with guns has to do it with an AK?
I think there's a correlation between their (and their ammo) price, lack of firearms knowledge, testosterone, and their look.

Young male wants a cool looking rifle, doesn't know enough about firearms to know the difference between most, walks into pawn shop and buys the cheapest cool looking rifle, and goes out to make a fool of himself.

That same male might have bought the AR if it wasn't twice the price or the M1A if it wasn't 3x the price.

The AK is like the trailer park after the tornado - they just seem to be the ones to draw the attention.

00169755.zoom.a.jpg


"I seen it comin cross the highway and it was just a blowin!"
 
I really hope this guy learned his lesson. At least no one was killed, but dang this gives us a bad name. It makes me cringe every time somebody does something dumb with a gun, especially with the "evil" rifles.

I hope the guy gets his guns back, but he should be required to take some kind of hunter safety/concealed carry class, so that maybe this doesn't happen again.

I also like the idea of firearms training for every single American. Of course, I think every American should also own a battle rifle and a sidearm.
 
When I was younger (just old enough to buy a gun), I didnt want an AK or anything like it. I wanted a BP Sharps 54 Cal carbine... It wasnt until later (after seeing Red Dawn) that I wanted an AK...

I want to hear more about this story...
 
Anybody for mandatory firearm safety classes in public schools?

Kids are taught about "safe sex" - not because it is advocated that kids engage in sex - but because it is a given they will be exposed to it in this society.

The same argument could be made for firearm safety education - without advocating for or against kids use of firearms.

It's for the kids.

[Edit] After posting this, I saw Wheeler44 beat me to it.
 
Why does it seem like everyone who does stupid things with guns has to do it with an AK?
I think there's a correlation between their (and their ammo) price, lack of firearms knowledge, testosterone, and their look.

There is that. A budget gun gets more idiots. Similar to how "saturday night specials" were involved in so much crime before legislation forced other firearms to be chosen.
It is not the gun that is to blame, it is that the crowd more inclined to trouble also choose that firearm type (even though it can be popular with a much larger number of responsible owners, they don't end up on the news.)

Another factor is the mainstream media calls 80% of rifles AKs even if they are not, and often with a picture or video clip showing an actual AK during the story.
 
The shots began about 12:30 a.m. Saturday, Burnett said, and continued on and off through the night into the campground along Lewis River Road east of Cougar. He said the campground was nearly full; he estimated that at least 100 people were there.

"It was about 9:30 a.m. when it started getting really ugly," Burnett said. "We started hearing bullets whizzing over the trees over our heads and hitting the trees."

...Using a laser device, Payne said he measured the distance between Johnson and the campground at 1,530 feet, less than the maximum range of the rifle and even the handguns.

9 hrs of shooting into a full campground at 500 yds ???
TOO AMAZING !
 
Ok lets say youre one of the campers, and you are armed. Its hard to say if this is just some careless plinker or someone out to do you and others real harm? Would you return fire across the lake? If you thought that someone was actually shooting at you? Legal ramifications of this? Any thoughts?
 
I'll tell you about the fellow.

He was LUCKY.

Lucky there wasn't a rifleman with a weapon in that campground.

I wonder - if you or I had been there, amidst a group of people huddled behind cars, etc., and taken a shot to stop the guy shooting, would we be in jail?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top