carbine suggestions
- Thread starter minirunner
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fatcat4620
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I will second the saiga. You could have the rifle and 1000 rounds and still be under budget.
Good ones are available in the price range you set, so let's go ahead and cross off the 'expensive' disqualifier.
As far as the forward assist goes, I don't know that I've ever seen anyone legitimately use one. Aside from maybe being down to your very last round, and it won't quite chamber properly, what situation is the forward assist supposed to help with?
Dust cover is a nice feature, but does it really offer much functional protection for the rifle's internals? The bolt carrier group already blocks off the ejection port quite handily, and there aren't any situations I can think of where you would want to lock your bolt to the rear and then close the dustcover. Besides, the AR has a nice closed-top receiver anyway, so debris large enough to really wreak havoc can't get in there anyway unless you've got the bolt locked open.
I honestly don't think I've noticed any special amount of maintenance with the AR platform, I mean you scrub the bolt carrier group down every few hundred rounds or full day of heavy shooting, run a bore snake through it a couple of times, leave it lightly oiled, give it a squirt of lube or use some dry lube before putting a ton of rounds through it, and it works perfectly.
Service rifles choke because the mags we use for training are often nearing the end of their useful lives, not because the rifle itself is unreliable. Use Pmags or any decent mag in good condition and you bascially never see feeding problems with them.
That said, it does sound like you are more looking for a deer rifle that could be pressed into additional service as a fighting rifle if absolutely needed. There are lots of cartridges the AR can be chambered in that fit that role well, like the 6.8 or even the .30 Remington AR, but you would probably do better with a .30-30 lever action or an SKS or Saiga in 7.62x39mm, for cheaper ammunition.
I'd say if you want a rifle that can grow with you, an AR would be great, cheap and plentiful ammunition, loaded with one of the many non-varmint bullets it will work on deer, and in the future you can buy a more hunting-specific upper to more fully match what you want your rifle to be capable of. But with the price and guidelines you've set out, right now the other rifles are probably a better match for you.
xxxleafybugxxx
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I'm a fan of the x39... therefore I would suggest a used mini 30, or an sks. you can get a sks for 300, and have the rest for ammo and maybe even a scope if you wanted to go that route. If you go with the Sks though, I would recommend the firing pin spring to prevent slamfires
briansmithwins
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You will have enough money for a SKS and a scope but good luck mounting a scope on a SKS.
BSW
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minirunner
Member
Not so much just the AR, but over time semi autos worry me with gas tubes clogging and that. I guess personal preference i would rather have the reliability of a bolt or lever, if it's gonna be my only long gun. The semi' do carry more rounds and offer faster fire. Buthave their own issues, like what to do when your mags run dry?
minirunner
Member
DDont want to debate or piss anyone off. Just would rather have a bolt or lever system.
allaroundhunter
Member
A mag change will be a much quicker reload than having to reload a lever gun or bolt action rifle. And it will give you at least 5x as much ammo with each reload. I also have no idea why their reliability is being questioned, modern AKs and ARs both rarely malfunction. You only have to worry about your gas tube clogging if you fire thousands of rounds without cleaning.....
Most of your worries about semi-automatic rifles are way overstated, but if you really want a bolt action or lever gun, then Marlin guide guns are a good option.
A good, well-rounded bolt gun is the Ruger Gunsite Scout.
Jeff F
Member
Go with an AR if your wanting something that shoots .223/5.56. The price between either a new or good used AR is right there with a new Mini 14. This is not a bash on the Mini 14, I own a couple and shoot them more then I do my AR's. Mini's are super reliable and plenty accurate but if one goes down, its either off to Ruger it must go for cert en parts or you have to order the parts and wait to get them. If one of my AR's goes down, theres a half dozen places within 50 miles or less that I can go and buy every part in it and get running myself.
X-Rap
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I got the feeling you were not after a semi auto when I suggested the 7615 but if you are after a larger caliber I would still say look at the pump action Rems. They are available in calibers from 222-30-06 and even if you can't find a carbine model you can get the barrel cut and recrowned for little money.
Folding stocks and 10 rd mags are available that make the guns a pretty small package with some serious punch.
Clogging with what? The gas that runs through them is pretty hot, does a good job at keeping them free. Pipe cleaners can help keep it shiny if that's nice, but I've never heard of a direct-impingement AR choking because it's gas tube was clogged.
When your mags run dry, you put another one in, or you put more bullets in them. Bolts and lever rifles have magazines too, the difference is theirs are integral to the gun so if something goes wrong with them, it's a much more crippling issue. Replacing a barrel-length magazine spring is a little more difficult to do in a stressful location than swapping out magazines or even completely replacing the internals of a detachable magazine.
Some bolt rifles use detachable magazines, but they are typically smaller and much more expensive.
I missed where you excluded self-loaders in the original post, my guess is you're going to keep getting a lot of advice to try out various semis from other people for the same reason. To exclude them for reliability reasons seems like a mistake to me though, mostly because I've only experienced a single misfeed with an M16, and it was using a truly trashed magazine.
The ones I had in Basic and AIT never choked on anything, and the CMMG AR15 I owned never choked on anything either. The only one that did was a State Marksmanship Team M16, and the magazine in it was well past the point where it needed to be pulled and either rebuilt or thrown away.
It just seems like a mistake to me, and I'm sure to some others, to exclude the rifles that most closely match the requirements you laid out because you are concerned that they won't be reliable, when they've shown over and over that they are plenty reliable, regardless of what the H&K papers (Army/Marine Times) say.
If you just want a lever or bolt action rifle, that's great, what you want is always the best thing to buy, but there are some very real reasons why they aren't used as fighting rifles much anymore, and it sounded like you were mostly looking for a fun gun that could double as an effective fighting rifle.
minirunner
Member
Does anyone know if I bought the M&P15 Sport model, would I be able to get a .308 upper for hunting down the road? I have seen some nice uppers with top rails, but I don't know if I can swap one on to the M&P15 Sport. Im starting to see the light on the AR platform. And maybe Im reading too much crap on the web. In my five years with an A2 I never did experience a malfunction. Plus muscle memory kicks in every time I pick one up.
minirunner
Member
I think I found the answer. No.
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