CCW class update, women afraid of guns

[Chemist]

OK, I'd like to thank everyone for help with the .22 or 9mm question.

The CCW class last night was a shocker for me. I'm guessing I missed the memo that women should only carry revolvers and use padlocks to keep them safe while wearing the key(to the padlock) around their neck. HUH?

I filled out my paperwork and the other instructor came up and asked me if I knew that I'd have to shoot 50 rounds on the range and she didn't think I could do that with my 9mm. I mean it's one thing for guys to think of women as the weaker sex, but a female instructor!?!

Tonight is hands on safety, etc. I really wish I had a hand cannon to take. If they ask why I didn't bring my .22 I think I'll laugh and say, "And what, piss off my attacker?":banghead:

Have any of you all seen this same type of thing? Was I raised in a cave or is this attitude about women justified?

TIA,
Frustrated Chemist

FWIW, I'm not into women's lib, I usually don't whine and as an ex-weight lifter I'm hardly tiny.

 

[lions]

I believe you can find that attitude towards any group wherever you are. It does seem to be fairly prevalent in the shooting community but admittedly I don't hang out in many other communities.

It's regrettable that you have to endure that treatment. There was a woman in my CCW class who was treated similarly before the shooting section. She and the most offensive of the guys shot at the same time both using their .22s, she shot a group 1/3 the size of his and suddenly he wasn't the expert he claimed to be.

Unfortunately, females have to prove their proficiency before they receive any credit.

 

[Dnaltrop]

I made the mistake of trying to include a Walther PPK .380 in the array of pistols to choose from when I took my Wife to buy her birthday gun.

She sneered at me... felt up every 9mm for grip and picked the Sigma on comfort alone.

She still teases me for including the PPK

 

[NavyLCDR]

How about this for a summary statement:

The attitude that you speak of about women and guns is a COMMONLY held MISCONCEPTION.

At various gun ranges, and I try to go shooting at least once a week, I have seen just as much sensitivity to recoil/noise/muzzle blast among men as among women. I just think there are not as many men who are going to come out and say, I really don't want to shoot that gun because of the macho image we must maintain as men...

In reality, there are just as many people out there, men and women, whose favorite gun is the .460 S&W and just as many men and women whose favorite gun is a .22.

 

[Chemist]

I mean I love my little plinker, but this is a class about ultimately having to stop an attack using deadly force...a plinker ain't cutting it in my book.

 

[hoodfu]

The first time I fired a handgun, I was terrified, and I'm a big dude. It's like holding a lit M80, knowing it's going to go off and you can't let go. It didn't help that I had awful hearing protection on as well. I got over it within a few sessions and now I'll shoot even big stuff, but I never look down on people who are afraid of it.

 

[Deus Machina]

At least in my class, a lot of the women had never really fired a gun without their boyfriend holding their hands, if at all. Even a .22 can be a surprise the first time. I'd give the instructor the benefit of the doubt and say that's what she's thinking, but it's still an ignorant thing to assume.

Plus, about keeping them locked.

Really, it was stupid for women to come into the class, with a brand new .22 or their husbands' borrowed guns, get up to the line, and go: pop! *flinch* "Eeee!" repeat.

But it's also dumb for an instructor--especially a woman--to assume anything of the like.

 

[wishin]

I filled out my paperwork and the other instructor came up and asked me if I knew that I'd have to shoot 50 rounds on the range and she didn't think I could do that with my 9mm. I mean it's one thing for guys to think of women as the weaker sex, but a female instructor!?!

No, not justified. What amazes me is that a female said that to you. So much for some empathy from your own. At least it demonstrates that there are women who unfairly stereotype female shooters too.

How'd you do little lady? (kidding)

 

[Buzzard]

Never did understand why the whole saw of "woman = weak = mousegun" even got started. Two of the best shots I've ever seen are both women. Il Ling New is 5'4" and can empty a .44 Mag in a hurry, one-handed; oh yeah, she works at Gunsite. If you can track down episodes of Personal Defense TV, she does a segment on the misconception of women and mouseguns. She also displays her prowess with a .44 Mag. The other is my aunt, who hunts Columbia Blacktail deer with a 12 gauge firing slugs. She's about 5'6", all of 120lbs sopping wet and out-shoots my dump-truck-drivin' Redneck uncle.

If you can, find a Ruger SP101 in .357 Mag and stoke it with 125 gr. Speer Gold Dots. That'll get Weakness Queen's attention (and put a dent in the day of any attacker).

 

[WhippingBoy]

My wife took the 'Womens CCW' class to avoid 'rambos', as she put it (there's another one: male gun enthusiasts are all Rambo wanna-bes). Anyhow, her class of women were nearly all frightened of guns and yet they're in a CCW class! She left with the sincere hope that most of those women avoid carrying guns in public at all. Plus, the only thing they did beyond the safety instruction was to shoot 10 rounds with a 22 pistol.

After that I took her to a proper CCW class where 150 rounds were fired (from our own 9mm gun) at mugger picture targets. IN that class they did draw from holster, movement, verbal commands, reloads, COM shots, head shots, etc. Now that was a proper class to start a beginner off right in terms of practical pistol use and CCW. I'm still kind of peeved at the milk-toast instruction she got from the first class. That was a big waste of money.

 

[bigfatdave]

Appalling that a female instructor is falling for that idiot stereotype.

You know, in your other thread I leaned towards the "screw it, shoot 50 rounds with a .22" attitude because those 50 rounds really aren't a significant portion of your overall SD training ... but after that asshat comment from the instructor I'm half tempted to tell you to pick up a nice shiny ported/compensated .45 or 10mm and blast that instructor's ears off, but sadly you wouldn't have time for break-in and cleaning before the range time.

I shared this with MrsBFD ... she also thinks your instructor is an idiot.

Oh well, shoot their silly little qualification course to the best of your ability and then seek out some real training or at least join a range/club where you can do your own training without rental-range gomers and employees bothering you.

 

[Warhawk83]

My thought, if she thinks a female can't handle anything but a .22, what does she shoot? And why,O why,is she teaching a class on self defense with a firearm.

There is a lot of sexism with respect to women handling something other than a .22 is ridiculous. She assumed you had never fired a weapon at all by saying that,IMO.

Some girls are terrified by guns, but some guys are too. My wife is a damn good shot but acts like it might fire itself if she walks past it while it's on safe and laying on a table unattended.

I'm glad you decided to take your safety in your own hands,I barely convinced my wife to take the CC class and she REFUSES to get the permit and carry. I learned to let it go,I don't like it but it isn't my choice.

 

[Warhawk83]

I'm still kind of peeved at the milk-toast instruction she got from the first class. That was a big waste of money.

-WhippingBoy

You just described the class my wife and I took,I was extremely disappointed as well.

 

[bigfatdave]

Mouseguns and silly little revolvers are challenging guns to shoot, the tendency of range employees and gun shops to push those guns to women is NOT getting more people shooting, it is turning women interested in firearms and SD away from shooting regularly.

The condescending attitude towards women (I see it all the time with my wife) is not promoting anything positive for RKBA or getting women entering shooting sports.
Firearms are gender neutral, they don't require massive upper body strength to operate and they aren't fueled by testosterone ... and yet when my wife (and I assume other women) ask to see something from under the glass they get the same tired old spiel about a snubby lightweight DAO revolver, the only variations are whether she gets told to buy a .357 and load it with .38 or told to buy a .38 ... this is why half the gun shops (most of the big retail ones) in the area don't get business from us.

 

[Wahoo95]

I see it a different way. While it may have been wrong for her to assume you'd be better off with a .22, you have to keep in mind that she does these classes on a regular basis and her experience probably mirrors mine. The reality is that there are A LOT of women taking these classes that have never shot a gun before and are many time scared to death of guns because some jerk husband/boyfriend let them shoot his .44mag their first time out. Yes it would have been less offensive if she'd asked for more info on your previous experience, however you should realize that her assumptions have a real basis in her past experiences.

 

[Chemist]

BFD, I did join the local gun club/range and the lead instructor knows that, he gave me the darned directions.

First night at the club we had a fun shoot/run IPDA type thing and I think I did well. None of my hostages were struck and I finished in the fastest time out of 17 men.

All my "rambo" type male friends always invite me to go hunt or plink, so I guess I have been sheltered.

Wahoo, I understand as an ex-teacher and college professor...you never know what your student knows.

We do have a few of that type of lady in the class and yes, they scare me to death too. Maybe, I'll feel better knowing their guns will have padlocks on them.

 

[zxcvbob]

I filled out my paperwork and the other instructor came up and asked me if I knew that I'd have to shoot 50 rounds on the range...

Up to here, I think what she said is appropriate

and she didn't think I could do that with my 9mm. I mean it's one thing for guys to think of women as the weaker sex, but a female instructor!?!

Is that what she said (bad) or did she ask you if you could do that with your 9mm? (maybe not good, but certainly not bad.)

 

[ForumSurfer]

Sounds like par for the course. I'm simply going by my experiences. I even had one range officer react by saying "Are you SURE she can handle that?" when I took an ex shooting...referring to a fullsize 1911 she was carrying.

Just try not to judge us all by those standards by which you've been treated!

FWIW, being a guy from the south...you'd be surprised how many people will actually pre-judge you as being an ignorant redneck for having an accent. I've participated in corporate meetings and witnessed people's opinions being disregarded for no other reason than their accent.

 

[Hatterasguy]

You should of said you had the 9mm out because the Deagle is at the smith.

 

[NavyLCDR]

I mean I love my little plinker, but this is a class about ultimately having to stop an attack using deadly force...a plinker ain't cutting it in my book.

Every tool has it's appropriate use. When you use a tool for a less appropriate use, it's effectiveness goes down.

 

[content]

Hello friends and neighbors // Nothing wrong with a .22.

I'm 6'4", 240 lbs, have several hand guns .38/.357/.40 and I took my 4" 11+1 .22 Stoger Luger to my CWP class.

I think the only requirement was the firearm fit into a 10" circle and would actually fire 50 rounds. I figured ,why spend $15.00 + on ammo when I could spend $1.50 using Federal bulk.

 

[SheepNutz]

Our class was about half women (including my wife and sister-in-law) and our instructor treated all of them just like the men. He didn't make any comments about women should only use one type of gun or caliber or anything like that. It was a pleasant experience, and the ladies (along with the guys) sure had a lot of fun. Nice username btw, what field of chemistry are you in? I'm a forensic chemist.

 

[jim147]

I remember my brother-in-law telling me about his class. The only person to outshoot him was a woman.

My wife is a pistol shooter. The first gift I bought her before we got married was a pistol. She has no problem with the revolvers. The 9mm pistols aren't a problem either. The .45's seem to have a small problem with the slide, not the recoil. That's both of ours fault. She was a little worried about the recoil and I was a little worried about her handling it. But she had no problem.

I once saw her hit a possum at 25 feet, in the dark, with her .25 Raven. I said, "I have a keeper. And I'll try to never piss her off."

jim

 

[carbuncle]

My ex was a .45 fiend, she had a P-10 when they first came out and used a Glock 30 as her EDC.

My wife wants to take a class with me as soon as I buy a gun for her to use.

 

[KBintheSLC]

Maybe she was afraid you would make her look bad by shooting better than her demo run. Sometimes ego's are impressively delicate.

PS... my 5'2" 105 lb wife just dumped 50 rounds of 10mm Auto downrange last weekend and she loved every minute of it. It is generally a bad idea to underestimate women in this sport.