CHECK YOUR GUNSAFE! We all have the same guns!!!

[effengee]

The best guns...

Firstly, let's talk about what is needed...
Pistols for close combat and personal defense.
"assault weapons" for medium through long range and generic use.
Rifles with scopes for extreme range and precision target destruction.

With any one of these weapons available to the militia, the common citizen can feasably engage an enemy force and capture enemy arms.
Regardless of what weapons are favored, types of actions are best, the point remains of what is ammo is most common and what guns you should DEFINATELY have in your arsenal...

.22 is not only cheap and widely available, it's potentially deadly when used accurately.
There are literally tons of handguns and rifles in every action configuration imaginable. Little recoil and noise allows newbie shooters to become comfortable while establishing the early fundamentals of firearms.
Use only one round at a time. It'll quickly get them used to working the action and loading the weapon safely.

Pistol:
.380, .38/.357, .9mm, and .45 are the most common around the world.
You'll find at least one example of each in every gunstore in America...
Given the choice, I'd opt for a high-power semi-automatic.
(Read that Colt 1911... with all the variants and knock-offs, there'll be enough ammo, parts and springs to last until the next ice age.)
Wheelguns have their place, but I find them to be too bulky to carry concealed and cumbersome to load in a hurry.

"assault weapon" which is really a misnomer.
My 1917 smle has seen more assaults than my SAR1 but you can take three guesses as to which one is banned in California...

What is needed here is a sturdy semi-automatic rifle in either .223 or 7.62X39mm with a large capacity magagzine capability until I can obtain a belt-fed machine gun...
I prefer the AK family over the M-16 variants. Ease of maintenance, level of abuse survivability, and overall fit make it my choice.

Scoped rifle:
.30-30, .30-06, .308.
Again, ammo and parts are prolific.
Also to be considered are the WW2 calibers that are still everywhere like the .303 British and 7mm Mauser.

Any gun will work, but these are just the most common...

 

[cpileri]

buy it cheap and stack it deep

I sure agree that ammo in common is of greater importance if common weapons cannot be had. So buy it cheap and stack it deep!

But my idea presumes that we dont have to choose one or the other. We all, at least as of now (keep in mind FineSwine, Schumer, Kennedy, and Skerry are still in office...plotting...), can acquire common equipment.

Can an effecitve resistance be equipped sporadically and dissimilarly? Sure. Look at France during WWII. But as i read more and more, and occasionally meet some of the resistance who are still living (ask me sometime, I got a great story), they always complain about lack of thisor that; lack of spare parts, lack of extra boots, lack of guns and ammo.

So sure, having lots of ammo for that 7.5 berthier rifle is going to help. But you only hear about our troops complaining about the easy availability of equipment when it all fails at once: "We would've done alot better if ALL of the M4's didn't clog with sand at the same time..."

Otherwise, a modular unit is the way to go!

Now again, one guy who is a master with his 338 Lapua Magnum will be a real headache for any enemy. But all he will ever be is a lone, long range sniper. He will be SOL if he comes to me for ammo or parts. And he will eventually be asking around for brass to reload.

I don't have any. Do you?

So like i said, there is little doubt the calibers I chose were cause for much discussion. And I am certainly not advocating getting rid of anthing you really like for this little idea. But I can't believe that having a well-and-similarly-equipped 'unit' (12,000 strong! Hoo-rah!) is not a good idea.

Which leaves me still taking advice on the choice of 357 revolver, and bolt action rifle model especially.

Any reasoned opinions on that?

Any non-reasoned opinions?

C-

 

[cpileri]

Another good point

Another salient point was brought up that in Rawles' book, Patriots, the protagonist group preferred 2 styles of rifle s the women and lighter members of the group found the 308 MBR too heavy.

Seems like a great reason to have both! You pick your favorite, and still have one to give to the next person you find to befriend.

It could happen...
C-

 

[Farnham]

Love threads like this...

Got the Glock 17, the 870, and the 10/22, but I can't justify three rifles (5.56, 7.62x39, and 7.62x51) for just me and the wife. So, she's got the Mini-14 (AR-15 when I get outta Cali) (and 1000 rds), I've got the M1A (and 1000 rds), and for the part of the population mentioned earlier, the non-gunnies that catch on too late, I've got three SKS's, as they are easy to use, almost indestructible, and easy to maintain.

Cut the choice of calibers to four, 9mm, 5.56, 7.62x39, and 7.62x51 (ease of acquisition, all milsurp) and use the 7.62x39 to arm your unskilled (Russian conscript on the gun proficiency level) neighbors. The 12 gauge is great for hunting and CQB, but carrying an 870 or a Mossy 500 as well as your MBR would get old quick, 'specially with water, chow, ammo, and snivel gear.

Basically, one person can't use more than one gun at a time, but if you can get your buddies and neighbors into the fight with one of your (cheap) SKS/AK variants, you just doubled your firepower. Keep a couple hundred rounds for each one of those lovely old girls, and your neighborhood watch just became a neighborhood guard.

 

[effengee]

best .357/bolt-action...

In my opinion, a S&W M19.

I have a friend who has one from the early '50's and it hasn't broken once.
They've been around awhile and they're strong.
Rossi makes a knock-off that is truly comparable for less $$$

Winchester M70
Military and civillian versions abound...
Very strong, well-built, and cheap when using surplus ammo...

Again, WW1/WW2 era bolt-actions are still prolific...
I have a .303 British from 1917 that still shoots great...

Again, just like a car, you must buy what you can afford and are willing to be attached to for a number of years...

 

[444]

.357 Revolver/Bolt action Rifle

As I mentioned previously, if I understand the goal of this exercise, I see no reason at all to have either one.
However, if I misunderstand and we are making a list for a possible gun collection or a wish list where we get to choose one firearm out of every catagory, then that is different.
I could see choosing a .357 revolver over a 9mm handgun but see no reason to have both (for purposes of this senario). I can see being able to justify have a bolt action rifle in lieu of a battle rifle, but not both (for purposes of this senario).
If it were possible to interest enough people in buying the same guns that take the same ammo, and the same magazines, and the same parts etc. to make this worthwhile, I see no reason to make this any more complicated and expensive than nessessary. Choosing different arms that perform the same funtion only with a different action is guilding the lilly.
Now I could see a discussion of accessories. For example choosing a basic weapons platform, lets just say an M1A for an example. And discussing the additon of a riflescope, night vision scope, red dot optic, suppressor etc. which could all be quickly added onto or taken off the same rifle. But have a whole pile of guns and choosing them like a set of golf clubs seems to be ridiculous in the senario I envision. Instead you make the few items you have perform all the roles you envision.

 

[ilcylic]

Why not the 1903 for .30-06? They seem to be common and relatively cheap.

Also, .30-30 has been around for a long time. There might be more Model 94s than .30-06s. But I don't know for certain.

I know, though, that in a SHTF situation, I'd want handguns a lot more common than the two varieties of .44 I have.

It seems that for what you're talking about, SKS vs: AK-47 doesn't matter. If you're running the same ammo, then you have commonality, and 6000 of each will give you spare parts for both after you have losses. (And let's be honest here, there will be losses.)

SKS might be easier to pass off as a hunting rifle, though, in the "interim".

-Ogre

 

[Snake Eyes]

So there it is, the list.
1. Ruger 10/22
2. S&W 686 (?)
3. Glock 17/19
4. AR-15
5. AK-variant
6. Rem 700 (in 308 and 30-06) , and
7. 870 in 12ga

1--Check
2--Natch. Colt Python. 2.5, 4 or 6", whichever two I grab first.
3--NEVER. Colt 1911. Gold Cup, Government, Delta Elite or 1991A1 Compact, whichever two I grab first
4--Check
5--Check
6--Rem 700 PSS, 308, obtained from Ted Yost. You can't have any of my parts.
7--Winchester Defender 12ga (It's already in the safe.)

 

[goon]

So there it is, the list.
1. Ruger 10/22
2. S&W 686 (?)
3. Glock 17/19
4. AR-15
5. AK-variant
6. Rem 700 (in 308 and 30-06) , and
7. 870 in 12ga



I think a list of calibers would go alot further than a list of firearms.
Which guns you buy is a very personal decision.
For example, I agree with the .22LR, but I would have to go with my CZ. Shot for shot, it is just plain more effective than my 10/22. I agree with the .357, but would probably go with a Ruger GP-100. I like the 9mm, but would go with a SIG. I would also add the .45 ACP and maybe the .40 S&W. One has been popular for a long time and the other has become pretty popular lately.
The ammo compatibility is way bigger than the choice of a firearm.
And you don't need to have them all. You just need a few of them. Backed into a corner, you could get by with just a rifle and the mags and 1K of ammo for it to start. That would at least give you something to get whatever the enemy is carrying, then pass your rilfe on to someone else. Having more guns is a great idea, but not really necessary.
I also personally feel that as a combat weapon, a shotgun is a poor choice compared to a semi-automatic rifle or assault rifle. The ammo is heavier and more vulnerable to moisture and the range is limited, and they don't hold as much ammunition. They are great for hunting and home defense, and they undoubtedly do have their uses, but I would prefer a rifle every time.

 

[John Ross]

No one here has mentioned one of the most important considerations:

What is the occupying government using?

If the UN troops or whatever army you're up against have M16s, M249s, and MAG-58s, anyone seen at a distance carrying an easily recognizable AK or SKS is going to get immediate and severe attention.

This "parts breakage" issue is laughable. Those of us who shoot a lot (I consider anything over 10,000 rounds a year a lot) know that good guns don't break parts very often. There are rental 9mm Glocks on ranges that have gone a HALF MILLION rounds without breakage. If you're worried about parts breakage, have spares of the breakable stuff, don't plan on cannibalizing someone else's gun.

Ammo: All the serious shooters I know have a minimum of several thousand rounds of ammo on hand right now. Many of us have a lot more than that. How much ammo do you expect any one person to consume IN A WAR before he gets killed? Where are you going to store it, so that you can resupply *yourself*, let alone all these other people using the same round? It's easy to buy 10,000 rounds of .308. It's a lot harder to carry it...

The conflict you envision is IMO unrealistic, but if it gets to the situation you describe, it will be fought with leaderless resistance in an urban guerrilla fashion.

If you are up against a superior force with full military equipment and *you* are limited to small arms, distance is your ally. If you are fighting with a handgun, you probably don't have long to live.

I would want an accurate, scoped rifle first and foremost. With such a gun, I can deny access to a circle around me with a half mile radius, and do it with a minimum of ammo.

If the opposition is expected to have M16s, build up a couple of AR15s with Williams triggers, match barrels, floating (but stock-appearing) handguards, Elcan scopes, etc. that will shoot 3/8 MOA with 70-75 grain BTHPs. If you don't want to do it yourself, buy one from someone who does this kind of thing. Load up a couple thousand match rounds or get Black Hills to do it for you.

It may be fun to come up with lists of guns we all "should" have, but the most important asset is skill. Are your guns sighted in? Can you hit plate-sized things reliably at long distances, say 300-600 yards? Are trajectory and wind drift tables burned into yorur memory, or at least taped to the stock? Do you own a laser rangefinder?

The nightmare scenario for the occupying force would be to have every resister be a skilled prairie dog shooter with his best rifle, a .50 cal. can full of match ammo, a ghillie suit, a laser rangefinder, and lots of time.

JR

 

[cpileri]

Yeah, now yer' talkin" !

See now John Ross is saying sound to me alot like SENSE!

I'm tracking with the idea of leaderless resistance, guerilla style. In my dreary, dreamy nightmare the occupying force is our own government, state troops, national guardsmen, lawmen, etc who have either forgotten about the 'upholding the constitution' thing or never cared about it in the first place. Its the ones who identify themselves as Law Enforcement, rather than "peace officers".

When did I say it was the UN? Although, truth be said, our invited 'election-overseers' may see to it that it is indeed them...

(Let me stop RIGHT HERE with the police comments. This is not a cop-bashing thread and it wont ever be! OK! My point is just that if you think every Nazi was a ruthless, idealogically driven psycho you're wrong. Alot were just policemen, responsible to feed their kids and pay the mortgage and kept doing their job- maybe just helped get people to stand quietly in line; maybe just pushed papers- but helped the Nazi war machine just the same. They were convinced over time that the Jews really were dog-like criminals worth no respect, so arresting a criminal was not a crime nor even wrong. They were just enforcing the law, regardless of the merit of the law they were enforcing. They never thought about it that hard. They were as unlikely to quit in protest as any of our [generic] community police officers would. i.e. not very. Lets just agree for now that not every police officer will quit, and there will be plenty doing the job when the time comes. OK? If you want to discuss it further, start a new thread. thanks, C-)

You'll be allowed, with your papers or national ID card, to walk the streets (except during curfew) and go to work (need those taxes to keep it going) and as long as you cause no trouble, it'll be the day-to-day grind. You may even get a hunting permit, one time only, so the shotgun you're allowed to keep at the armory may be the one you have when the time comes. Maybe....

And walking around with a long-arm recogniseable as 'foreign' is indeed a great way to get shot. So that handgun may be the one you'll be glad to have. Maybe...

But John Ross makes an excellent point that when the fighting starts, an expert marksman with a 50BMG, a can of good ammo, ina shoulder deep foxhole half a mile up the hill is THE MAN when the fighting starts. So when John Ross starts lighting 'em up with API rounds, where will you be?

Your own hill? You'll want a 50. Or maybe that 30-06 will do depending on the range.
You on your property 50 or so acres from the 'international biosphere' and the UN quartering in the cabin on it? A higher cap battle carbine will keep a squad busy as they close the distance.
Are you in your ground floor apartment cooking dinner? BG's (ok, FINE, blue helmets) in pairs running under your window to re-group at the corner, you'd decapitate a few with that 12ga before you had to make a run for it.
Are you walking the dog? and a solitary pair of BG's having a smoke 'real quick before the action' on the bench you're walking toward? That pistol in your coat might be the ticket. Are you now saying to yourself:
"Sure glad I read cpileri's thread in 2004 and got some common equipment and a bunch of ammo hidden away. I'd have been out of ammo for my 357 SIG long ago. but i still have some 9mm!"

Or perhaps you're saying: "Aw gee willikers, I used my last round of 7mm Magnum on that nice deer last season. Sure glad I could bum some 30-06 off of Chuck up the street. Thank God he read cpileri's thread!"

Now, I REEEEEEEEAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLY like the idea of everyoen having a laser rangefinder and ballistics charts in waterproof plastic stuck on each rifle. Them's GREAT ideas! If we can agree on calibers (easy) and platforms (obviously harder to do) we can even post all the necessary info right now right here! Then we know 12,000 of us already have it!

Kofi Annan gets cold sweats at night thinking that 12,000 guys, make that 12,000 FRIENDS, across the USA have arms to share and every single one of them has the friggin' ballistics already figured out! His soldiers DON'T!

(Hey Kofi, make that AT LEAST 12 thousand!)

Yeah, I'm sensing another warm fuzzy coming on...

C-
(there, that ought to help reinfuse some life into my current favorite thread)

 

[cpileri]

Why am I buying 9 again, cpileri?

"Well, gee whizz, cpileri. We're only going to need the one we'll need, or maybe our favorite, so why get them all?"

I say its because in YOUR community, all non-sporting guns were banned years ago. The only sporting gun left is the 12-ga pump.

And in YOUR community, local do-gooders have banned anything over .308 diameter. The legal and easy sources for your .311 and .45 etc bullets was gone way before now.

And YOUR community long ago made illegal any bullet capable of piercing a NIJ level II vest. That 22LR is the only semi-auto with a scope you have left.

YOUR community has 'gone from passive to active' enforcing of the ban on possession of handguns and you didn't want your kids to starve so you gave them up. But you still have that trusty 'sporting rifle'.

And YOUR community did a buy back of all 'military style' and 'assault' weapons. You didn't fall for that b.s but then they spent the rest of their budget on 'incentive based neighborhood watch proghrams' where they paid your neighbors to rat you out. So you got rid of those, too. But John Kerry had a shotgun, so they must be OK...

Is your community or state so perfect that no local ordinances like this will happen in 10 or howevermany years? I am not counting on it!

So NOW is the time, while we still can, to get them all! Better to have and not need than...

C-

 

[John Ross]

I said a .50 cal. CAN, full of .223, for the 3/8 MOA match AR15. This is a much better gun to have in 99% of war situations than a .50 BMG rifle.
(Although for some things, a match .50 bolt gun like my Ken Johnson 1/2 MOA 16-pounder would be priceless.)

I realize you seem excited about 12,000 people all having common hardware, but I think it's much less important than each person having good, accurate hardware, plenty of the proper ammo, and considerable SKILL.

When my friends and I prairie dog hunt, we take no shots under 250 yards as measured with a laser rangefinder. Our hit percentage is over 60%. A human is a much bigger target, and a thousand aimed shots would likely translate into 800 casualties. That's a LOT of shooting with only 30 lbs of my own ammo. I don't need to fire yours, I'll probably die from mortar fire long before I run out.

If your favorite pistol is a .357 SIG, have a thousand rounds of it put away. If they ban ammo, you won't be able to practice with it any longer, so that thousand rounds will easily last you until you die.

A suppressed .22 pistol will be one of the most useful guns to have for the situations you describe, such as the guy catching a smoke on the street.
An ASP Tactical Baton is almost as good. I like the airweight version.

JR

 

[cpileri]

my bad

"I said a .50 cal. CAN, full of .223"

So you did. My mistake.

Hey man, you describe some darn good shooting on those prairie dogs!

If yuo dont mind me asking, what Laser rangefinder do you use? do you recommend that one as well?

"800 casualties. ... I'll probably die from mortar fire long before I run out."

In your case I'll believe it!

Which brings up another thought I had. I sense a little ribbing going on about my harping on the vast numbers of our potential squad here (12 thousand). So here's why (in part) i emphasize the numbers:

In a past thread, the question was asked how Pol Pot's 30,000 police could terrorize a nation of 1 million people. but the same question could be asked as written in the Gulag Archipelago where one wonders what would have happened if every security operative was beaten to death with fists/ axes/ chairs and whatever else was at hand. What if????

Well, obviously the oppression would've died with the last dead thug!

So if John Ross takes out 800 before they get him... even if its a 1-to-1 ratio, we still win! but i'd rather have alot less heroes to immortalize and eulogize than that!
C-

 

[cpileri]

bad math

Uhh. I picked up on a small math error I made. What i should have said is we win if even 1-in-100 of the estimated 40,000,000 gun owners get ticked off enough to resist.
1% of 40 million is 400,000. Using Pol Pots ratio, a resistance 400,000 strong can probably keep upwards of 10 million jbt's from being the strong arm of a corrupt govt.
Eh, OK. I am just musing.
C-

 

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

The general concept is a good idea. Common ammunition, magazines, and spare parts would come in pretty handy.

But why go through the effort of tryiing to organize 10,000 gun owners to buy the same equipment? There's an easier way. There already exists, in the form of the military, a network that stockpiles weapons, ammo, parts, etc in the MILLIONS.

All you'd need is the same pieces as are in common use by the military of the day. Presently, that'd be an AR-15, a Beretta 92, and possibly an M1A. Even if you don't want to own one of those, at least get some practice with 'em. If you ever need to "borrow" one you'll know how to use it.

If you want other weapons, that's fine. But if you ever need to scrounge parts, magazines, etc then your best bet is going to be scrounging among the standard issue military weapons.


Or is there something I'm missing here?

 

[riverdog]

...My caliber choices are 22LR, 357 Magnum, 9x19mm, .223, 7.62x39, 308, 30-06, and 12ga. ...
So there it is, the list.
1. Ruger 10/22
2. S&W 686 (?)
3. Glock 17/19
4. AR-15
5. AK-variant
6. Rem 700 (in 308 and 30-06), and
7. 870 in 12ga

While I agree with the list of firearms, I would add the 1911 and .45 ACP to the lists simply because there are so many 1911's and other good .45 ACP pisyols in circulation. The only thing I don't agree with is the 7.62x39 rifle/caliber although I understand their popularity. When in the position of choosing which .357, I went with all four: S&W Mod 19, 27, 686 and the Ruger GP-100. I've got a 9mm Glock but I don't stock 9mm ammo, lots of other folks are doing that The way to stock ammo and parts is to determine what ammo and firearm you shoot the most normally and then buy lots of ammo for that. It won't be wasted waiting for Armageddon if you shoot it normally.

 

[biere]

The ruger gp100 is suppossed to be simpler to dismantle than the smith and wesson guns. I own a 686 and a gp100 but have not dismantled the 686 very far. The ruger is simple and I am ordering some common spare parts for it because I know I can keep it up and running by myself.

On the 22, I like a bolt action because it fires shorts, longs, and long rifle rounds. It is also virtually silent with cb rounds, either short or long, and I got rid of my bb gun after playing with some cb longs made by cci.

Overall, I am not about to have the largest percentage of my guns be for this list just because folks on this site think it is a good idea. I am keeping a few simple guns around. I am getting parts, books, tools, ammo, reloading components, and accessories for them.

If I am without a gun one day I suspect the black market will have something for sale. Just like it did yesterday, and today, and most likely will have tomorrow.

It is an interesting concept, one many militia groups have taken to a simple and smaller conclusion.

 

[fistful]

Or is there something I'm missing here?

Headless,
I don't agree with cplieri on this thread, but I've already explained that. However, what you might be missing is that the Grand Militia of the Free Republic of Gun Nuts would rather have it's own stockpiles than have to get them from American military, which may be hostile in this hypothetical situation. Like, you know, it might be, like, easier?

 

[iamkris]

The List:

1. Ruger 10/22 -- NO ALTHOUGH I USED TO OWN ONE
2. S&W 686 (?) -- NO AND NO .357s, ALTHOUGH IF I DID IT WOULD BE A PYTHON
3. Glock 17/19 -- NO AND MY 9x19 WOULD BE A HiPOWER
4. AR-15 -- OK, GOT ME THERE
5. AK-variant -- NO, BUT I HAVE AN SKS. I MAY OWN AN AK SOMEDAY
6. Rem 700 (in 308 and 30-06) -- FINE RIFLE BUT NO I DON'T HAVE ONE. I DO OWN PLENTY OF THOSE CALIBERS THOUGH
7. 870 in 12ga -- USED TO HAVE AN 870, FINE SHOTGUN.

Here's what I do have

Handguns:
• Para Ordnance P14.45 LDA Limited .45 ACP
• Bulgarian Makarov 9x18mm
• Tanfoglio Witness Tactical II .45 ACP
• Ruger Vaquero .45 Colt
• Ruger Vaquero .45 Colt
• Ruger Blackhawk .45 Colt
• Auto Ordnance 1911A1 .45 ACP
• Ruger MkII Target .22LR
• Pietta 1851 Navy .36 cal

Shotguns:
• Lanber 2097 12 ga
• Mossberg 500 Persuader 12 ga
• Remington 1100 12 ga
• Winchester 1897 12 ga

Rifles:
• CZ V22 AR upper 22 LR
• Tikka T3 .300 WSM
• BSA Lee-Enfield No 4 Mk 1, .303 British
• Springfield (Remington) 1903A3, .30-06
• DPMS CAR-15A3 5.56x45mm
• Swiss K31, 7.5x55 Swiss
• Pedersoli Sharps 1874 Billy Dixon .45-70 Gov't
• Mosin-Nagant 91/30 7.62x54R
• Springfield Armory M1 Garand .30-06
• Mosin-Nagant M44 7.62x54R
• Yugo SKS 59/66A1 7.62x39mm
• DSA STG58A Type 1, 7.62x51mm
• Rossi M92 .45 Colt
• Mauser 98K Israeli/Czech .308 Win
• Mossberg 46(a) .22 LR
• Mannlicher-Berthier M.1892 8mm Lebel
• Springfield 1873 Trapdoor .45-70 Gov't
• 1864 E Robinson .58 cal

Yes you listed the most common weapons...guess I'm not common.

 

[Bostonterrier97]

My choices would be:
Bolt Action Rifle in 30-06: Why? Bolt Actions are less prone to break, and 30-06 is a very common cartridge
Lever Action Rifle in 30-30: Why? it is very Common.
357 Magnum Revolver: Ruger GP-100. Why? 357 is very common and also can shoot a 38 special. Rugers are almost indestructable.
A pocket gun. (caliber: your choice.) Why? for situations where concealment is necessary.
Rifle in 22LR. Your Choice of Make & Manufacturer: Why? 22LR is Dirt Cheap, Common, and you can carry a lot of ammo which will cost you very little money.
A Rifle in 223 or 7.62x39mm.
A 12 Gauge Shotgun.

 

[threefeathers]

I took an hour to look at the comments and I see much commanality. Most of us have both a 9mm and a 45ACP in a semi of some kind. Most have a .357. Everyone has 22s. In rifles most have either a 7.62X39 or a 5.56 in some configuration. A substantial number have M-1 Garands. I will argue that a fairly substantial fighting platoon can be made of those with 30:06 weapons which will include both M-1s and bolt guns.

Another platoon could be made of 7.62X54 weapons, whether M-1As or bolt guns. Bunches of these folks have optical sights.

Another platoon would have those with 5.56 weapons.

A fourth platoon with 7.62X39.

Those with military experience would fall into shape rather quickly.

Personally I worry that without the draft there are so few with real military training that we would spend months trying to train a viable force.

With the draft every one would have commonality of training if not weapons.

 

[fistful]

With the draft every one would have commonality of training if not weapons.

Our forefathers used the militia to accomplish this purpose. Can we do the same? Can we overcome the changing times and establish respectable militia units? "The Second Amendment; America's Original Homeland Security

Hijack Alert!

 

[parados]

As we’ve seen in this thread most gun owners own at least one or two weapons that shoot the “standard†rounds listed. Those rounds, by virtue of being on this list, are also the most popular and plentiful. It actually doesn’t matter if we can agree on a weapon platform, (like 9mm Glocks or AR15 style rifles).

What matters is that 1) you are well trained in your weapon of choice, 2) you have sufficient ammunition to train with and provide for your defense and 3) you are at least familiar with the other common civilian and military weapons out there.

I agree 100% with standardized calibers - I have been sticking with NATO calibers myself because of the cost, effectiveness and abundant supply.

But I think what is even more important is that you choose a “set†of guns (I like the idea of four guns: Handgun, Shotgun, Rifle and .22) – and you train with them until you are as good as you can be. Training is WAY more important than weapon choice or even caliber choice.

If you have an oddball round but can shoot it better then 98% of your gun owning peers... well lets just say you won't have a problem getting supplied with whatever the "enemy" is using at the time. You'd just better know how to use it!

The IDEAL situation is standardized calibers, standardized weapon platforms and standardized training… but you know what you call that? An Army.

If we can get 1 out of 3 (standard calibers) plus ABOVE AVERAGE SKILL – we won’t have anything to worry about…

 

[parados]

Fear the man with one gun that he knows how to use well...

..not the guy with 15 that he thinks are "really neat"...